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excellent info on clutchless shifting.. and how/why it works.

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although this is narrated and shown by a mechanic for the motoGP CRT team of Collin Edwards, the transmission/clutch is exactly the same in a dirt bike. clutchless shifting, 500-600 times a race, no problem. But more importantly for a forum discussion, HOW it works and why.. for those offroad riders looking to save the energy of using a clutch, a blip of the throttle is the way to do it. it may take some time to get to work like butter, but with practice you can do clutchless shifts up and down through the gearbox on a dirt bike without the clutch. there are times when a clutch is needed of course, but this shows it can be done..

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8z9kEkOfelw&feature=youtu.be

Edited by MELK-MAN

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Edward Collins is a good guy, but I'm jealous for so many reasons.  Imagine being able to change transmissions depending on the track.  Imagine being able to ride that fast.  I love watching moto GP.

Okay, clutchless shifting is probably a good idea too.

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Edward Collins is a good guy, but I'm jealous for so many reasons.  Imagine being able to change transmissions depending on the track.  Imagine being able to ride that fast.  I love watching moto GP.

Okay, clutchless shifting is probably a good idea too.

 

I really would like to the Collin Edwards "Boot Camp".. that looks like a ton of fun.

cassette type transmissions are pretty cool. never used one or needed one for the club level racing i do, but very cool item regardless.

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I really would like to the Collin Edwards "Boot Camp".. that looks like a ton of fun.

cassette type transmissions are pretty cool. never used one or needed one for the club level racing i do, but very cool item regardless.

My friend got up the nerve to say, "hi" to Edwards at the Airport.  They ended up talking for about a 1/2 hour.

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Yep so its entirely possible if you can replicate a dedicated electronic shifting device with the fail safe method of "blipping the throttle" 600 times a race,

 

but like said at @2:50 you screw it up a few times and its time for a gearbox rebuild.

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Yep so its entirely possible if you can replicate a dedicated electronic shifting device with the fail safe method of "blipping the throttle" 600 times a race,

 

but like said at @2:50 you screw it up a few times and its time for a gearbox rebuild.

 

he was discussing DOWNshifting at that point..

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he was discussing DOWNshifting at that point..

 

No, it was upshifting. He was talking about the device that cut the power so the shift could be made. This takes the load off the transmission (like pulling the clutch) so the shift can be made.

Edited by mx317

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.. NO .. I will say it again, he is discussing DOWNSHIFTING at that point. He starts talking about the downshift process at the 2:18 mark or so in fact "close the throttle".. and talks about the ECU "auto-blipping" the throttle and opening the butterflys. He even pulls UP on the gear shift pedal to further demonstrate what he's talking about. (these bikes are "GP" shift pattern, push down for upshift pull up for downshift).

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.. NO .. I will say it again, he is discussing DOWNSHIFTING at that point. He starts talking about the downshift process at the 2:18 mark or so in fact "close the throttle".. and talks about the ECU "auto-blipping" the throttle and opening the butterflys. He even pulls UP on the gear shift pedal to further demonstrate what he's talking about. (these bikes are "GP" shift pattern, push down for upshift pull up for downshift).

Watch it at 1:50. You can say it again all you want, but you are not listening.

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You can screw up the gearbox either way, but for anyone who's actually tried... clutch-less upshifts are really easy once you have the procedure down.  Once your ready to shift (it's usually easier in higher gears and RPMs), place toes under shifter, apply slight upward pressure to shifter, in one quick motion reduce throttle slightly (crack it back a 1/16-1/8") increase pressure on shifter (so it shifts) and get back on the throttle.  If done right, you end up with a very quick and smooth gear change.  I've tried a few downshifts and it works too, but I'll stick with pulling in the clutch for downshifts and rev-matching.

Edited by bmwpowere36m3

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Watch it at 1:50. You can say it again all you want, but you are not listening.

 

 .. what are you trying to imply the guy is saying in the video. Tell it to me in your own words. I think you are taking a comment out of context, and are not hearing what he's saying before and after..

Edited by MELK-MAN

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What he is saying is there is an ignition cutout on the shifter that allows upshifts without letting off the throttle. He talks about downshifts after this.

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What he is saying is there is an ignition cutout on the shifter that allows upshifts without letting off the throttle. He talks about downshifts after this.

 

 

yes..I know! Quickshifters have been around on roadrace bikes for over a decade! (I personally have roadraced for a decade this season, My AM year i didn't have one).

This device (quick shifter)  has allowed the clutchless FULL THROTTLE upshifts all this time. You still use the clutch on DOWNshifts..as he explains..  I'm not really sure what you and i are going back and forth about.

 

The entire POINT of me posting this, as to show how and why a dirt bike transmission can and does allow clutchless upshifts. You don't have to use a quickshifter to do clutchless upshifts. You just can't stay full throttle and do clutchless upshifts. You need a slight roll off of the throttle so the trans is unloaded. This is what the quickshifter does.. it interrupts the ignition (or cuts fuel on some) so the trans is unloaded but allows you to stay FULL throttle !

we got it now???

Edited by MELK-MAN
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yes..I know! Quickshifters have been around on roadrace bikes for over a decade! (I personally have roadraced for a decade this season, My AM year i didn't have one).

This device (quick shifter)  has allowed the clutchless FULL THROTTLE upshifts all this time. You still use the clutch on DOWNshifts..as he explains..  I'm not really sure what you and i are going back and forth about.

 

The entire POINT of me posting this, as to show how and why a dirt bike transmission can and does allow clutchless upshifts. You don't have to use a quickshifter to do clutchless upshifts. You just can't stay full throttle and do clutchless upshifts. You need a slight roll off of the throttle so the trans is unloaded. This is what the quickshifter does.. it interrupts the ignition (or cuts fuel on some) so the trans is unloaded but allows you to stay FULL throttle !

we got it now???

I think we both had it all along, it just got lost in communcation somehow. :thumbsup:

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