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82 xr 200 engine in 1997 xr 200 bike. Generator Wiring question?

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Hi guys,

 

I bolted an 82 XR 200 engine into my 1997 xr 200 frame. All looked well as I had a nice blue spark but there are 2 wires coming off of my generator on the 82 engine and my 97 generator only had one. I did not do anything with the spare wire initially I just hooked up the power wire and she had spark.

 

I thought?  maybe the second wire was a ground but decided not to do anything with it other than wrap it up well with electrical tape and hide it behind the frame. I thought if I had spark, best to do nothing with it. Now I have no spark and upon referring to the schematics it says that the second wire goes to a headlight. As I have no headlight should I run both wires to my one receiver wire on my bike.

 

As I have no spark now perhaps that is the right thing to do ?

 

Please feel free to share all thoughts/insights etc.

 

Thanks for your time in this matter.

 

Take care,

 

Phil

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Well I have done a bit more digging around and I have determined that the gap between the stator ring and the pulse rotor is 18 thousadths which is in spec. What it looks like to me is that the plug is fired every second or third time  maybe . It seems like a nice blue spark, but less frequent than it should be. I changed the gas in it last night and will drag it behind the van today but would appreciate any input.

 

I wonder if I fried something and people are reluctant to tell me that. With 80 plus views and no comments that's the feeling I am getting.I have a second set of everything electronic that bolts to the engine as I tore the 97 engine down and kept all the pieces. I think ? I did not use the 097 stator ring beause the flywheel wasn't balanced for that engine but will retry it again today to see if I can make it work.

 

Any and all thoughts/advice would be appreciated. Seems like we only get about 4 -5 months of riding up here in the land of frozen tundra so I wold apprecaite whatever advice people are willing to share.

 

Take care,

Phil

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Some things to consider when swapping engines between chassis, and issues with differences in the electrical systems. 

 

References to early XR200s include XR185/200 twin shock thru 84, 81-83 XR200R, 86-87 TLR200, and the XL200R.

References to late include the 86-02 XR00R.

 

Late and early electrical systems are completely different so I don't know how you grafted the electrics of the early engine to the the electrical of the late chassis.

 

The late electrics are completely different and not plug compatable with any of the early engines.  However, except for the TLR the total electrical systems will swap between early and late models.  e.g. rotor. stator, cover, CDI sensor, wiring harness, CDI box, coil, etc.  Difference mounting methods for the components is a problem. I put a complete late electrical system on an early engine to increase wattage for the lights, side benefit was a heavier flywheel.

 

Within early or late, except TLR, electrical components will interchange. e.g. coils, CDI sensors, etc.

 

Rotors/stators are match sets for year/model so no mixing of rotors/stators. Honda makes the Stator OD and Rotor ID slightly different between models so you can't mix and match.  Also most stators require the matching side cover. 

 

One big problem with engine swaps is the position of the countershaft sprocket is different between early/late; the late have a longer countershaft to move the sprocket outboard to suit the greater offset of the rear sprocket.

 

There are two width of the engine mount on the cylinder head among the early engines, only one is the same as the late engine. If your 82 engine is a twin shock engine it will have the wide cylinder head mount, if it is from a monoshock chassis it will have the narrow mount like the late engines.  The first four digits of the engine serial number is the Honda Model Code; ME02 is the twin shock, ME04 is the monoshock.

Edited by Chuck.
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Thanks for this Chuck! Very happy to see your words of wisdom show up. I have the rotor stator set up from the 97 so it wires right into the chassis. The generatot is from the 82 and it sounds like the problem lies there. I did not want to use the 97 generator set on that engine as the flywheel is balanced to the other engine. Other than that the oher difference was there was an extra wire coming off of the generator on the 82 for the headlights. I just wrapped it real well in electrical tape and tucked it behind the frame. I have the generaot/stator setup  from the 97 engine and now will see if I can get that generator/stator set up to bolt on to my  82 engine. If that works I should be scott free. Correct ?

 

After dragging the bike for  bit it looks like I have steady blue spark, maybe it took a while to wake up the stator ? There is no fuel but that I am quite comfortable with. I will remove tear down and clean up that carb no problemos.

 

By my logic I will A> clean up the carb and make sure there is fuel to ignite.

 

If that doesn\t work B>

I will then remove generator/flywheel set from the 97 and hopefully fit it to the 82,  and I should be golden if it all fits.

 

What is the likelihood of my damaging any components by running that other generator into my electrical system on the bike. I know there is always some risk but would you think it\s a large risk or a smaller one. Usually those CDI boxes tend to be quite tough.

 

Thanks so much for the help!

 

Take care,

 

Phil

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Ok took another run at the bike this afternoon. I changed to generator back to the one that was on the 97 engine. In summation I have the same piston/head (lots of compression, skids the tire in third on dry pavement and I am over 200lbs). The same generator/flywheel set up and the same carb /cam off of the bike engine that ran really well. I have tried different plugs, pulled the carb and cleaned it a couple of times in spite of the fact that it was clean. The spark seems like it is firing less frequently than it should, it is a nice blue spark. One oddity is that the plug always seems dry, even with the choke full on and my son dragging me behind the car. It should be wet at least.

 

The carb fills with gas and all jets are clean. When I pour gas into the cylinder it does not fire even once. I have tried running propane into the throat of the carb but it still does not fire. I am wondering if it is a suction issue?

 

But what would cause it to spark inconsistently ? I could pull the cam and make sure \i had it positioned lobes down but it would not have compression if \\i messed that up right?

 

As always thoughts and suggestions are welcome.

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I'm confused on what you are referring to as a generator; a generator is a DC device and these bikes use an alternator composed of a rotor and stator.  It is a compound unit with one section powering the ignition, and on most XRs a section to power the lights. If one has only a single wire out it is from an early 80s twin shock 200, all of the others are two wires out. Viewing on line part fiche and comparing part numbers from different years will help sort out the differences, also a manual like Clymers that covers all of the XR200 years will have wiring diagrams with wire colors.

 

Honda balances rotors and cranks independently so no problem mixing parts.

 

Timing chains can slip if worn which would affect ignition and valve timing. There are several threads on checking cam & ignition timing. 

 

I have no idea regarding damage from mixing electrical components, but to do so you will need to butcher the wiring harness so why consider it.

 

If both engines are XRs they will have the same compression ratios and cams.

 

Choke on is the lever up, choke off is lever down.

 

The carbs have some very small passages that are difficult to clean and do impact starting.  check out:

 

http://www.thumpertalk.com/topic/757372-fixing-carburetor-problems/#entry7745927

 

PD Carb rebuild video , just ignore the decel valve and dual cables: http://www.thumpertalk.com/topic/1023210-carb-tutorial-coming/#entry10758564

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Thanks for all the help Chuck! Much appreciated. Went through Carb again, This tme changed out the low sped jet as I had a brand new one sitting in a different xr 200 carb I had sitting around that looked brand new. Floats are going up and down gas running through carbuerator nicely., Main jet nice and clean and pulled the needle at the front of the carb cleaned it up and put it back to the same setting it came out from.

 

Checked timing all is well there. Moved the ring around the pulse rotor forwards and backwards made no difference other than I got one backfire. Plug is still coming out too dry. But if the ignition were firing correctly when I put gas in the cylinder it should at least kick a couple of times. 

 

Kinda of running out of ideas here. I think I will give it some butt scratching time and try to figure it out for a day or so. A bit perplexed I have to say.

 

Thanks for all.

 

Phi;

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I think your best bet is to use all the '97 parts ie the stator, rotor, and cover on the '82 motor. As chuck said there is no balance issue.

Good luck, hope it works out soon

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