enough power for my fat butt?

[Bballjunky81]

I am new to this forum and I am planning on buying my first dirt bike next spring.  I am 32, 6 ft, 235lbs.  I want to get a 4 stroke and I am trying to decide if I should get a 250cc or 450cc.   I'm not going to be racing, I guess you could call it trail riding, but i want something that I can jump as well and do some good hill climbing.  I know a 250cc would be good to start out with but I am affraid that as I get better I will out grow it and it won't have the power to haul my fat ass where I want to go.  I need some opinions.  Thanks

[joels_rody]

If it's ur first bike then I would say 250 as the 450 power would likely

Get you in trouble on the trail

98 yz125

2004 ttr125

2006 crf230

2001 ktm520 sx

[Bballjunky81]

Some of my buddies were going riding and one had a spare bike so I went with them his bike is a kx450f and I loved it. BUT I also didn't get over like 3rd gear and was being careful. I just worry that once I get more capable a 250 won't be enough bike to do what I want. Maybe they have more power than I think they do.

[schrode]

get the 450 and be careful. add a fww if need be to slow down the spooling up of the motor. 250's need to be run higher in the revs to stay in the power. it takes a bit more of a seasoned rider to make them work properly. just get the 450 and keep a finger on the clutch at all times and you'll be fine.

[Thorski44]

 I found for tight stuff on a 450 a rekluse was sure nice.  I put one on my yz450 and it sure tamed it. (I'm 6'4" 320lbs) Lug the motor all over the place and it's pretty hard to stall.  (also did the heavier flywheel and 13-50 gearing).  You might want to look at any of the European 350's too.  exc, xcw, fe's etc. 

 

Good luck and let us know how it goes. 

Edited May 19, 2014 by Thorski44

[motosinko805]

Just get a wr450 or crfx450. Can be had for cheap. Good bikes.

[sruiz67]

I am much shorter than you and weigh about the same though, yikes!haha but I bought a wr250f and do only trail riding and I have fallen I love with that bike. Very reliable capable of jumping and the electric start has just spoiled me. Wr are very good bikes.

[Bballjunky81]

Kinda sounds like maybe the 450 would be better just because I don't HAVE to use the power but it will be there when I need it and I won't have to worry about upgrading later. It's has taken me 10 years to convince the wife to let me get one so I feel like this is my one shot I get this one and have to make it last as long as possible. Haha. I have to wait for next years work bonus and I think my budget will be about $3500-$4000 after buying all the gear. so I think I should be able to get a good bike for that. I think I would be happy with a 250 but maybe in the long run the 450 would be better. Thanks for your input.

[not_again]

This thread comes up all the time: "I'm an adult big guy and I'm buying my first bike, wanna get a 450". 

Several guys have come back and said that it's too much for them and not any fun. Some of them have made it work but almost universally they say it was way too much bike for them for several years.

 

All I have to say to that is that if you value your life and health, why the (blankety-blank) would you go out and buy the fastest open class bike made? It's kind of ridiculous if you think about it, like learning to fly an airplane in an F-18 fighter jet. Could you do it? Probably. Fun, not much, plenty scary and dangerous.

Yes, you don't have to use all the power. Yes, that power is going to get you in trouble accidentally at some point. I hope it isn't life changing.

Learning how to ride and progress is a many-years proposition. The right tool for the job doesn't have 55 horsepower.

 

I'm 190 and have both a CRF250R and CRF450R, both modified for the woods- kickstands, suspension valving, etc. The 250 is my favorite in tight woods, the 450 on open trails and desert. The 250 stands right up and tailwalks in 5th gear. Do you really think that's not enough power?

[majikman808]

I weigh 200lbs and my son's 250f moves me just fine. I have a 450 too but the 250 is fun as hell to ride!

[Qqqqqqqqqqqq]

What about a 2T

The CR500® will haul Fat Ass ... No probs ?

[BushPig]

Mate look around at whats available, theres more to it than just 450s

 

If you were to get one, I vote WR-F, CRF-X or KTM EXC.

 

But there are lovely 2 strokes made by KTM (bigger brand), Husqvarna, Beta etc... Its not just the big brands anymore there's some nice variety unless you want a Jap 2 stroke enduro.

[basalt]

You rode one of the most powerful 450s and liked it. What is there to think about?

 

The only real question is were you riding terrain that is typical and as technical as what you will usually ride? 450s (or bigger two strokes for that matter) are easy to ride when the going is easy. When the shit hits the fan however, is when the bikes and your skill differentiate themselves. On one hand, there are a lot of situations where the extra torq and power will help, and there are situations where it will hurt. Same goes for the 250s and their lack of power. The difference is the lack of power of a 250 usually just means you have to try again and/or get really good at the clutch (an invaluable skill most people don't learn anymore cause 4-strokes are too easy). With a 450 too much power can make one of the simple 250 "I'm not going to make it" situations into a "OH SHIT I GRABBED TOO MUCH THROTTLE" situation and now your bike is back flipping down the loose, rutted hill, hopefully without you. I've seen it many times, most often on two strokes though.

 

My opinion? Don't get either! Get a big bore! The power delivery is usually more mellow, there is more torque which can only help. Depending on what you get, they are not that much heavier than a 450. I ride a Husaberg FE550 and the motor on that thing is MAGIC! My brother and riding buddies have WR450f, KTM 300, and KTM 450EXC, CRF450R/X, etc, etc. They are all a handful compared to the big bore. My friend on the KTM 450 describes it as cheating. None of the 450s are as stable, and the 300 while it handles like a dream, is just lacking in power- that is until it is not- then it is too much. Same goes for my '97 KTM 300, though it was just more often than not "too much."

 

Something to think about!

[Alan48]

KTM 300 or 350 ?

[Bballjunky81]

Thanks for all the advice. Honestly I don't know anything about dirt bikes so all the numbers and letters don't mean much to me I'll have to research those. And what is a big bore? ? and yes the terrain I was riding in is what I will be riding in when I get my own. But hopefully with more jumping and faster. ?

Edited May 19, 2014 by Bballjunky81

[basalt]

BigBore is basically anything with a displacement bigger than a 450, usually 500cc's+

[SilvFx]

I dont typically recommend a 450 to start with....but one consideration in Utah and where I live is riding at altitude trims off a lot of power.  A 250 4 stroke and even a 250 2 stroke can be a bit gutless above 10-11K.

 

Some of the bikes/numbers people are throwing at your are:

 

• WR450F = Yamaha's 4 stroke offroad/enduro bike.  The WR stands for a wide ratio transmission which is what you want for trail riding/offroad. It also has headlight, taillight, elec start.  The wide ratio transmission allows you to go slow when you want to and also allows you to go 60 mph down a forest service road with no trouble.  These have a great reputation for durability.
• CRF450X = Honda's 4 stroke offroad/enduro bike.  X denotes the wide ratio transmission, headlight/taillight and elec start.
• KLX450R = Kawasaki's 4 stroke offroad/enduro bike.   This is the Kawi equivalent of the CRF450X and WR450F.  They only made them 2008 and 2009.  Market took a huge downturn and Kawi hasnt bothered to get back into the enduro/offroad market.
• KTM 450 XC-W = KTM's 4 stroke offroad/enduro bike.  XCW denotes the wide ratio transmission.  Also has headlight/taillight and elec start.
• Husaberg FE 450 = Husaberg 4 stroke offroad/enduro bike.  FE denotes 4 stroke enduro bike with wide ratio transmission, headlight/taillight and elect start.

The KX450F you rode is a motocross bike with a close ratio transmission.  I think you will find that you cant ride it slow even in first gear unless you change out  front/rear sprocket....and when you do that you  will find yourself maxing out the rpms...just to go 50-55. Honda CRF450R, Suzuki RMZ450, Yamaha YZ450F, Kawasaki KX450F, KTM 450 SX-F are all motorcross bikes.  Great suspension (for a motocross track), higher strung motors, no elec start, close ratio transmissions, no headlight/taillight.

 

The other bikes people are referring to are the two stroke bikes.  Really only KTM, Husaberg, Husqvarna, Beta, GasGas make offroad/enduro bikes.  You will see things like KTM 250/300 XC-W, GasGas EC300, Husaberg TE250/300, Husqvarna WR250/300.  The Japanese manufacturers no longer make any offroad/enduro 2 strokes.  FYI....300 cc's for a watercooled two stroke has about equivalent horsepower to a 450 watercooled 4 stroke, but much different characteristics.  The KTM 300 is well thought of in these forums because it can have explosive power of a two stroke, but does have some good low end torque.  The benefits of a two stroke are lighter weight, less reciprocating parts to break or be replaced. 

 

Happy reading.  Plenty to be learned here and maybe your buddies that you ride the 450 can give you some guidance as well.  I

 

If Utah is like Colorado, you may want to consider buying an offroad bike that you can plate...so you can connect from trail to trail when necessary and are not limited to just offroad designated areas where you have to load/unload and just stick to that area for your entire ride.  I find we are seeing more and more of that in Colorado...so I finally plated and stopped worrying about getting caught cheating.

[Bballjunky81]

I dont typically recommend a 450 to start with....but one consideration in Utah and where I live is riding at altitude trims off a lot of power. A 250 4 stroke and even a 250 2 stroke can be a bit gutless above 10-11K.

Some of the bikes/numbers people are throwing at your are:

• WR450F = Yamaha's 4 stroke offroad/enduro bike. The WR stands for a wide ratio transmission which is what you want for trail riding/offroad. It also has headlight, taillight, elec start. The wide ratio transmission allows you to go slow when you want to and also allows you to go 60 mph down a forest service road with no trouble. These have a great reputation for durability.
• CRF450X = Honda's 4 stroke offroad/enduro bike. X denotes the wide ratio transmission, headlight/taillight and elec start.
• KLX450R = Kawasaki's 4 stroke offroad/enduro bike. This is the Kawi equivalent of the CRF450X and WR450F. They only made them 2008 and 2009. Market took a huge downturn and Kawi hasnt bothered to get back into the enduro/offroad market.
• KTM 450 XC-W = KTM's 4 stroke offroad/enduro bike. XCW denotes the wide ratio transmission. Also has headlight/taillight and elec start.
• Husaberg FE 450 = Husaberg 4 stroke offroad/enduro bike. FE denotes 4 stroke enduro bike with wide ratio transmission, headlight/taillight and elect start.

The KX450F you rode is a motocross bike with a close ratio transmission. I think you will find that you cant ride it slow even in first gear unless you change out front/rear sprocket....and when you do that you will find yourself maxing out the rpms...just to go 50-55. Honda CRF450R, Suzuki RMZ450, Yamaha YZ450F, Kawasaki KX450F, KTM 450 SX-F are all motorcross bikes. Great suspension (for a motocross track), higher strung motors, no elec start, close ratio transmissions, no headlight/taillight.

The other bikes people are referring to are the two stroke bikes. Really only KTM, Husaberg, Husqvarna, Beta, GasGas make offroad/enduro bikes. You will see things like KTM 250/300 XC-W, GasGas EC300, Husaberg TE250/300, Husqvarna WR250/300. The Japanese manufacturers no longer make any offroad/enduro 2 strokes. FYI....300 cc's for a watercooled two stroke has about equivalent horsepower to a 450 watercooled 4 stroke, but much different characteristics. The KTM 300 is well thought of in these forums because it can have explosive power of a two stroke, but does have some good low end torque. The benefits of a two stroke are lighter weight, less reciprocating parts to break or be replaced.

Happy reading. Plenty to be learned here and maybe your buddies that you ride the 450 can give you some guidance as well. I

If Utah is like Colorado, you may want to consider buying an offroad bike that you can plate...so you can connect from trail to trail when necessary and are not limited to just offroad designated areas where you have to load/unload and just stick to that area for your entire ride. I find we are seeing more and more of that in Colorado...so I finally plated and stopped worrying about getting caught cheating.

Thank you very much! That helps a ton. After some research I realized that the terrain I will be riding in is more of a motocross type terrain with some trail riding here and there. I think I want to go more toward the motocross style. And I think utah is different than Colorado as far as trails. I could unload in one spot and ride then hit a trail and end up 20 miles away and only cross one paved road.

[Mudd94]

I dont typically recommend a 450 to start with....but one consideration in Utah and where I live is riding at altitude trims off a lot of power.  A 250 4 stroke and even a 250 2 stroke can be a bit gutless above 10-11K.

 

Some of the bikes/numbers people are throwing at your are:

 

• WR450F = Yamaha's 4 stroke offroad/enduro bike.  The WR stands for a wide ratio transmission which is what you want for trail riding/offroad. It also has headlight, taillight, elec start.  The wide ratio transmission allows you to go slow when you want to and also allows you to go 60 mph down a forest service road with no trouble.  These have a great reputation for durability.
• CRF450X = Honda's 4 stroke offroad/enduro bike.  X denotes the wide ratio transmission, headlight/taillight and elec start.
• KLX450R = Kawasaki's 4 stroke offroad/enduro bike.   This is the Kawi equivalent of the CRF450X and WR450F.  They only made them 2008 and 2009.  Market took a huge downturn and Kawi hasnt bothered to get back into the enduro/offroad market.
• KTM 450 XC-W = KTM's 4 stroke offroad/enduro bike.  XCW denotes the wide ratio transmission.  Also has headlight/taillight and elec start.
• Husaberg FE 450 = Husaberg 4 stroke offroad/enduro bike.  FE denotes 4 stroke enduro bike with wide ratio transmission, headlight/taillight and elect start.

The KX450F you rode is a motocross bike with a close ratio transmission.  I think you will find that you cant ride it slow even in first gear unless you change out  front/rear sprocket....and when you do that you  will find yourself maxing out the rpms...just to go 50-55. Honda CRF450R, Suzuki RMZ450, Yamaha YZ450F, Kawasaki KX450F, KTM 450 SX-F are all motorcross bikes.  Great suspension (for a motocross track), higher strung motors, no elec start, close ratio transmissions, no headlight/taillight.

 

The other bikes people are referring to are the two stroke bikes.  Really only KTM, Husaberg, Husqvarna, Beta, GasGas make offroad/enduro bikes.  You will see things like KTM 250/300 XC-W, GasGas EC300, Husaberg TE250/300, Husqvarna WR250/300.  The Japanese manufacturers no longer make any offroad/enduro 2 strokes.  FYI....300 cc's for a watercooled two stroke has about equivalent horsepower to a 450 watercooled 4 stroke, but much different characteristics.  The KTM 300 is well thought of in these forums because it can have explosive power of a two stroke, but does have some good low end torque.  The benefits of a two stroke are lighter weight, less reciprocating parts to break or be replaced. 

 

Happy reading.  Plenty to be learned here and maybe your buddies that you ride the 450 can give you some guidance as well.  I

 

If Utah is like Colorado, you may want to consider buying an offroad bike that you can plate...so you can connect from trail to trail when necessary and are not limited to just offroad designated areas where you have to load/unload and just stick to that area for your entire ride.  I find we are seeing more and more of that in Colorado...so I finally plated and stopped worrying about getting caught cheating.

To the OP.  Read this post.  When you're done, go back and read it again.  Keep doing that until you understand every word.  This post has all the info you need to, at the very least, narrow down your search, if not help you make a solid decision.  

 

The one and only thing I will add, is that you don't want to deal with kicking over a hot 450 out on the trails.  If you think you want the mx style bike, get an enduro/offroad model and have the suspension done.  Kicking over a hot 450 can be harder than the ride you took.  

Edited May 19, 2014 by Mudd94

[Mudd94]

Thank you very much! That helps a ton. After some research I realized that the terrain I will be riding in is more of a motocross type terrain with some trail riding here and there. I think I want to go more toward the motocross style. And I think utah is different than Colorado as far as trails. I could unload in one spot and ride then hit a trail and end up 20 miles away and only cross one paved road.

So the addition to my post is valid.