2013 RS-4 Slip On Mapping

For those of you with the RS-4 slip on, which coupler are you using? I just installed the pipe with the normal coupler and it seems like I lost some bottom end power.

Go richer. I had the same issue when I out the 4.1 on my Rmz. The stock exhaust is restrictive. I though I was losing my mind. Put the quiet inswet in and bottom end power came back...I have a power commander v and started messing with the mapping. I ended up being richer on low throttle and top end. The power commander maps they provide are way off. The stock couplers only adjust air/fuel ratio by 13:1 rich 12.:5 standard and 12.1 lean. When you put an open can on this bike the air/fuel ratio leans out drastically. The bike will still run safely,but you lose power because the fuel radio is off. The rich coupler will get it close,but probably not close enough depending what fuel you use. Efi is tricky-especially when you start modding these things. Anything son to bike that flows more oxygen or exhaust will need more fuel.

That's pretty interesting.

I was playing around with fueling on the pim2 and went leaner up top (standard exhaust though).  When i get this cam business sorted out I'll have to start all over again with the fueling.

 

This is where i got to with a standard engine:

 

max map (shot 1).jpg

 

max map (shot 2).jpg

 

Which coupler do you have in max? These units just piggyback the stock ecu,so the coupler still comes into play. The coupler adjusts fuel approximately 10% richer or leaner. Depending on fuel and power characteristics you like-it can be different maps one person prefers to another. On a dyno,they aim for a constant air fuel ratio of around 12.5 or 13 but whatever makes power...makes power. I feel a dyno run is best after you have made a good map. Basically you can make a map 20% richer or leaner,swap map plugs and see which is better,then fine tune you map. If a bike is running healthy with clean porting,good compression and goof fuel-you can add a lot of fuel from 10k rpm to the rev limiter. At these rpms,if an engine is flowing good-it needs fuel to keep a proper air/fuel ratio. People tend to lean them out,but if the engine is pumping efficiently,has a good combustion swirl and is being run in the upper rpm-they need more gas.

A completely stock bike-might see a little bit more snap by leaning it. The stock exhaust is restrictive. Its one of the reasons this bike has good bottom stock. There is more back pressure. Kawi motor isn't Much different design than the suzuki. Main reason people feel that motor is stronger is the silencer on the kx is more like a straight pipe=it flows. The issue is,these bikes only really make power from 10k to 13k. From 4-6k rpm..not a whole lot going on. One thing the kawi has on the Rmz is the second injector. Some may think its dumb..its not! That second injector at full throttle is atomizing fuel and giving a stronger fuel charge. It has more time to introduce oxygen to the fuel also. The other reason for the second injector> these bikes need fuel at high rpm. Some injectors are actually maxed out at full throttle and rpm. You could put 100% in the fuel value at 13k @ 100% throttle and still possibly not be able to get enough fuel through the injector.. pretty sure this is why rocks far suzuki was using the KTM 250sxf throttle body. They found they could get more fuel and air into the engine.

Also isn’t it the position of the fuel injector on the ktm’s?  By having the injector on the bottom of the TB it further encourages atomisation charge.  Neil prince developed a copy to use on Honda with great results.

I know what you’re saying about the Kawasaki 2nd injector.  Its kinda like the 5th injectors on 4cyl performance car engines I used to work on.  You can spec a good (correct) injector for the majority of operation ranges optimising fuel atomisation then rely on the 5th to take care of business up top.

Which coupler do you have in max? These units just piggyback the stock ecu,so the coupler still comes into play. The coupler adjusts fuel approximately 10% richer or leaner. Depending on fuel and power characteristics you like-it can be different maps one person prefers to another. On a dyno,they aim for a constant air fuel ratio of around 12.5 or 13 but whatever makes power...makes power. I feel a dyno run is best after you have made a good map. Basically you can make a map 20% richer or leaner,swap map plugs and see which is better,then fine tune you map. If a bike is running healthy with clean porting,good compression and goof fuel-you can add a lot of fuel from 10k rpm to the rev limiter. At these rpms,if an engine is flowing good-it needs fuel to keep a proper air/fuel ratio. People tend to lean them out,but if the engine is pumping efficiently,has a good combustion swirl and is being run in the upper rpm-they need more gas.

 

Arr sorry missed this post.

 

Just the standard (middle) coupler + Pim2 settings.  If i get these cams to work then from what your saying i could well end up (relatively) very rich compared to a stock map.  For those that don't have access to a roller its cool you can play with the couplers as a kind of suck it an see test before you whip the laptop out & try fine tune that stuff.  Kinda like big plastic jets offering a rough guide?  Never thought about going about it like this before

 

One question.  Do the couplers +-10% to the whole range, like a blanket setting?

Yep. So if you have a map with the pim and then think it might need to be richer-just plug in rich coupler and it will make it x% richer across board. Same goes for lean coupler. Kinda cool. Makes it easier to tell if your map is going in right direction. Another way to do it is to change paramters to bigger increments. Say 1/4 throttle, 1/2 throttle ,etc and mark the throttle. Then just focus mapping that one part of throttle. Like if you focus on closed to quarter throttle,map for best response,the 1/4 to half,etc. Its hard to make changes to the mapping when you see all the throttle percentages,rpm and fuel percentages (at least for me) when I can simplify it and use the couplers-thats when I got decent results.

I see what your doing there.  I like!

 

I also see a testing session in the not too distant future...like charging the laptop, taking tomorrow off and finding a hard pack track somewhere.

:applause:  Hell Yeah Id love to bag work tomorrow. A good test like that will def find some good power. Did you fix your bike? What was it?

Intake cam gear not pressed on correctly from factory (off time) = not too impressed right now.

 

If the worst happens and i am stuck with it does anyone know where i could get it corrected and possibly spot welded in place?

im using stock map with my rs-4 slip on...runs GREAT.

AC717, YOU A BAD DUDE.. ITS AWESOME KNOWIN YOU RIDE A ZUKI...

Project mayhem has begun. Hot cams stage 2. Fresh JE 14:1 piston (already got one in but had ordered a spare)

port and polish,throttle body mod,black ops ignition coil,"experiment" injector.we will see what happens.

Project mayhem has begun. Hot cams stage 2. Fresh JE 14:1 piston (already got one in but had ordered a spare)

port and polish,throttle body mod,black ops ignition coil,"experiment" injector.we will see what happens.

Ac who doing ur throttlebody mod? Wade at injectioneering did mine. Is badash

Ac who doing ur throttlebody mod? Wade at injectioneering did mine. Is badash

also what the black opts ignition coil gonna provide? Other than the obvious

I do my own stuff. For the throttle body I clean up and match to the intake. This is where I epoxy and blend. I do not do it on the inner intake. I made kind of an eccentric rubber seat for the injector. This way I can turn the injector up down left or right slightly to hopefully have the fuel spray cleaner and blend with air. The intake and exhaust ports have a rudder down the center it kinda twist tobalance the fuel mixture ccharge coming in. By placing the injector in a certain position and shaping the ports to evenly pull,this will make for a better charge. I Dont have a flow bench. I just place the cylinder with a cutout plexiglass and flow air with a cfm meter oppositeside the plexi glass. I close off each port and see what each does individually and together. A motor with some hours tells more than a clean motor.it gives you hints where there are issues. You can typically see where fuel on the intake or exhaust on the intake is flowing on a certain spot-so to port it,I just remove obvious casting flaws and then try to blend the areas in the port where the fuel or exhaust "favors"". Inside the head there is small steps and areas around the valves. The factory doesn't blend these. It takes time and is intricate. That's the hardest part to port on a head IMO. The black ops coil ditches the standard coil and wire setup and is just a coil pack right on the spark plug cap. Why this setup isn't the standard...k have no idea. After removing the cylinder,there was one glossy spot-about 1/2" wide on the front cylinder wall. I see this a lot. I think its because there is more heat towards the front of the piston,and the simple dynamics of combustion and reciprocal mass puts more stress to the front. Its not a concern if crosshatch is still present but if its not this is where power is lost. I normally just clean with some scotchbrite and call out good if I see crosshatch. Othrrwise-get a new cylinder. I will try to post some pics of the stock cylinder and then the porting

Thanks. I like to think I am a BAMF but I'm just a burnt out electrician that got to learn a lot from some really smart people in the motorcylcle industry when I was young. I tried having a shop a couple years ago. Its just not worth it. Its gotten really expensive and way too competitive to have a shop. It takes days to work on these bikes. Sometimes weeks to make real good numbers. All this translates into a shitload of money and after somebody already paid 8 large far a bike,its hard to justify $2k in motor work. To really make these bikes make peak power and still be reliable,it means taking the whole motor apart and going over everything. Most guys just won't do it for the money involved. Hell-i woouldnt even do it,but I'm injured at the moment,its raining and I want to see what this bike can do with a little more massaging. My goal is to reatiain same bottom end power,add a kick ass mid and a screaming top. As for my injector mover thingy- I want to get the spray more towards the intake and to the right more. I feel the injector is spraying in the left side of the throttle body and is being swirled across the intake. If I can get the spray centered or more to the right-i can get it to pull and blend with the air and then split equally. All theory really. Never tried it-or saw it done. But watching the injector spray it look inefficient. Love to have that KTM throttle body.

Thanks. I like to think I am a BAMF but I'm just a burnt out electrician that got to learn a lot from some really smart people in the motorcylcle industry when I was young. I tried having a shop a couple years ago. Its just not worth it. Its gotten really expensive and way too competitive to have a shop. It takes days to work on these bikes. Sometimes weeks to make real good numbers. All this translates into a shitload of money and after somebody already paid 8 large far a bike,its hard to justify $2k in motor work. To really make these bikes make peak power and still be reliable,it means taking the whole motor apart and going over everything. Most guys just won't do it for the money involved. Hell-i woouldnt even do it,but I'm injured at the moment,its raining and I want to see what this bike can do with a little more massaging. My goal is to reatiain same bottom end power,add a kick ass mid and a screaming top. As for my injector mover thingy- I want to get the spray more towards the intake and to the right more. I feel the injector is spraying in the left side of the throttle body and is being swirled across the intake. If I can get the spray centered or more to the right-i can get it to pull and blend with the air and then split equally. All theory really. Never tried it-or saw it done. But watching the injector spray it look inefficient. Love to have that KTM throttle body.

wowza! You went off on me lol lol.. that's awesome Ac.. my motor gettin ported also.. stallworth said the same thing you did.. remove any flaws and make it flow nice..

AC what is the deal with the ktm tb? I had heard before about it as well...just dont remember the deal...

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