Getting faster in the rough stuff

[Paab]

So, My corner speed is steadily improving through practice, but I can't seem to break through a certain plateau in rough terrain. Acceleration hack, cupped out whoops and rollers, etc. Everytime I up the pace I get all out of shape and eventually highside myself, which slows me right back down. I ride a KX250F with FC suspension work. I have gone through the whole setup process, and have what I think is a decent baseline for my practice track.

I'm working on looking further up the track everywhere, but especially in the rough, fast bits. I'm standing on the balls of my feet, hips back, head and chest forward, pinching the bike. I just can't go as fast as I'd like. I find myself slowing a the beginning of the section, and accelerating through it. Every time I come into it hot, I get sideways and it's hard to overcome the roll off instinct, which makes it worse.

Any tips? What am I missing?

[dirtjumpordie]

I like to be a gear high when it gets really rough. Keep good form and just practice a lot. Maybe try some endurocross drills at home

[BDubb106]

Yep... I prefer to be a gear high when it gets really choppy as well. The lesser load on the motor helps to settle the bike down considerably which boosts confidence immensely and allows me to push harder through those sections!

[Paab]

Thanks, I'll experiment with that, but my bike feels even looser when I go a gear higher than I am now.

[Ringo25]

Get your bike setup working.

[Paab]

I'm working on it!!!

[temporarily_locked]

are you getting to ride with guys who are faster through these sections then you are?

It depends on what you mean by rough. Some situations you really have to be precise with how you work your front wheel, throttle. Other times you can just come in with as much speed as you can, stay neutral, on the gas and let the bike bang through it underneath you.

Got any pictures of the sections or type of section in question?

Edited May 13, 2013 by Die_trying

[Paab]

are you getting to ride with guys who are faster through these sections then you are?

It depends on what you mean by rough. Some situations you really have to be precise with how you work your front wheel, throttle. Other times you can just come in with as much speed as you can, stay neutral, on the gas and let the bike bang through it underneath you.

Got any pictures of the sections or type of section in question?

OK, I know POV footage sucks for analysis, but that's what I have. I'll try to get some static cam footage of these sections saturday.

http://youtu.be/navxboxC9Ok

[BDubb106]

It looked pretty good from the helmet cam footage but we can't see much.

Looks like you got a good start... but it looks like your arms are a little too rigid. Try loosening up just a little. Your arms should be pumping with the bike.

Keep in mind that Im just judging by a helmet cam vid so I could be way off base.

[Donjholt]

Never mind! Sorry the other guy was faster typing and said the same I was going to

Edited May 14, 2013 by Donjholt

[Hans Schmid]

Remember, the bike handles the best under power. The instant you chop the throttle everything goes to crap......like others said before, ride a gear high and keep a nice constant throttle through the rough stuff!

[Paab]

I'm going to get some footage from off bike. I'm OK through these sections, until I try entering them faster over those rises. Then everything does go to shit. It's always hard to see in vids, but these are deep, cupped, and unevenly spaced. I'm definitely tight on the bars because I'm getting pretty worked. But these thing hit so hard if you make the slightest mistake. Section one is curved too, making it extra tricky.

I will try a gear high and work on loosening my arms.

[tye1138]

The problem is, you don't enter the rollers with enough speed. In the MA sand, you can't let that front wheel down, you've gotta have that thing unloaded for mostly all of the section with the occasional tap. That means, you've gotta hit it hard, get the front light and "row".

[Paab]

Ya, I believe I stated that was my problem in the first post. What I'm looking for are solutions. If "enter faster" was a solution, I wouldn't be here. The spacing of these is so awkward, and the rises as you enter, plus the curve means that when I add speed, even if I hold it open, I get sideways in a hurry. I've highsided in both these sections so hard. Even though it's sand, when you slam into these things they feel like concrete. That's why I roll off before the rise, and only accelerate once I'm in them.

I know I need to add entry speed, I'm just missing something to do it.

[BDubb106]

Have you tried wheel tapping and doubling combinations? A track I ride when I head to SC has some uneven sand rollers, kinda like the texas 12 pack but much smaller, and the only way I can get through them with any significant speed is to do some weird combos. I don't remember the exact sequence but it goes something like tap double tap tap double. It is pretty hard to remember with the long straight before them because you can pick up so much speed and you just want to hit it so fast. Its just something that you have to figure out by trying different things.

It is extremely hard to do what I described in the sand and I often get out of shape, but when I hit it right... I can fly through that section. The one thing that usually allows me to save it is staying hard on the throttle.

[Paab]

Yes, I think you're on it. Going in reverse direction, I do a tap, double, double, tap combo and it's quick and predictable. I haven't got a particular strategy dialed going in this direction, but I think that's what I should work on. Skimming these is not really in the cards due to weird spacing.

[tye1138]

Edit:

Yea, I like the doubling idea... If you got more speed entering the section, you can hit that single and then double them.

Its that entrance speed which is the problem. How do you fix that? Pin the damn throttle to the stop!!!

Edited May 14, 2013 by tye1138

[Paab]

The bike will not be going straight if I give it a handful out of any corner in this sand. Jumping that first one seems easy, but when you are sideways and touch the second one things get hairy quickly. The slick surface means that the throttle doesn't straighten the bike out as much as in other types of soil. This place is notoriously tough to go fast at.

I know it's hard to armchair coach any section you haven't ridden, but thanks for the ideas and save the patronizing, it's simple crap.

[dirtjumpordie]

Is it just a slow section? Are there riders passing you all the time there? If so, then just ask them what they do, video tape them doing it and compare it to a video of you doing it.

[BDubb106]

Yes, I think you're on it. Going in reverse direction, I do a tap, double, double, tap combo and it's quick and predictable. I haven't got a particular strategy dialed going in this direction, but I think that's what I should work on. Skimming these is not really in the cards due to weird spacing.

Yep I think your on to something now. I work on these sections all the time at different tracks I go to. I beat them into my head. I can pretty much look at a set of whoops or rollers and know how to hit them and be pretty quick the first time. As they develope I almost always find something faster so I adjust and keep at it until I figure out the best way to hit them. Once you get the hang of figuring those rhythms out, it becomes rather easy. The easiest way is to start thinking of them as a rhythm section rather than a whoop section. It really helped me to start thinking of them like that.

Some of them you will be fast enough to blitz them and skim across the top but that is often not the case for most amateurs, esp in the sand!

Edited May 14, 2013 by BDubb106