getting more distance?

ok so me and my friend ride together and he can jump 2x further then me when we go the same speeds...

 

i even let him ride my bike and he could jump the same distance on it as his and i know we are going the same speed because i go 3rd gear and he said thats what he used. so how can i get more distance on my jumps like him?

Third gear is still vague.  Third gear pinned and third gear are completely different.  Try following your friend and matching speeds if you want to get the same distance.  

Too many variables. Weight of the rider, the bike, suspension setup all play into how a bike and rider jump. Similar speed but heavier rider and bike = shorter distance. Get your suspension dialed first, then just gradually work on hitting the jump at progressively higher speeds. Keep your throttle on all the way up the jump face as well.

Third gear is still vague.  Third gear pinned and third gear are completely different.  Try following your friend and matching speeds if you want to get the same distance.  

 i am 3rd gear pinned lol and im asuming he is to

Too many variables. Weight of the rider, the bike, suspension setup all play into how a bike and rider jump. Similar speed but heavier rider and bike = shorter distance. Get your suspension dialed first, then just gradually work on hitting the jump at progressively higher speeds. Keep your throttle on all the way up the jump face as well.

well i do weight like 30 pounds more then him lol... so what do i have to do to my suspension i have set my sag

weight won't play a role in how far you go other then resistance to drag which is negligible in mx cases.

 

From a physics stand point there are only two things that matter, vertical and horizontal velocity when leaving the lip, which are the components of the angle at which your leaving the face and your velocity.

 

So if a 50 lb 65 rider and a 250 lb 450 rider hit the same jump with the same speed and leave the face at the same angle, they are going to go the same distance. 

 

Having the suspension unload as you leave the face due to preloading can effectively change the angle at which you leaving the face (initial angle of your trajectory). In terms of vertical and horizontal components of your velocity, your increasing your initial vertical velocity, so it will take longer to reach your maximum height( which will be higher), before accelerating back downward. It's interesting because preloading should also cause a backward acceleration in the horizontal direction (assuming rebound force is acting close to normal from the final bike length of the face), which would result in a slight decrease in forward horizontal velocity to gain that larger initial vertical velocity.

Edited by Die_trying

weight won't play a role in how far you go other then resistance to drag which is negligible in mx cases.

 

From a physics stand point there are only two things that matter, vertical and horizontal velocity when leaving the lip, which are the components of the angle at which your leaving the face and your velocity.

 

So if a 50 lb 65 rider and a 250 lb 450 rider hit the same jump with the same speed and leave the face at the same angle, they are going to go the same distance. 

 

Having the suspension unload as you leave the face due to preloading can effectively change the angle at which you leaving the face (initial angle of your trajectory). In terms of vertical and horizontal components of your velocity, your increasing your initial vertical velocity, so it will take longer to reach your maximum height( which will be higher), before accelerating back downward. It's interesting because preloading should also cause a backward acceleration in the horizontal direction (assuming rebound force is acting close to normal from the final bike length of the face), which would result in a slight decrease in forward horizontal velocity to gain that larger initial vertical velocity.

ok so clearly my suspension is set wrong so how do i set it to be just right so i get to jump like him... like i said my sag is set but thats it

poorly set up suspension wouldn't effect distance, it would effect bike control leaving the face.

 

are you following behind him pacing him? If not you it's impossible to tell if your going the same speed as him. If you aren't going the same distance, you either aren't going the same speed or doing something different on the face.

poorly set up suspension wouldn't effect distance, it would effect bike control leaving the face.

 

are you following behind him pacing him? If not you it's impossible to tell if your going the same speed as him. If you aren't going the same distance, you either aren't going the same speed or doing something different on the face.

That is wrong.

weight won't play a role in how far you go other then resistance to drag which is negligible in mx cases.

 

From a physics stand point there are only two things that matter, vertical and horizontal velocity when leaving the lip, which are the components of the angle at which your leaving the face and your velocity.

 

So if a 50 lb 65 rider and a 250 lb 450 rider hit the same jump with the same speed and leave the face at the same angle, they are going to go the same distance. 

 

Having the suspension unload as you leave the face due to preloading can effectively change the angle at which you leaving the face (initial angle of your trajectory). In terms of vertical and horizontal components of your velocity, your increasing your initial vertical velocity, so it will take longer to reach your maximum height( which will be higher), before accelerating back downward. It's interesting because preloading should also cause a backward acceleration in the horizontal direction (assuming rebound force is acting close to normal from the final bike length of the face), which would result in a slight decrease in forward horizontal velocity to gain that larger initial vertical velocity.

That is wrong also...

o ya?

poorly set up suspension wouldn't effect distance, it would effect bike control leaving the face.

 

are you following behind him pacing him? If not you it's impossible to tell if your going the same speed as him. If you aren't going the same distance, you either aren't going the same speed or doing something different on the face.

im pinned open when i do it and also my friend can do these jumps half the speed of me and still clear them fine but i barley clear them when i go 2x faster

 

but when he goes fast he can jump really far over jumping it so what am i doing wrong for distance

Edited by 2012DRZ400SMer

Sounds like your body postioning is off. Take a video of him jumping that jump and then get someone to video you and watch it all or post them here,

My guess is you're actually not going the same speed as your friend when you leave the jump.  Unless the jump has a super-long run up to it the "follow me over it" can be deceiving, as acceleration up the face itself has a big affect on jumping distance.  I often judge how much throttle a new jump takes based on the sound of the bikes as they hit it.  A few weeks ago I was eyeing up a triple that the guys that were hitting it were absolutely pinned from the corner before until they left the face.  It didn’t look like it would take that much to clear it, but I was glad I hit it almost as fast as I could, since I just barely got my front tire over the landing.

My guess is you're actually not going the same speed as your friend when you leave the jump.  Unless the jump has a super-long run up to it the "follow me over it" can be deceiving, as acceleration up the face itself has a big affect on jumping distance.  I often judge how much throttle a new jump takes based on the sound of the bikes as they hit it.  A few weeks ago I was eyeing up a triple that the guys that were hitting it were absolutely pinned from the corner before until they left the face.  It didn’t look like it would take that much to clear it, but I was glad I hit it almost as fast as I could, since I just barely got my front tire over the landing.

well i dont know how he could be going much faster when im at the top of the rpms in 3rd

well i dont know how he could be going much faster when im at the top of the rpms in 3rd

Because he is lighter than you.  A heavier load on a bike with all else remaining constant will not travel as fast.  Think about you running with a toddler on your back versus running with an adult on your back.  This is an exaggerated analogy but you see the point.

well i dont know how he could be going much faster when im at the top of the rpms in 3rd

What bike are you riding and how big is the jump?

 

Tapped out in 3rd gear on any newer 250 or 450f bike will send you 70+ feet easily..That is really fast to hit a jump. If you come up short on a 3rd gear wide open jump you likely arent going to ride away from it...  High RPMS and High throttle are two different things. If you coast off a jump you wont go as high or far as if you accelerate off the lip. My guess is your friend has got more experience and his grabbing a little extra throttle going up the face of the jump where your cruising at what sounds like a high rpm, but your not really pinning the throttle.  (You can be high in the rpm range only giving the bike 1/4 throttle, but when you hit the jump face there is not enough power being made and the bike slows quickly)

Too many variables. Weight of the rider, the bike, suspension setup all play into how a bike and rider jump. Similar speed but heavier rider and bike = shorter distance. Get your suspension dialed first, then just gradually work on hitting the jump at progressively higher speeds. Keep your throttle on all the way up the jump face as well.

I agree, there are soo many variables.

I could say the OP's problem is not preloading, but then again if his forks are absorbing the jump face because its undersprung, that will make a huge difference. If you too far over the front taking off, that will also load up the front too much and not give you the rebound from the rear necessary to give you "pop" over the jump.

Most people who are excellent jumpers, don't put any stock in jumping, calling it the easiest part of riding. However, learning how to jump properly is a whole other skill because you're flying a bloody motorcycle for gosh sakes!

I agree with Wes, get the suspension dialed, then try it again.

Because he is lighter than you.  A heavier load on a bike with all else remaining constant will not travel as fast.  Think about you running with a toddler on your back versus running with an adult on your back.  This is an exaggerated analogy but you see the point.

 

Should you really be giving advice when you have a thread from yesterday where you say you had never touched a dirt bike until this month, and have only ridden for one hour at a time?

 

Regardless of weight, 10k RPM to the rear wheel is 10k RPM. Weight will affect acceleration to top speed in a given gear, but top speed is top speed regardless of weight. Top speed land racers ADD weight to help stability - and speed is not affected. His weight is not causing the jump distance difference. Suspension, real vs perceived speed, and technique along the jump face are all much more likely causes.

I agree, there are soo many variables.

I could say the OP's problem is not preloading, but then again if his forks are absorbing the jump face because its undersprung, that will make a huge difference. If you too far over the front taking off, that will also load up the front too much and not give you the rebound from the rear necessary to give you "pop" over the jump.

Most people who are excellent jumpers, don't put any stock in jumping, calling it the easiest part of riding. However, learning how to jump properly is a whole other skill because you're flying a bloody motorcycle for gosh sakes!

I agree with Wes, get the suspension dialed, then try it again.

welp for suspension i have to get it resprung and i dont have the money to buy the springs let alone the money to pay someone to install it

The key to learning to jump is to find ONE jump that you can hit over and over and over and over.  I personally think a 3.5 foot high, 27-30 degree jump face is ideal.  You can jump 25'....or you can jump 60'.  Do not build a landing...just jump to FLAT.  Yes...you CAN jump 60' to flat.... (learning to case hard and ride it out is VERY important)  Learn to hit this jump at 20 mph...and go 25 feet.  Learn to hit is at 20 mph...and go 35 feet.  Learn to hit it fast and go 60'.  Set up some flags or markers on your flat landing to give you something to shoot for.  You will very quickly develope distance calibration skills.

 

Just keep hitting the same jump over and over and over.  When you do laps at a track..and all the jumps are different...it is going to take a LOT longer to get a feel for this.  By learning to hit a medium sized jump hard...you will build the skills and confidence due to repitition.  You will find that once the skills are internalized...they will transfer over to other jumps quickly.  If, however, you are always hitting different faces...you will struggle to internalize the feel.  The simple truth is, if you do not have some property, and a way to build some specific drills...you ability to learn to ride well is going to be dictated by time.  The best you can do, is go to the track...and section it a lot.  This can be a real time killer, as getting on and off the track safely when it is crowded can be hard. 

 

All this advice about checking your suspension...blaming weight...etc...is way off base.  It is a waste of time.  The problem is not your suspension...or your weight...it is what you are doing with your body.  It can not be explained to you...because you do not yet have the ability to sense what your body is doing.  Build a learner jump like I described...and hit it 50,000 times.  FIFTY THOUSAND TIMES.  At that point...you have have about 2-3% of the jumping experience as an A/Pro level rider.  The answer is...there is no answer...other than putting in the work.  Get out there and ride.

Edited by Blutarsky

Preload your suspension on take off its a technique that takes practice ...seat bouncing is another way to get a little extra pop...and physical manipulation of the bike in air via brake and body movement can stretch it out a bit further....YouTube that shit for sure

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