Bike dies when blipping? Also, hydrolock?

[dave...]

Recently purchased 08 SM, 3x3, JD kit, Yosh pipe. I've had numerous issues in the past when the bike would die when coming to a stop, slowing down, or taking off in the mornings, so I've gotten into the habit of giving a few test blips before each ride.

 

I changed my oil today. When I was warming up the bike and checking the oil level, as per habit I gave a few quick blips with clutch pulled in and sure enough the bike died several times. Is this normal? It seemed more frequent during quick successive blips.

 

I had less issues when I set the idle a little higher but I felt it was a bit too high compared to many other drz's on youtube, and the fueling didn't seem correct. After tuning the fuel screw a bit, it seemed to run a little smoother so I backed down the idle to around 1600-1800rpm (no tach, just going by ear).

 

Also, should there be a bit of friction when moving the bike in gear and clutch pulled in? Definitely noticeable compared to moving it in neutral. Or is this a sign of gas in the cylinder? When I took the carb apart before, I may have scratched the inside bore of the float valve seat when I tried to remove it with some needle nose pliers before I realized what I had just done. I should have replaced it then and there but it's $60 and I'm a cheap bastard that should know better.

Edited August 31, 2013 by dave...

[ohgood]

Recently purchased 08 SM, 3x3, JD kit, Yosh pipe. I've had numerous issues in the past when the bike would die when coming to a stop, slowing down, or taking off in the mornings, so I've gotten into the habit of giving a few test blips before each ride.

 

I changed my oil today. When I was warming up the bike and checking the oil level, as per habit I gave a few quick blips with clutch pulled in and sure enough the bike died several times. Is this normal? It seemed more frequent during quick successive blips.

 

I had less issues when I set the idle a little higher but I felt it was a bit too high compared to many other drz's on youtube, and the fueling didn't seem correct. After tuning the fuel screw a bit, it seemed to run a little smoother so I backed down the idle to around 1600-1800rpm (no tach, just going by ear).

 

Also, should there be a bit of friction when moving the bike in gear and clutch pulled in? Definitely noticeable compared to moving it in neutral. Or is this a sign of gas in the cylinder? When I took the carb apart before, I may have scratched the inside bore of the float valve seat when I tried to remove it with some needle nose pliers before I realized what I had just done. I should have replaced it then and there but it's $60 and I'm a cheap bastard that should know better.

 

 

check your float height , if it's too high, you'll flood it on decel, like what your symptoms are. 

 

if the idle is too low, and the mixture too rich, ya, it will die when blipped. 

 

yes, there is a lot of friction from the clutch plates sticking on a COLD BIKE, a little less with a warm bike, and none if it's in neutral. completely normal. 

 

any nicks /scratches of the float needle's seat means it will leak, and will fill the cylinder, eventually. could be 4 minutes, could be 4 days, but it will, and contaminate the oil/clutchpack. 

[dave...]

check your float height , if it's too high, you'll flood it on decel, like what your symptoms are.

if the idle is too low, and the mixture too rich, ya, it will die when blipped.

yes, there is a lot of friction from the clutch plates sticking on a COLD BIKE, a little less with a warm bike, and none if it's in neutral. completely normal.

any nicks /scratches of the float needle's seat means it will leak, and will fill the cylinder, eventually. could be 4 minutes, could be 4 days, but it will, and contaminate the oil/clutchpack.

Thanks. By float needle, are you referring to the long jet needle beneath the top diaphragm cover? Or are you referring to the float valve at the bottom float chamber?

Also, would a lot of popping during decel be indicative of the condition you are describing?

[BurnCycle]

Float valve needle inside the float bowl. Between the two floats. The needle has a rubber tip. If grooved or scratched it will leak. Check and or replace the little o-ring and seat with it too. Float height of 13mm for BSR36 Mukuni.

[dave...]

Float valve needle inside the float bowl. Between the two floats. The needle has a rubber tip. If grooved or scratched it will leak. Check and or replace the little o-ring and seat with it too. Float height of 13mm for BSR36 Mukuni.

It is at the 3rd clip position, 1600 ft. So you are suggesting I try position 1 or 2?

[Craigo]

Only be concerned with what it's doing when you're riding it...standing free revving is not an indicator for correct jetting...

 

With open pipe blue needle clip 3 would be the leanest needle setting to use, mostly blue clip 4 is best....

use a 160 main jet, 22.5 pilot jet with extended fuel screw or 25 pj with stock screw..

[dave...]

Only be concerned with what it's doing when you're riding it...standing free revving is not an indicator for correct jetting...

With open pipe blue needle clip 3 would be the leanest needle setting to use, mostly blue clip 4 is best....

use a 160 main jet, 22.5 pilot jet with extended fuel screw or 25 pj with stock screw..

That is what I was originally thinking and I was going to try positions 4 or 5. But I could see the point about flooding on decel might be reasonable. The bike while on the throttle runs great for the most part with the exception of some jerkiness at the lower revs (feels like inconsistent fueling), and of course the ocassional dying as I come to a stop which is what I am trying to resolve.

I should've checked the main jet size while I had it open. The carb is always such a bitch to remove. Can I just unscrew the the top and remove the needle with the carb still on the bike if I want to change clip positions?

Edited October 27, 2013 by dave...

[dave...]

I tested the 2nd clip position today and noticed the following observations:

- Using full choke to start sounded awful. It was inconsistent all throughout and it never got any better with longer use.
- Riding it did feel smoother but at the expense of feeling like it had less hp, almost as if I needed another gear compared to before. Took it to a normally empty stretch of road to top it out to see how it would perform on the freeway and did a whopping 83mph indicated. Of course a CHP patrol car was just hanging out there and I thought I would be cited for sure. But luckily he didn't seem to care. I would have been in big do do if I was on my GSXR though. DRZ: 1, GSXR: 0
- Felt very much improved as far as my original problems go. Whereas before the bike would take a while for the revs to drop after blipping the throttle, now the drop is pretty immediate probably reinforcing the flooding the carb on decel theory. No issues with dying at stops and I don't suspect there will be.

 

I don't care for the perceived power drop. Is flooding on decel, if that is the culprit, unavoidable at the lower clip positions?

Will try clip position 4 next.

Edited October 28, 2013 by dave...

[dave...]

What order does the clip, plastic spacer, and washer go on the needle? I would have thought the order would be, from top to bottom: the spring, any spacers if needed, and then the clip. However, on my carb w/ DJ kit (bike was purchased used), the order is: spring, clip, plastic spacer, washer. Does this sound right?

 

While I haven't tried the 4th position yet, as it stands, I would think a position between 2 and 3 would be spot on considering 2 has the inconsistent choke operation and 3 dies sometimes at stops or blips.

[Craigo]

from the top down = thin washer , clip , plastic spacer , thick washer 

[dave...]

from the top down = thin washer , clip , plastic spacer , thick washer 

Hmm. I only have one washer on mine. Maybe I'll pick up a JD kit since I heard they are more adjustable as far as settings go. Do they include all the proper washers/spacers? And is it the stage 1 kit that I need?

Edited October 28, 2013 by dave...

[Craigo]

Hmm. I only have one washer on mine. Maybe I'll pick up a JD kit since I heard they are more adjustable as far as settings go. Do they include all the proper washers/spacers? And is it the stage 1 kit that I need?

 

 

You want the JDS005 jet kit for mikuni carb....Jd is suitable for modified air box and open pipe and any other engine mods you might envisage... JD Jetting Jet Kit S/SM and I would also look at the ThumperTalk Fuel Mixture Screw

[dave...]

You want the JDS005 jet kit for mikuni carb....Jd is suitable for modified air box and open pipe and any other engine mods you might envisage... JD Jetting Jet Kit S/SM and I would also look at the ThumperTalk Fuel Mixture Screw

I already have the TT extended fuel screw but thanks for the JD kit link. When the weather clears up, I'll do some more testing with the jetting. If different clip settings do not resolve the issues, then I'll have to decide between JD or go for the FCR 39 conversion kit through the TT store.

[Craigo]

I already have the TT extended fuel screw but thanks for the JD kit link. When the weather clears up, I'll do some more testing with the jetting. If different clip settings do not resolve the issues, then I'll have to decide between JD or go for the FCR 39 conversion kit through the TT store.

 

If you're after performance just go with the performance carb.....which of course is the Fcr... ?

[dave...]

If you're after performance just go with the performance carb.....which of course is the Fcr... ?

 

If it were only that easy... but it's $600, lol. I guess the question then is what do you get for that money besides 5 hp?

[Craigo]

If it were only that easy... but it's $600, lol. I guess the question then is what do you get for that money besides 5 hp?

 

Mate....IMO that's cheap bolt on grunt, though by itself probably closer to 4 than 5hp peak..and you get the increased throttle response....

 

Here is pre jetted buying option,,,http://www.sisnerosspeedworks.com/ssw-fcr-mx-kit

 

Many that have firstly did the jet kit thing for the stock paper weight had wished they had just saved their dollars and went for fcr conversion beforehand

Edited October 29, 2013 by Craigo 485sm

[dave...]

Many that have firstly did the jet kit thing for the stock paper weight had wished they had just saved their dollars and went for fcr conversion beforehand

Fair enough. I was saving my pennies for a steering stabilizer, but if messing with the needle clip settings doesn't fix the issue, I will go ahead and just go for the FCR since a steering stabilizer won't do much good if the bike is always breaking down.

[dave...]

Mate....IMO that's cheap bolt on grunt, though by itself probably closer to 4 than 5hp peak..and you get the increased throttle response....

Here is pre jetted buying option,,,http://www.sisnerosspeedworks.com/ssw-fcr-mx-kit

Many that have firstly did the jet kit thing for the stock paper weight had wished they had just saved their dollars and went for fcr conversion beforehand

Well, I broke the #$@&+% plastic tab on the diaphragm assembly (13500-38A10) that retains the needle stopper. The replacement part (#2; carburetor, rear) is $123. :-\ Does the FCR 39 carb conversion kit include that piece or is it required for the conversion?

www.chaparral-racing.com/oem-parts-model/SUZ/DR-Z400SM%20(2008)/ARt0tCdut7_S2JGSLzGSOQ2/sUQ-chimzUTx12oaigbM9Q2

Edited October 29, 2013 by dave...

[OverSquareEng]

In the TT store the slide is only $60 (it is only the slide doesn't include the diaphragm), and you can get the diaphragm and ring for another $30 if you wanted new ones. IMO still a lot of money to spend on the stock carb, but at least it will get you running again.

 

Under your vehicle and in the carburetor section in the TT store it is:

The slide is reference # 16; part # 13501-29FA0

The diaphragm reference # 15

The ring reference # 17

 

 

 

Does the FCR 39 carb conversion kit include that piece or is it required for the conversion?

No, the FCR carb will replace the entire Mikuni BSR 36 carb.

[dave...]

In the TT store the slide is only $60 (it is only the slide doesn't include the diaphragm), and you can get the diaphragm and ring for another $30 if you wanted new ones. IMO still a lot of money to spend on the stock carb, but at least it will get you running again.

Under your vehicle and in the carburetor section in the TT store it is:

The slide is reference # 16; part # 13501-29FA0

The diaphragm reference # 15

The ring reference # 17

No, the FCR carb will replace the entire Mikuni BSR 36 carb.

$60 I can do. Thanks! :-)

Also, are the thin and thick washers mentioned above in Craig's post referenced as parts 6 and 8?

Edited October 29, 2013 by dave...