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frame cracked!

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i was out doing some jumps yesterday, and at one point i realize my right foot peg doesnt feel right. it finally gave way to the rust eating at it from the inside. what would you do to fix it? i want to give the welder person some very precise instructions. could this be fixed without removing the engine? 

 

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Arc welding will do more damage because the metal is so thin. Mig won't be quite as bad and will do a better job. But to make it strong, it really needs a patch welded over the area. That's something you'll need to fabricate.

Did a bit of this myself a while back.

http://www.thumpertalk.com/topic/700480-frame-repair/?hl=%2Btrailryder42#entry7137715

Edited by Trailryder42
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Some pictures of different angles and more bike showing would help determine the best approach to this problem. Although it seems pretty straight forward. Gotta try and clean up as much paint and rust around the area as possible, mig welding would be the most convenient, tig would be the cleanest but more pricey. Like stated above some sort of gusset, support can be added for strength. It seems like removing the motor will not impact much and in order to weld it properly and from the angles it needs I think your gonna have to get it out unless you just want a half ass job mig it and ride it.

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Arc welding will do more damage because the metal is so thin. Mig won't be quite as bad and will do a better job. But to make it strong, it really needs a patch welded over the area. That's something you'll need to fabricate.

 

thanks. i remember someone (maybe you) had fabricated some patches for each side of the frame. do you also recommend the welding be done with the motor inside the frame?

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thanks. i remember someone (maybe you) had fabricated some patches for each side of the frame. do you also recommend the welding be done with the motor inside the frame?

I had quite a lot to fix, so engine out was the only way to go. You can see from the pics in my link that the patching was pretty substantial. I had no trouble refitting the engine afterwards. I attribute that to a good welder that knew what he was doing. Tacking the patches into place in multiple places first to strengthen things and keep them from moving while finishing it up.

I'd look the rest of the frame over real good and see if there are other areas that need attention while you're taking care of this one. That and the opinion of the welder as to whether he can access the area acceptably to do a good job will tell you if the engine should come out or not.

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Better drill some 1/8' drain holes in the bottom on the other side at a low point. Consider that your right side is parked higher the left is probably bad too. Keep them open. I would be tempted to cut out the badly rusted area to see what you got.  Butt welding that won't work. I wonder if the bike has been ridden in salt water.

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An interesting area. Note that to the top left are two doublers to the lower right is a doubler and a triple layer. No wonder it cracked and rusted out there. My frame has some external corrosion in that area. I am going to take a closer look and probably fabricate a thin wall brace between those thicker areas. A simple job probably.

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got it welded today, im going to sand it and paint it tomorrow. looks real ugly in the pic but i think the welder person did a pretty good job.

 

IMG_1635_zpsa534f2f7.jpg

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Better drill some 1/8' drain holes in the bottom on the other side at a low point. Consider that your right side is parked higher the left is probably bad too. Keep them open. I would be tempted to cut out the badly rusted area to see what you got.  Butt welding that won't work. I wonder if the bike has been ridden in salt water.

 

yes the left side is corroded too. the welder guy filled in a small hole that had rusted through on that side. it may not be a long term fix, but im not ready to rip apart the whole bike yet. maybe in winter.

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Looks good. Paint it and watch for cracks.

I looked at the same spot on my bike today. The paint has come off because of flexing. No cracks though. I'm going to weld on a curved plate over the area. Thanks guys for alerting me to what is going on there.

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another couple bad nighttime flash pictures of the frame with two coats of paint. i realized when i tried to take the foot peg rest off that the welding goes around parts of it so i couldnt remove it. i probably could if i jumped on it but i dont wanna mess with it and cause it to crack. heres a video of what i was doing the day it cracked: http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x23le33_holy-jumpin-snap-xr-gone-whoop-whoop_auto

 

IMG_1642_zps4f02ae94.jpg

 

 

IMG_1646_zpsb1f5a265.jpg

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yea its always foggy up there. i just assumed he would weld around it and not impact the foot peg holder. it was a mistake on my part. i guess i can file it.

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Welding is not a magical procedure. I am 63 and started welding about 10-15 years ago. Mig welding is the way to go. fr fairly thin wall tubing. I use a 100 amp lincolin  welder It starts getting flaky at 1/4" material.   Use plenty of current I might keep your bolts in place as the welds are not  nearly 360 degrees 

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I would have unbolted the right foot peg before welding that area. Curious why you welded it on.

I definitely would have left it on to do as much as I could reach, then maybe remove it to weld the rest. There would be a slim chance of the holes lining up again perfectly after the process if it were all done with the peg removed.

Edit: Another reason to leave it on would be to help dissipate some of the heat from that thin-wall tubing to help prevent a blow-through.

Edited by ITLKSEZ
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I definitely would have left it on to do as much as I could reach, then maybe remove it to weld the rest. There would be a slim chance of the holes lining up again perfectly after the process if it were all done with the peg removed.

Edit: Another reason to leave it on would be to help dissipate some of the heat from that thin-wall tubing to help prevent a blow-through.

what to you mean by blow through? there were already two small holes drilled through the frame to all smoke and pressure to escape. is that what you mean?

 

also one more question for everyone: should i have disconnected the battery, cdi, regulator/rectifier, etc... before having the chassis welded? could the heat have damaged those components?

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Blow through is when the welder uses too much heat. Disconnecting the electrics is a good option. It isn't really the heat but the electrical induction with an electric welder. The welds on your bike look like they were made with acetylene which shouldn't create any induction.

what to you mean by blow through? there were already two small holes drilled through the frame to all smoke and pressure to escape. is that what you mean?

 

also one more question for everyone: should i have disconnected the battery, cdi, regulator/rectifier, etc... before having the chassis welded? could the heat have damaged those components?

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what to you mean by blow through? there were already two small holes drilled through the frame to all smoke and pressure to escape. is that what you mean?

also one more question for everyone: should i have disconnected the battery, cdi, regulator/rectifier, etc... before having the chassis welded? could the heat have damaged those components?

What lump-tha-thump said.

When the molten mass is too hot to support its own form, it will want to drip in, out, or just make a hole that is a mess to re-bridge in the wrong hands. The thinner the material, the easier to blow through and the harder to fix elegantly.

I've heard theories from both camps on whether or not to disconnect the electrics. Where I stand: The current you are using to weld with should follow a direct path from the electrode to the ground. As long as you don't clamp the ground to a place where your electrics are in the middle of the circuit, the peripheral voltage shouldn't be enough to do any harm. I go one step further if possible and clamp the ground on the farther-away end of the part I am welding, so that the DC current is traveling away from the electrics rather than towards them. For example, if I were to weld a subframe, I'd connect the ground to the top end under the fender rather than down where it bolts to the frame.

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