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Anyone running Buds racing pipe or DEP on 02 CR250?

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Wanting to hear from guys running Buds racing pipe or DEP pipe on their 02 CR 250's? I"m kind of disappointed in my procircuit pipe. I hear Doma's are really good,but nobody sells them in the USA.

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The PC pipe is designed for mid - top power unless it's a platinum 2, it's more of a low-mid pipe.  Have you considered an OEM pipe that will get you the best all around powerband ?   I do run a Doma on my 03 & it's the only pipe I found to be better on a stock or modified motor. 

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The PC pipe is designed for mid - top power unless it's a platinum 2, it's more of a low-mid pipe.  Have you considered an OEM pipe that will get you the best all around powerband ?   I do run a Doma on my 03 & it's the only pipe I found to be better on a stock or modified motor.

Right now I have the stock pipe on with PC shorty silencer. The PC pipes not bad, but it's not a barn burner either! Maybe it would work better with their porting and head mods? Right now I have Eric Gorr's Mo-Better, but I have the Mikuni carb on and even with JD Jetting's jet kit it still doesn't seem as good as it should be?

I still think the European pipe makers for this bike do a better job than PC and FMF, but there not imported to the USA. The pipes I'm curious about are and I'd like to get some opinions before I spend anymore money!

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Right now I have the stock pipe on with PC shorty silencer. The PC pipes not bad, but it's not a barn burner either! Maybe it would work better with their porting and head mods? Right now I have Eric Gorr's Mo-Better, but I have the Mikuni carb on and even with JD Jetting's jet kit it still doesn't seem as good as it should be?

I still think the European pipe makers for this bike do a better job than PC and FMF, but there not imported to the USA. The pipes I'm curious about are and I'd like to get some opinions before I spend anymore money!

The pipes will generally move the powerband around & not necessarily add much to it.   A good engine tuner can extract good power out of these motors as they have very good potential with cyl. & head mods.   Did you notice a difference in power from stock to the EG mods ?  Is the cyl. head set up for pump or higher octane ? 

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The pipes will generally move the powerband around & not necessarily add much to it.   A good engine tuner can extract good power out of these motors as they have very good potential with cyl. & head mods.   Did you notice a difference in power from stock to the EG mods ?  Is the cyl. head set up for pump or higher octane ?

Yeah I noticed a difference bike is a lot better with Eric Gorr's mods! I just had him set it up for pump fuel, but I've been running VP C-12.

Last few times I rode it I've had to chase the jetting and you can tell the Jetting's just not right !

H4L- what mods do you have done to your bike? Where did you get the Doma pipe at?

I just picked up a 2000 PWK carb going to try that!

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Yeah I noticed a difference bike is a lot better with Eric Gorr's mods! I just had him set it up for pump fuel, but I've been running VP C-12.

Last few times I rode it I've had to chase the jetting and you can tell the Jetting's just not right !

H4L- what mods do you have done to your bike? Where did you get the Doma pipe at?

I just picked up a 2000 PWK carb going to try that!

The 00 keihin PWK is a good upgrade over the tmx on the 02-03 models.   If your jetting is off the motor won't run to it's full potential, get that sorted out first.  Afterwards if you feel you need more power I'd have a head cut for higher octane since your already running VP C12.  Do you feel the motor lacks in any part of the rpm range & that's why your looking to upgrade the exhaust pipe ?

 

I have the PC cyl. / head mods & running VP C12 since the head was cut for higher octane.  Also running a JD ign., VF2 cage, 00 Keihin carb & Doma exhaust that proved to be a lethal combo for mx riding !

The Doma exhaust was bought in 06 from Langston racing in southern CA.  Unfortunately the Doma's are no longer imported as you mentioned otherwise I'd pick one up for the 07 model.            

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The 00 keihin PWK is a good upgrade over the tmx on the 02-03 models.   If your jetting is off the motor won't run to it's full potential, get that sorted out first.  Afterwards if you feel you need more power I'd have a head cut for higher octane since your already running VP C12.  Do you feel the motor lacks in any part of the rpm range & that's why your looking to upgrade the exhaust pipe ?

 

I have the PC cyl. / head mods & running VP C12 since the head was cut for higher octane.  Also running a JD ign., VF2 cage, 00 Keihin carb & Doma exhaust that proved to be a lethal combo for mx riding !

The Doma exhaust was bought in 06 from Langston racing in southern CA.  Unfortunately the Doma's are no longer imported as you mentioned otherwise I'd pick one up for the 07 model.

I had my crank balanced by Crankworks for Wiseco's piston kit Eric Gorr's mo- better porting head mods and V-Force version 1.

"Do I feel powerbands lacking anywhere"

Yes bottom and top

Midrange packs a punch though

Again I think jetting is the biggest cause the TMX is just really tempera mental.

I hear PC doesn't cut the base .030 like EG does? EG said ports were to high!

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Joe - By cutting the base .030 the cyl. ports are being lowered & therefore having the effect of changing the port timing.  It would pick up in the low-mid & loose some topend unless the exhaust port was raised to compensate.  When these bikes first came out a local engine tuner suggested I try to use a .010 cometic base gasket, this was before the 05 models came out.  It didn't really provide the gains we were looking for in the lower part of the rpms (barely noticeable), but seemed to sacrifice on top.  Took the cyl. back off & he ended up raising the exhaust port by 1mm to compensate for the thinner base gasket.  That provided a wider smooth powerband with the stock exhaust, but didn't feel it was ideal for mx.  After doing some research with other tuners like TMR, Varner & Lamson porting I found PC to be the best option for me as an mx rider.  Once you get the right set up on the engine for your type of riding & speed the chassis / suspension is as good as it gets with a 250 2t.  

 

Yes.  PC does not cut the base & that's one of the main reasons I went with them combined with the fact that they have done the R&D work on this motor.  Depending on the type of riding or skill level for most weekend warriors cutting the base will be a better option.  It will provide a low-mid motor that is easier to ride.                 

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H4L- I might try the high compression head after I get the carb right first. It's hard to judge what I have with jetting off! Going to put the PWK on and try it. Another guy on here gave me some good jetting to try on the PWK. Then I might experiment with some pipes.

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One of our local racers was sponsored by DEP pipes for a season. He was also sponsored by Eric Gorr as well. I asked him about the DEP pipes before going with my PC built motor. His opinion of the DEP pipe was that it was pretty similar in gains to his PC pipe, but the pipe itself was made of a thicker gauge steel so it didn't dent as easy from roost. He did say that the mufflers are junk and opted to run a PC shorty with a DEP header. 

 

As far as the comment about Euro's being better pipe builders, in actuality no one can beat the OEM exhausts. The OEMs have the state of the art pipe bending and welding set ups that aftermarket companies only dream of having. In some cases, like the 05-07 CR125, the OEM header is the best pipe out there and aftermarket will not beat it at all. Also, HGS, DEP, and BUD are like Bills Pipes, FMF, and Pro-Circuit over here. I'm sure lots of guys over seas would like an American exhaust, but the taxes on importing are high as well. I know I would love a DOMA system for both my 125 and 250. 

 

For the 02' CR250, DOMA is hands down the best exhaust for the bike. It actually makes power vs. moving the power around a little bit. However, second best would be the Pro-Circuit system. Honestly, I would not bother with FMF. The shorty for the CR250 is literally the same size as the stock muffler. I know this because I bought one and it now sits on my parts shelf. I would go Pro-Circuit as far as exhaust, but that's just me.

 

You're jetting woes can be attributed to the TMX carb you have on your bike. I would promptly switch that out for either a 00' Keihin or PWK Airstriker from JD Jetting. You won't be making any power unless your jetting is optimal. 

 

So, here is my last opinion. If you really want that 02' to sing, I would send it out to Pro-Circuit for their head and cylinder mods package. I did this to my 07' and it is a completely different animal from stock. Bottom end has a little more oomph, but mid to top just might as well wear extra undies and eat your wheaties in the morning. Seriously, it is the fastest thing I have ridden. The bike pulls extremely hard from mid to top and I have to drag my brake often off high speed jumps at our track. I had Pro-Circuit cut the head for race gas and they cut the head so low, you have to run a spark plug spacer they give you so the electrode does not slam into the top of the piston. I am extremely happy with what they did to my motor and wished I would have done it sooner. Pissed my buddy off pretty good this weekend when I pulled 3 bike lengths on his 14' KX450 going down the straight out of a corner teehee :). However, I would not recommend this package for a beginner/intermediate rider as it is quite the animal and will tire you out quick because it rips your arms pretty good. But non the less its an extremely good package when combined with their pipe and silencer as well. PC told me 55-58 rear wheel HP with the right jetting and fuel. Thinking mine is close to 58. Feels pretty good. This winter I plan on sending my cases out to them to have PC match them so then my motor will be completely PC built.

 

Here's the list of mods to my bike as far as motor:

 

PC Head and Cylinder Mods

PC Works Pipe and R304 Shorty

V-Force 3 Reeds

PWK Airstriker Carb

Opened up Air Box

Runs/eats Sunoco 110 octane mixed 32:1 with Maxima Castor 927 per PC recommendation.

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One of our local racers was sponsored by DEP pipes for a season. He was also sponsored by Eric Gorr as well. I asked him about the DEP pipes before going with my PC built motor. His opinion of the DEP pipe was that it was pretty similar in gains to his PC pipe, but the pipe itself was made of a thicker gauge steel so it didn't dent as easy from roost. He did say that the mufflers are junk and opted to run a PC shorty with a DEP header. 

 

As far as the comment about Euro's being better pipe builders, in actuality no one can beat the OEM exhausts. The OEMs have the state of the art pipe bending and welding set ups that aftermarket companies only dream of having. In some cases, like the 05-07 CR125, the OEM header is the best pipe out there and aftermarket will not beat it at all. Also, HGS, DEP, and BUD are like Bills Pipes, FMF, and Pro-Circuit over here. I'm sure lots of guys over seas would like an American exhaust, but the taxes on importing are high as well. I know I would love a DOMA system for both my 125 and 250. 

 

For the 02' CR250, DOMA is hands down the best exhaust for the bike. It actually makes power vs. moving the power around a little bit. However, second best would be the Pro-Circuit system. Honestly, I would not bother with FMF. The shorty for the CR250 is literally the same size as the stock muffler. I know this because I bought one and it now sits on my parts shelf. I would go Pro-Circuit as far as exhaust, but that's just me.

 

You're jetting woes can be attributed to the TMX carb you have on your bike. I would promptly switch that out for either a 00' Keihin or PWK Airstriker from JD Jetting. You won't be making any power unless your jetting is optimal. 

 

So, here is my last opinion. If you really want that 02' to sing, I would send it out to Pro-Circuit for their head and cylinder mods package. I did this to my 07' and it is a completely different animal from stock. Bottom end has a little more oomph, but mid to top just might as well wear extra undies and eat your wheaties in the morning. Seriously, it is the fastest thing I have ridden. The bike pulls extremely hard from mid to top and I have to drag my brake often off high speed jumps at our track. I had Pro-Circuit cut the head for race gas and they cut the head so low, you have to run a spark plug spacer they give you so the electrode does not slam into the top of the piston. I am extremely happy with what they did to my motor and wished I would have done it sooner. Pissed my buddy off pretty good this weekend when I pulled 3 bike lengths on his 14' KX450 going down the straight out of a corner teehee :). However, I would not recommend this package for a beginner/intermediate rider as it is quite the animal and will tire you out quick because it rips your arms pretty good. But non the less its an extremely good package when combined with their pipe and silencer as well. PC told me 55-58 rear wheel HP with the right jetting and fuel. Thinking mine is close to 58. Feels pretty good. This winter I plan on sending my cases out to them to have PC match them so then my motor will be completely PC built.

 

Here's the list of mods to my bike as far as motor:

 

PC Head and Cylinder Mods

PC Works Pipe and R304 Shorty

V-Force 3 Reeds

PWK Airstriker Carb

Opened up Air Box

Runs/eats Sunoco 110 octane mixed 32:1 with Maxima Castor 927 per PC recommendation.

Maybe I'll have to try PC's porting and head mods? What are you running jetting wise?

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Maybe I'll have to try PC's porting and head mods? What are you running jetting wise?

 

I'm not pulling your arm telling you that you absolutely must go with PC. Many people have been happy with Eric Gorr's work, but I just don't like his long turn around times. I had my motor back within the same week I shipped it out to PC from Michigan to California. But as far as my jetting, its going to depend on what is all done to your bike, temperature, humidity, fuel, etc.

 

Currently I am running:

 

180 main

48 pilot

1.5 out on AS

Red JD Needle in 3rd clip

PWK Airstriker Carb.

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I'm not pulling your arm telling you that you absolutely must go with PC. Many people have been happy with Eric Gorr's work, but I just don't like his long turn around times. I had my motor back within the same week I shipped it out to PC from Michigan to California. But as far as my jetting, its going to depend on what is all done to your bike, temperature, humidity, fuel, etc.

 

Currently I am running:

 

180 main

48 pilot

1.5 out on AS

Red JD Needle in 3rd clip

PWK Airstriker Carb.

I e-mailed Pro-Circuit yesterday asking if I could have them modify my head even though I've had my cylinder base cut .030". To me it sounds like Pro-Circuit's head mod is radical and that's where their getting most of the Horsepower. I'll post their response. I know you weren't pushing Pro-Circuit! I've read enough to know guys that had them do work were very happy with what they did and the results they got from their work.

 The one thing that bothers me about my bike is no one was able to get the stock Mikuni carb to work? Even with JD Jetting's kit (which is very good) your constantly chasing the set-up(very frustrating). Honda went with this carb for some reason?

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I e-mailed Pro-Circuit yesterday asking if I could have them modify my head even though I've had my cylinder base cut .030". To me it sounds like Pro-Circuit's head mod is radical and that's where their getting most of the Horsepower. I'll post their response. I know you weren't pushing Pro-Circuit! I've read enough to know guys that had them do work were very happy with what they did and the results they got from their work.

 The one thing that bothers me about my bike is no one was able to get the stock Mikuni carb to work? Even with JD Jetting's kit (which is very good) your constantly chasing the set-up(very frustrating). Honda went with this carb for some reason?

PC offers a head cut for pump or higher octane fuel with the same cyl. port work depending on the customer & what they're wanting out of the motor.  I've ridden an 05 with the head cut for pump fuel even though the cyl. porting is the same there is a noticeable difference in the power output.   With the head cut for high octane it revs quicker & pulls very hard to a very impressive topend overev that's unmatched with any other 250 2t ridden.  By shaving the head they add comp. to the motor & fix the squishband between .035 - .040 with effective & very good results.  

It's good that you mentioned your base has been cut .030 so you don't end up with a motor that will detonate if you use their head mods for higher octane.  I'd be interested in what they respond as they modify the head with out the base being cut & would need to compensate for it.   

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PC offers a head cut for pump or higher octane fuel with the same cyl. port work depending on the customer & what they're wanting out of the motor.  I've ridden an 05 with the head cut for pump fuel even though the cyl. porting is the same there is a noticeable difference in the power output.   With the head cut for high octane it revs quicker & pulls very hard to a very impressive topend overev that's unmatched with any other 250 2t ridden.  By shaving the head they add comp. to the motor & fix the squishband between .035 - .040 with effective & very good results.  

It's good that you mentioned your base has been cut .030 so you don't end up with a motor that will detonate if you use their head mods for higher octane.  I'd be interested in what they respond as they modify the head with out the base being cut & would need to compensate for it.   

Yeah I'm interested in what they have to say too! With them cutting the head so much that it needs a spark plug spacer it sounds to me that they are lowering the dome part of the head. Hopefully I'll hear something today.

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Yeah I'm interested in what they have to say too! With them cutting the head so much that it needs a spark plug spacer it sounds to me that they are lowering the dome part of the head. Hopefully I'll hear something today.

My 03 doesn't have a spacer for the spark plug even though the head was cut for higher octane.  The 05 I rode was cut for pump fuel & did have a spacer, I'm thinking it has to due to the 02-04 having a flat top piston & the 05-07 having a (pop up) dome piston for more comp. from the factory.  

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My 03 doesn't have a spacer for the spark plug even though the head was cut for higher octane.  The 05 I rode was cut for pump fuel & did have a spacer, I'm thinking it has to due to the 02-04 having a flat top piston & the 05-07 having a (pop up) dome piston for more comp. from the factory.

Ok I didn't realize the pistons were different. Maybe I just need the head modded for race fuel? I know Eric would be cheaper than PC!

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 I had Pro-Circuit cut the head for race gas and they cut the head so low, you have to run a spark plug spacer they give you so the electrode does not slam into the top of the piston

 

I believe the reason for the spacer is to prevent the spark plug thread from protruding into the combustion chamber with the amount of machining and shaping they do to the top of the dome in the vicinity of the spark plug.

In other words, if the plug is fully threaded and torqued into the head, one or two threads worth will extend into the combustion chamber without using the spacer they supply.

If the electrode is in danger of contacting the piston crown at Top Dead Center, then there are obviously bigger problems to be concerned with.

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