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'01 CR250R Showa Shock Revalve Shim Stack Info Request

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I have my Showa shock torn down right now for service and wanted to re-valve it while I had it apart. I'm looking for suggestions. I NEVER ride MX. I am only a Hare Scramble & woods racer. I weigh about 230 with gear. I am a mid C pack rider, but trying to get faster. Tied for 3rd in points right now in my series. 

 

On to the "wish" list. I would like to have the initial part of the stroke more plush and then get progressively firmer further into the stroke. I would like to keep the suspension up in the stroke. I DEFINITELY have to reduce the HSC as on hard hits the rear suspension basically locks up solid and donkey kicks me hard enough that it broke the subframe this weekend while I was traversing rollers, and previously caused me to crash about 2 months back

 

Here is the shock shim stack layout:                                          

Piston (Low speed compression then high speed)

44 @ 200  X 8                                                         

44 @ 150  X 4                                                          

37 @ 150                                                                 

30 @ 150  Cross Over                                            

42 @ 200                                                                 

40 @ 200                                                                 

38 @ 250                                                                 

36 @ 250                                                                 

34 @ 250                                                                 

32 @ 250                                                                 

30 @ 250                                                                 

28 @ 300                                                                 

26 @ 300                                                                 

24 @ 300                                                                 

22 @ 300                                                                 

30 @ 300 X 2                                                           

 

Rebound

23 @ 300

24 @ 300

25 @ 300

26 @ 300

27 @ 300

28 @ 300

30 @ 300

32 @ 300

34 @ 300

36 @ 300

38 @ 300

40 @ 250

26 @ 100 (Cross Over-HSR above, LSR below)

40 @ 200

40 @ 200

40 @ 200

 

On the compression I was thinking about this:

44 @ 200 X 6  (factory was X8)

44 @ 150 X 2  (factory was X4)

30 @ 150 (cross-over moved up 1 shim location & deleting the 37 @ 150)

42 @ 200

38 @ 200

34 @ 250

32 @ 250

28 @ 300

24 @ 300

30 @ 300

Then stack the unused shims under here in ascending order of size.

 

I have previously revalved my forks with recommendations made from this site so I thought I would give the shock a try. I have been back into the forks twice, and now they are PERFECT! I expect that I will have to go back into the shock a couple times to fine tune it so I'm really asking for help just getting into the ball park.

 

Old settings were: rebound at 7 clicks out, and the HSC was turned out about 3 clicks before full out. The LSC was set @ 17 clicks out and I still felt every single root or rock that the back tire contacted. I think part of this was related to the fact I had a 5.4 shock spring on it which was too soft and to get the sag right I had the spring compressed to about 9.25". Now I have a 5.6 spring that is going back in with the revalve and I should have more travel before the spring coil binds.

 

Any help would be greatly appreciated.

Edited by Kawabuggy

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i sugggest that stack 

44.20x14

34.15

30.10

44.20

42.20

40.20

38 -36-34-32-30-28-26-24-22-20 all 0.20

 

on rebound 

40.20x4

26.10

40.25

38.30

36-34-32-30-28-26-24.30 all 0.30

 

machine piston band to 50.15 and use 10 bar

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Cardinale thanks for the fast response. I was rather hoping I could get away with reshuffling the existing shims. If not feasible, I'll break down & buy the shims and try the stack as you suggest. Best case, it works. Worse case, it needs more tuning & I'll have extra shims on hand at that point. 

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+ R for heavier spring & piston band mod.  That kick might be the result of bottoming as well.

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Okay, what is the piston band mod? Is this something I can do in a small shop? Does it require a lathe or mill?  I see that MX Tech sells them but they have several different ones listed for 50MM shocks.

 

Cardinale I see that you are ADDING more 44 X 200 shims to the LSC side & a larger Cross over.. Will this make the LSC more plush? It looks to me like it will be at least as stiff as the factory shim stack, if not more.. I definitely need a more plush (softer) LSC set up.

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Okay I found where I can buy the MXT LFPR and have ordered one. I thought my Pivot Works shock rebuild kit came with a thinner design band but it was just a seal.

Edited by Kawabuggy

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Mx&SX thanks for the positive reference. I have the MXT LFPR ordered and will be installing it once it gets here. I also made contact with JM Racing here in the Houston, TX area and I'll be ordering shims from him.

 

At this point, it's just a waiting game for new shims, and new band to arrive. I have everything completely disassembled ready to be washed, dried, and assembled. I also have a new Factory Connection 5.6 shock spring, and Pivot Works shock rebuild kit on-hand. Also ordered a new sub-frame... Waiting on parts... FUN!

 

At least I have a 2nd bike to ride while I wait for parts.

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Ale your rebound stack looks very light ?

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Those are the factory shim stacks that you see. I agree that rebound is really light. I had it dialed in at only 7 clicks out from full in. I don't like a lot of rebound so I may have to add some shims into it.

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+ R for heavier spring & piston band mod.  That kick might be the result of bottoming as well.

+68.  I am a decent C rider on the same terrain as Kawa and am 196. I use a 5.5. I am betting bottoming is the real culprit. Exact same bike.

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YHGeorge I think you are correct about it bottoming out. If you read above you'll see that I really had to crank down on the spring pre-load to get to the correct sag numbers. Once I got the bike to the point where the race sag was correct, the spring was compressed to 9.25". So, not only was I bottoming out easily due to a spring that was too soft, I was also hitting coil bind on the spring. Now, hopefully the 5.6 spring will be good.  Even with that super soft spring in it you can feel every single thing that the rear tire rolled over. As soft as the spring was, it translated through the rear suspension, through the seat, and into my buttocks like being struck with a paddle. This is why I wanted to go after the valving now as well.

 

 

I'll have to recheck my fork sag after getting the back of the bike corrected and may have to go up on spring rate in the forks again as well. I think I'm running .45's, or .46's in the front. The front end of the bike is PERFECT as it is right now. I don't want to change anything relative to how the front end feels, or how it handles.

 

This has been a great learning experience so far. Just waiting on parts...... & waiting....... & waiting.... 

Edited by Kawabuggy

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Mx&SX thanks for the positive reference. I have the MXT LFPR ordered and will be installing it once it gets here. I also made contact with JM Racing here in the Houston, TX area and I'll be ordering shims from him.

 

At this point, it's just a waiting game for new shims, and new band to arrive. I have everything completely disassembled ready to be washed, dried, and assembled. I also have a new Factory Connection 5.6 shock spring, and Pivot Works shock rebuild kit on-hand. Also ordered a new sub-frame... Waiting on parts... FUN!

 

At least I have a 2nd bike to ride while I wait for parts.

 

No Problem. 

 

If you can, I'd recommend getting the Factory Connection HSC spring too. They are about 15 bucks or so depending where you get it. 

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Okay, just so we are clear, you are saying there is another spring somewhere inside the shock? Mine does not have another spring anywhere relative to the shim stack, or on the shock shaft.. What is the FC HSC???

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Okay, just so we are clear, you are saying there is another spring somewhere inside the shock? Mine does not have another spring anywhere relative to the shim stack, or on the shock shaft.. What is the FC HSC???

Nope, there is none. That is in the forks.

Edited by YHGEORGE

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Yes, I'm familiar with the ICS spring in the forks having been through my forks recently, but since this post is about the shock, and he's talking about an HSC spring I guess I need clarification on what spring he is talking about. There is no other spring inside this shock. I have read that some of the other shocks have bottoming springs inside them and maybe this is what he was referring to. For the record, the 01's don't have any additional spring inside the shock, only Inner Chamber Springs in the forks.

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MY stack have enought low speed damping for make rear high and less high speed damping for absorb big hit , also at fast speed .

about the rebound for woods or harescrambler you need a fast rebound and use it around 12-14 out. if you run 16-18 you will have too much bleed in compression. i race also on woods and tested stack on track

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There is a spring inside the HSC housing. This is the assembly that is above the nitrogen chamber. Its a little harder to get the though. Its only about the diameter of a quarter and about an inch long. 

 

Here is a picture: http://www.factoryconnection.com/shopping/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=2_6&products_id=25

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There is a spring inside the HSC housing. This is the assembly that is above the nitrogen chamber. Its a little harder to get the though. Its only about the diameter of a quarter and about an inch long. 

 

Here is a picture: http://www.factoryconnection.com/shopping/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=2_6&products_id=25

Yep, you are right. But I have serious doubt that even many highly skilled riders would notice a change in that spring.  But maybe it is the missing link to my search for perfection. I doubt it and after my last revalve I have sworn off ever touching it again, I still think the stiff frame is the greatest problem area. 

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The spring makes a decent change as it affects the hs control a good amount , ale interesting to know woods can run that much lighter , I didn't expect that

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