2013 hotcam stage 2

Has anyone installed a hotcam in there 450 themselves? I'm about to put one in my 2013 and was woundering if it is a pain. I have rebuilt my bikes in the past bit never messed with switching the decompressor arm. Just looking for some tips I guess

Has anyone installed a hotcam in there 450 themselves? I'm about to put one in my 2013 and was woundering if it is a pain. I have rebuilt my bikes in the past bit never messed with switching the decompressor arm. Just looking for some tips I guess

 

I'd dry run it and make sure the cam will spin without the lobes making contact with the head or cap. There's minimal clearance in there for the lobes.

its easier to do with the head off the engine and the valves out.  

Some cams I've seen will make contact.

 

Check valve clearances while you're dry running everything, and expect to have to reshim your valves.

 

I've installed a stage 2's in the 09 -12's without clearance problems, but I think the 13 head is different. 

 

I had clearance issues with our 13, but we weren't using a stage 2 cam.

Edited by nesc103y

It is easy do not over think it

Just do it

There's 3 pieces to the decompression assy. The weight , the plunger, and the spring.

You'll be able to slide the end bearing off and work it around the decompression lever.

you'll see a small hole under the bearing race where a retainer pin sits.

Push the retainer pin out with a piece of safety wire or something similar.

The decompression weight will now pull out with the spring.

Once you have the weight out, the plunger should fall out.

The plunger is held in place by the weight.

Just reverse this to install it in the new cam. Make sure everything moves freely before you reinstall the cam in the head.

 

There might be 2 sets of timing marks on the cam sprocket. be sure to read the instructions and use the correct timing marks.

It is easy do not over think it

Just do it

 

Cam swaps are an easy job to do. But if done wrong the end result will be catastrophic.

I'd rather over think it than under think it.

I'd dry run it and make sure the cam will spin without the lobes making contact with the head or cap. There's minimal clearance in there for the lobes.

its easier to do with the head off the engine and the valves out.  

Some cams I've seen will make contact.

 

Check valve clearances while you're dry running everything, and expect to have to reshim your valves.

 

I've installed a stage 2's in the 09 -12's without clearance problems, but I think the 13 head is different. 

 

I had clearance issues with our 13, but we weren't using a stage 2 cam.

damn I hope there isn't a clearance issue. Hotcams told me it would drop right in no problems. I guess we will see. Do you think I will have to remap it again? It's already been done by Eddie for my pipe.

It's a simple job.

The tiny center punch dents are the timing marks you use on the cam gear.

You shouldn't have any clearance problems and the shimming should be pretty close, if not the same.

The map is the same, unless Eddie has done some changes in the last 8 months.

Jason

It may breather easier, increasing the  vacuum in the carb (venturi), leading to a slightly rich condition??  I would be a bit worried about slightly week valve springs and a bit of valve "float" that could lead to piston contacting valve.  IMO change the springs or measure their free length and do a load test on them. Not sure if your manual specifies a load test.  For this test compress springs with a given force and measure the compressed length compare against spec.  Also do not rotate the engine clockwise since the lobes of the cams are designed to contact the tappets while rotating counterclockwise.   Also when you are messing around do not rotate the engine unless the cams are perfectly timed relative to TDC, as specified in the manual.  A simple bench test with out heeding this detail could lead to a bent valve!!!

 

And framebreaker is right.  It is a simple job.  Just don't leave slack on the cam chain since it can fall off the teeth on the crank and you will have to spend a few hours :banghead:   trying to jig it back on under the flywheel where you can't see it, or remove the flywheel to put it back on!  Also apply moly greasemixed with oil to the cam lobes and cam journal (unless their are bearings on either side of the cam) or what ever the manual recommends for reassembly since start up and good lube will be critical!!!

Edited by bikedad1

Has anyone installed a hotcam in there 450 themselves? I'm about to put one in my 2013 and was woundering if it is a pain. I have rebuilt my bikes in the past bit never messed with switching the decompressor arm. Just looking for some tips I guess

 

Moto,

 

I installed a Stage 1 Hotcam in my 09 450R and had to re-shim the intake and exhaust valves. The 09 service manual calls for 0.006 on the intake and 0.011 on the exhaust, with a +/- 0.001 on both. Also, there is two identical timing marks (dots/dashes) on the stage 1 cam sprocket; so be sure you are at TDC and all your timing marks line up. You also want to check the piston to valve clearances before final assembly. Clay on the piston works great for this with a good set of digital calipers. 

 

My intake valves were @ 0.008 with a loose fit, and the exhaust valves were at 0.012 with a snug fit. I had to lap some new shims down to attain a perfect 0.011 fit on the exhaust, and also had to lap one of the intake shims down to acquire a good 0.006 fit on the intake. 

 

Hope this helps. Good luck.

 

JL 

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Love the clay Idea.  how do you lapp shims?

Love the clay Idea.  how do you lapp shims?

 

I use clay to check piston to valve clearance on automotive (396/427/454) engines and bikes.. same concept. Can't go wrong when you combine close tolerances and high RPM's. 

 

Lapping shims are very easy, and achieves a machined fit every time. Just use some fine wet-sandpaper on a perfect machined flat surface. Also need some good quality digital calipers to make sure your shims are precise. Simply rub the shim in circular motions with slight finger pressure on wet sandpaper, and check with calipers every few minutes. It doesn't take long to lap 0.001 off the shim. Take your time, slight finger pressure, and even circular motions are key. Check with calipers every couple of minutes, more frequent as the tolerance gets close. If you lap too much material off, the shim is ruined.. however, if done right.. you will achieve a perfect machine "pinch fit" on the valve clearances. You can't hardly buy shims that will drop in with a perfect tolerance fit on all four valves. The clearances are often off 0.001/0.002 between the same INT/EXH valves. Lapping them is the only way to get a perfect machined fit. 

 

Piece of cake.. 

 

JL

It's a simple job.

The tiny center punch dents are the timing marks you use on the cam gear.

You shouldn't have any clearance problems and the shimming should be pretty close, if not the same.

The map is the same, unless Eddie has done some changes in the last 8 months.

Jason

good deal I think I can handle it. I hope there isn't any valve shim issues. Sofar my valves are spot on. The mapping was done in the spring so it will hopefully be fine. Man the way some are talking on here it sounds like a pain in the ass. The tech at hot cams assured me it will be a drop in and no shimming needed. Lets hope it all goes well. Thanks for the info

I thought that's what you ment, but man, I got criticized from my tradesman buddies from being too much of a "scientist" on my rebuilds and replacing parts that were OK!  Clearly I have met my match!  Unless you are the even cheaper than me LOL, but that's not possible!  So you setting your valves close to the tight end of the specified range, or the loose end, or the middle?

I thought that's what you ment, but man, I got criticized from my tradesman buddies from being too much of a "scientist" on my rebuilds and replacing parts that were OK!  Clearly I have met my match!  Unless you are the even cheaper than me LOL, but that's not possible!  So you setting your valves close to the tight end of the specified range, or the loose end, or the middle?

 

Bikedad,

 

You sound just like me.. I replace a lot of parts that are within limits, but it makes me feel and sleep better knowing I replaced all those nickel and dime parts if I already have something disassembled. 

 

On setting my valves, I like to shim them to a "snug" pinch-fit IAW the 09 450R Service Manual recommended clearances. INT - "0.006 and EXH - 0.011 +/- 0.001"

 

I think I have OCD when it comes to aviation and dirt bike maintenance... 

 

JL

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Cam swaps are an easy job to do. But if done wrong the end result will be catastrophic.

I'd rather over think it than under think it.

+1

Are those  bikes in your kitchen? :lol:  Now you have to teach me how to get the wife to agree to that :worthy:

Moto,

 

I installed a Stage 1 Hotcam in my 09 450R and had to re-shim the intake and exhaust valves. The 09 service manual calls for 0.006 on the intake and 0.011 on the exhaust, with a +/- 0.001 on both. Also, there is two identical timing marks (dots/dashes) on the stage 1 cam sprocket; so be sure you are at TDC and all your timing marks line up. You also want to check the piston to valve clearances before final assembly. Clay on the piston works great for this with a good set of digital calipers. 

 

My intake valves were @ 0.008 with a loose fit, and the exhaust valves were at 0.012 with a snug fit. I had to lap some new shims down to attain a perfect 0.011 fit on the exhaust, and also had to lap one of the intake shims down to acquire a good 0.006 fit on the intake. 

 

Hope this helps. Good luck.

 

JL 

Why not use solder? Much easier to measure. Lapping shims............ :rolleyes: 

Why not use solder? Much easier to measure. Lapping shims............ :rolleyes: 

 

Solder can move around on the piston and is not as reliable as molding clay. It could work, but not as good as clay. The clay can be pressed down onto the piston and will stay in place. Solder can move once the engine is assembled during rotation as it don't stick or adhere like clay. Also, you don't want any solder falling between the piston and cylinder wall. Could cause internal damage.   

 

JL

So you put the clay on, the piston, rotate the engine through a full rev and check the impressions right?  Just peel off the clay and measure?  Are you comfortable with simply valve spring free length as a measure of spring health, vs say that and a load test?  I worry about a bit of valve float under high RPM

So you put the clay on, the piston, rotate the engine through a full rev and check the impressions right?  Just peel off the clay and measure?  Are you comfortable with simply valve spring free length as a measure of spring health, vs say that and a load test?  I worry about a bit of valve float under high RPM

 

Bikedad,

 

I do not peel the clay off the piston, that will contort the clay and cause an inaccurate measurement. Leave the clay in place and simply measure the indention (thickness) with a digital depth micrometer. Very easy to do.

 

Regarding the spring health, that would depend on how old and how many hours your springs have on them. They should be checked and replaced if needed when you rebuild the top end. If you're not sure about the springs, I would certainly check and replace them if necessary with new ones to be on the safe side. Free length measuring can identify a weak spring, but not always. We do it on big block chevy (396, 427, 454) heads all the time.. the best way is to do a spring compression/load test. 

 

If you have any doubt, I would do a fresh valve job, and install some new springs, retainers, and hardened valve locks to be safe. If you ride against the rev limiter, you don't want to risk having any weak valve springs.

 

Hope this helps.

 

JL

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