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New KTM 390 Adventure (based on 390 Duke)

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"INDIAN websites are reporting that details of a KTM 390 Adventure are to be released at the EICMA show in November this year. (Milan, Italia)
According to Motorbeam, the dual-sport bike will be heavily based on the Duke 390, featuring the same 43hp 373.2cc single-cylinder engine, six-speed gearbox and ABS brakes as standard.

However, the dual-sport machine will get long-travel suspension for increased ground clearance, dual-purpose tyres and a larger fuel tank for increased range. It’s also likely to get larger wheels for increased off-road capability and taller bars to support a more upright riding position.

The website claims that Stefan Pierer, KTM CEO, has said the new Adventure will be built in the Bajaj factory in Pune, India, to be exported to international markets."

 

http://www.visordown.com/motorcycle-news-new-bikes/ktm-390-adventure-to-be-unveiled/25404.html

 

My comments on this bike and a bit of History and back story:

I've read a couple reviews in the Brit magazines (BIKE and MC Sport/Leisure)
on the 390 Duke. This a few months back, so none of this is breaking news. I was surprised reviews were a bit mixed. Brake, suspension and fueling complaints, plus some build quality comments. But very early and very short launch reviews. They liked the power and handling, IIRC.

Far as I've heard both KTM 200 Duke and 390 Duke are now for sale in the UK and EU. KTM claimed the USA would be getting both in Fall 2014. We'll see soon.

No local reviews as of yet. I'd give the Adventure version a year to get here.

About 1.5 years back Pierer did an interview in Cycle News (US). He talked all about KTM and it's future. Great interview ... very detailed. :thumbsup:
Anyway, he said then that the 390 Duke would be followed up by at least two models, for sure an Adventure version. So the 390 ADV has been in the cards for a while. Lots more on this if you Google.

Lets hope KTM don't screw it up.

MSRP for the Duke in the UK is £4500 ($6750 USD) so not that cheap for a 400cc bike made in India, especially considering Yamaha's two latest models ... FZ-09 and FZ-07. $8K for the 09, $7K for the 07. But generally converting direct from UK Pounds to Dollars is a fool's errand when questimating bike prices   :banghead:

We typically pay in dollars what the Brits pay in UK Pounds (yes, USA gets a screamin deal! :ride: )   ... so, may be no where near the $6750 direct conversion @ 1.5 USD to I UKP. More likely closer to the $5000 USD mark would be my guess.   I haven't heard how KTM Duke 200 sales are doing in India ... but KTM have high hopes in that market ... and now in China too with both 200 and 390 Duke models.

Recent Alan Cathcart article in MC Sport & Leisure (August issue) is a major outline of the Chinese Moto industry. He mentions that KTM has done a major deal with major Chinese manufacturer ... CF Moto... pics show 200 Duke and 390 Duke on assembly line. Actually, Cathcart is very late with this info, deal was done in late 2013 .... and it's NOT manufacturing ... just assembly.

http://www.kiwiridernews.com/2014/04/first-ktm-duke-rolls-off-cfmoto.html

 

Just done a bit more research (link above) on the Chinese deal. Both the Duke 200 and 390 are indeed built in Bajaj's India plant, then disassembled, sent to China,

reassembled and sold locally, not exported. So for Chinese market only.  So, so far ... CF Moto are doing assembly only ... I'm betting that will change soon.

So, looks like USA bound bikes will be made in India by Bajaj Auto.

If done right, KTM could blow the doors off the market with a 390 Adventure. But I'd guestimate ONE YEAR before that bike arrives states side.
Just what the market needs. Fingers crossed!  

 

Real question will be long term reliability/quality of the KTM compared to Austrian made KTM's. If the KTM is a HIT, who knows what market reaction will be? :goofy:

We could see Honda finally jumping on the ADV band wagon, maybe do a 450cc ADV bike out of Thailand or Brazil? A inexpensive version of their Dakar racer?

A MINI version of a modern Africa Twin? Maybe Suzuki will finally release that up dated version of the DRZ450 they've been sitting on since 2007?

Yamaha could do a Mini Tenere' using the WR450 motor? Or take that FZ-07 parallel twin and do a smaller Super Tenere'? :devil:

So, all kinds of possibilities ... and IMO, not really much of a gamble for the OEM's to risk.

ADV-dual sport bike sales ALL doing well worldwide ... from the
KLR/DR/XR-L 650/G650 class to CRF250L/WR250R/KLX250S to KTM 690/500exc to Yam Tenere 660/1200 Super Tenere to KTM 1190 to BMW F800GS/1200GS-L.

:cheers:

 

Edited by 54321
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Sure, but the problem is it's not going to be the SAME KTM as people here are used to.  Just like Honda and everyone else, they are simpler, cheaper, designs built in a country not known for producing quality stuff. Yet.  

 Maybe, maybe not.

 I sure won't be in the first wave to try.  ;)

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It's true, if it's crap the guys who bleed Orange will be the Beta testers ... if they burn them it will crush KTM's effort.  KTM claim Bajaj are making great strides forward. We'll see ...

and I won't be first in line with a deposit. I'll give it at least a year or two ...

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It's true, if it's crap the guys who bleed Orange will be the Beta testers ... if they burn them it will crush KTM's effort.  KTM claim Bajaj are making great strides forward. We'll see ...

and I won't be first in line with a deposit. I'll give it at least a year or two ...

it look heavy.  The 390 duke weighs 306 lbs dry. If the 390 ADV weighs in like the 690 R of 331 lbs dry and with less power, there is no point owning a 390 ADV

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it look heavy. The 390 duke weighs 306 lbs dry. If the 390 ADV weighs in like the 690 R of 331 lbs dry and with less power, there is no point owning a 390 ADV

Why not get an EXC?

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Why not get an EXC?

Fair point. But don't forget ... Bajaj are making this bike, not KTM. KTM designed the "look" of the bike but Bajaj designed the motor, based on what I've read. Also, I'm pretty sure it's not being designed as a race bike like your 450EXC. It'll be a motor designed to go BIG miles, do long range riding in ALL conditions. More like the 250 Dual Sport class ... they can be run hard, put away wet and run and run and run ... all with almost NO maintenance compared to what the 450, 500 require.

 

The 690 is more street oriented but I'd bet the Bajaj KTM's will be even more mild state of tune. So really, a whole different sort of bike. It may look like a KTM ... but it's really a Bajaj.

 

Look at the bikes (and cars) Bajaj manufacture for Indian home market. Look at their competition and what they make. Hero (formerly Hero Honda) are the biggest, with about 10 major Chinese and Japanese brands there too. Of course Enfield are still made there and now being exported world wide.

 

KTM/Bajaj's Duke 200 will have to be a work horse to be a success in India. No finicky high performance bikes need apply. I'm thinking this same theme will apply to the 390 series as well. 43 HP is plenty for a 400cc bike. Could they make it lighter? Sure ... but then the price would double. Could they get 50 HP out of it? Yes again, but then you'd have to do rebuilds every year or so.

Everything is a compromise.

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Why not get an EXC?

I still need to do a lot of mod on the 500 exc.

First, I don't want a dirt bike, I want a Dual Sport bike.

DS mean dual sport, not plated dirt. Getting a plate is not a sport.

500cc is a bit more than what I need (this depend on the final weight of the bike)

350-400cc and less than 270 lbs is what I want. (500 exc met my weight criteria)

 

Mods I need to do on 500 exc:

1. change out knobby tires

2. lower bike by 4-5 inches

3. maybe a bigger gas tank

4. ADV bike need some fairing

5. ADV riders might want to change the spockets for touring

Edited by mrtt

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The ONLY thing it will have over an exc is oil capacity. Maybe.

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What scares me the most is us KTM guys sounding like Honda guys. 

Oh, don't worry, you sound nothing like a "Honda guy". To do that KTM would first have to win more championships in every race category than any other company going back to early 1960's in

MotoGP (all classes). Honda even beat Harley at flat track a time or two. Remember Bubba Shobert?

 

KTM are Noobs with no real legacy, can't compare to Honda and it's amazing history. Bow down, you are not worthy Orange Underpants man!  :lol:

 

KTM are doing very well at the moment and I applaud their efforts. They are even suppling engines for Moto 3 (you knew that, right? )  ... they got that deal because ... the Japanese big four told the FIM to let them have it.

Diversity is good ... and that is what KTM gives us. They take chances the Japanese won't. (now why is that? study the history of MC business to find out why!) Most have no clue just how close Yamaha came to going under in the 1980's. Where you riding bikes then? Funny, didn't see many KTM's back in those years. :devil:

 

Honda are currently "Sleeping". KTM can thank their lucky stars for that. But kudos for KTM filling "gaps" in the market and attempting to build "world bikes". I'll sit back and watch, see how they do.

Ya see, I was riding KTM's during the "bad old days" for KTM. Mid 1980's up to about 1999. I could not even count the times I passed dead KTM's during an Enduro in those years. Great riding bikes

(once you did the suspension) but they consistenly ... BROKE DOWN. Around 2000 things took a turn and KTM have got better every year since. Are they up with Honda yet?

Sorry Charlie.

Edited by 54321

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Oh, don't worry, you sound nothing like a "Honda guy". To do that KTM would first have to win more championships in every race category than any other company going back to early 1960's in

MotoGP (all classes). Honda even beat Harley at flat track a time or two. Remember Bubba Shobert?

KTM are Noobs with no real legacy, can't compare to Honda and it's amazing history. Bow down, you are not worthy Orange Underpants man! :lol:

KTM are doing very well at the moment and I applaud their efforts. They are even suppling engines for Moto 3 (you knew that, right? ) ... they got that deal because ... the Japanese big four told the FIM to let them have it.

Diversity is good ... and that is what KTM gives us. They take chances the Japanese won't. (now why is that? study the history of MC business to find out why!) Most have no clue just how close Yamaha came to going under in the 1980's. Where you riding bikes then? Funny, didn't see many KTM's back in those years. :devil:

Honda are currently "Sleeping". KTM can thank their lucky stars for that. But kudos for KTM filling "gaps" in the market and attempting to build "world bikes". I'll sit back and watch, see how they do.

Ya see, I was riding KTM's during the "bad old days" for KTM. Mid 1980's up to about 1999. I could not even count the times I passed dead KTM's during an Enduro in those years. Great riding bikes

(once you did the suspension) but they consistenly ... BROKE DOWN. Around 2000 things took a turn and KTM have got better every year since. Are they up with Honda yet?

Sorry Charlie.

As for realistic dualsports, KTM blows Honda away. Who gives a crap what happened in the 80s and 90,s. KTM made great bikes then, they just didn't have the parts support they should have had. Honda has ancient technology in their 650 and won't build any thing bigger than a 250 because it won't sell worldwide. So, is KTM up with Hondas? As for the dualsport world, they are light years ahead! Not doing so bad in the MX, enduro and adventure classes either.

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I must sound all corn-fused then. I'm a Honda guy AND a KTM guy. Hell,,,, I'm just a "whatever is a good bike" guy to be honest!! LOL!! Just happen to have a Honda and KTM at the moment.  :thumbsup:

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I must sound all corn-fused then. I'm a Honda guy AND a KTM guy. Hell,,,, I'm just a "whatever is a good bike" guy to be honest!! LOL!! Just happen to have a Honda and KTM at the moment. :thumbsup:

I'm not saying Honda is bad. Just saying that they are way behind the curve in the dualsport world. I loved my xr400, just couldn't make it street legal.

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I didn't think you were.  :cheers:

 

Just having fun dropping snarky comments.  :devil:

 

It's a slow day on TT. LOL!!

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As for realistic dualsports, KTM blows Honda away. Who gives a crap what happened in the 80s and 90,s. KTM made great bikes then, they just didn't have the parts support they should have had. Honda has ancient technology in their 650 and won't build any thing bigger than a 250 because it won't sell worldwide. So, is KTM up with Hondas? As for the dualsport world, they are light years ahead! Not doing so bad in the MX, enduro and adventure classes either.

 

As for realistic dualsports, KTM's are dirt bikes with a plate. There is a need for that in Kali, but in Az, where you can plate anything, not so much. A dual sport can do hundreds of miles on the road. An EXC, have fun.

 

Mike

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As for realistic dualsports, KTM blows Honda away. Who gives a crap what happened in the 80s and 90,s. KTM made great bikes then, they just didn't have the parts support they should have had. Honda has ancient technology in their 650 and won't build any thing bigger than a 250 because it won't sell worldwide. So, is KTM up with Hondas? As for the dualsport world, they are light years ahead! Not doing so bad in the MX, enduro and adventure classes either.

KTM are making some great dual sports and great big twins too. You should pay attention to your history son. You can learn a lot from that. I would beg to disagree that KTM made ''great" bikes in the late 80's /90's. When I talked to Randy Hawkins sitting on the trails next to his broke down factory KTM ... he would beg to differ. (Hawkins, multi-time Nat. Enduro Champ). It wasn't just poor parts supply, trust me, I was there, riding them, testing them. The early years really did suck for the 4 strokes. The two strokes were good from the start ... save the CRAP WP suspension which was NEVER EVER close to KYB or Showa. I raced a 300exc in mid 90's. Great bike ... after all the faultls were sorted.

 

But as I said, much has changed at KTM and KTM have learned, and learned fast. Are you aware just how close they came to going bust?  Happended twice actually. The real problem happened after they took the chance and built the 2nd factory (on credit!!!) ... and sales immediately dried up. In late 90's through 2000 or so KTM made the most money off Mini's. They did great, then the bottom fell out of the Mini market and KTM suffered. Market slowed and KTM was in real trouble. Enter Bajaj, huge Indian car/bike/scooter company 20 times the size of KTM.  Bajaj now own at  least half of KTM (last I checked) and may soon own ALL of KTM. They want it, they'll get it eventually, IMO.

 

Eventually those crafty Indians will realize they can "Get Rich Quick" by getting rid of all those expensive German and Austrian engineers, and shut down those expensive factories in Austria. Why pay those high prices when they can build "the same" high quaiity. :lol:  in their factory in India ... and at ONE TENTH THE COST!  PROFITS!!!!

 

Lots of people are in wait and see mode regards KTM. If Bajaj are stupid, they will follow the scenario I laid out above ... but they aren't stupid ... so lets hope they do a "hands off" approach to KTM and just supply the money KTM need and an outlet for cheap small bikes for the Indian and Chinese markets. (390 Duke and 390 ADV)

Never count Honda out. They are an incredibly diverse and creative company ... who know how to survive. It wasn't always good times.

 

BTW, I just heard Honda is getting back into Forumula One next year. They've been out about 10 years. F.I. motors changed this year to a Turbo Six, (was a V-8) Honda knows a thing or

two about this type of motor. Should help rekindle their "racing spirit" as the Japanese like to say. Who knows? Maybe they'll finally get off their ass and build some better, more modern dual sports.

Only about 20 years overdue. In the meantime, KTM should be banking their money and making investment in the future. Honda have.

 

PS: I owned a XR400 in around 1998. It was fitted with a Baja Designs kit, street legal, never a hassle, but later DMV cracked down, mine got through fine. Loved that XR, not fond of the kick starter

after tipped over. :thumbsdn:

Edited by 54321

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