Head is scored, now what?

[ThatoneDRZguy]

So the other day the DRZ started ticking a lot louder than usual so I pulled the valve cover off to see what the problem was. Pulled the valve cover and the cam cap had worked loose. I dug a little deeper and found that the play in the cam had damaged the area that it rides in. Sorry if its not the right term. The exhaust valve clearances where way off, guessing because of the damage. 

 

So thats whats wrong. Now how do I fix it? Obviously I have a new head in my future (can't machine these things right?). My local stealership says that suzuki USA is on backorder "until further notice." So guys what do I do? Should I find another stock one on ebay or something and just swap it out? Is it close in price to upgrade this thing? If it is feasible what do I do?

 

Help a brother out??

 

thatoneDRZguy

[William1]

You have a few choices. All involve having new valves and related because if your old head is fixed, it will have to taken apart and welded up and the right thing is to freshen the valves. You buy a used head, you have no idea what shape the valves are in and a new head has no valves.

 

To fix your old head, a shop takes it all apart. Properly welds the cam journals and then line bores it to be like new. Then fresh valves, springs, cut or replace the seats. Engine Dynamics is a place that specializes in this sort of repair.

Used head, cut or replace the seats, new valves.

New head, buy new valves.

[ThatoneDRZguy]

You have a few choices. All involve having new valves and related because if your old head is fixed, it will have to taken apart and welded up and the right thing is to freshen the valves. You buy a used head, you have no idea what shape the valves are in and a new head has no valves.

 

To fix your old head, a shop takes it all apart. Properly welds the cam journals and then line bores it to be like new. Then fresh valves, springs, cut or replace the seats. Engine Dynamics is a place that specializes in this sort of repair.

Used head, cut or replace the seats, new valves.

New head, buy new valves.

Thanks for replying. Do you think that having my current head repaired will produce a reliable head? Do you have any idea of the cost?

Edited September 26, 2014 by ThatoneDRZguy

[Noble]

As william says the head can be repaired.  There are 2 methods - weld and machine or machine for inserts.  Both methods are reliable.  I do not have the name of a shop, I see William posted one.  As for new valves and springs and all that, yes probably a good idea.  I would let the shop that does the repair decide on the extent of rebuilding.  I have no idea of cost of repair.

 

It would appear that for some reason that bearing journal was starved for oil. Not a great picture but from what I can see it looks pretty ugly.

[BLKRAWB]

Repairs can be made, but used heads can be had and rebuilt really stout as well. if it makes u feel any better I had magnesium vw cases line bored after a similar incident and it made an 8k rpm motor I couldn't blow up. ( I really really tried to).

[ThatoneDRZguy]

As william says the head can be repaired.  There are 2 methods - weld and machine or machine for inserts.  Both methods are reliable.  I do not have the name of a shop, I see William posted one.  As for new valves and springs and all that, yes probably a good idea.  I would let the shop that does the repair decide on the extent of rebuilding.  I have no idea of cost of repair.

 

It would appear that for some reason that bearing journal was starved for oil. Not a great picture but from what I can see it looks pretty ugly.

I'll attach a better picture. I'm not really sure what happened. The bike has oil in it. The cam cap bolts where totally loose when I pulled the valve cover. The cap had 1/8 inch of play in it  . So I guess I'm lucky the whole thing didn't grenade. Im guessing that hole next to where the bolt goes in is what supplies the oil?

 

Repairs can be made, but used heads can be had and rebuilt really stout as well. if it makes u feel any better I had magnesium vw cases line bored after a similar incident and it made an 8k rpm motor I couldn't blow up. ( I really really tried to).

That really does make me feel better. I tried calling the shop that William recommended but they must be closed for the day. They are out in California so I was hoping to catch them before they left, but I will have to wait until tomorrow. Going to be a long wait on eastern time   Do you guys know if all the DRZ heads are interchangeable? For example will any head from any year fit my bike?

 

btw thanks for the help!

[BLKRAWB]

I'd be willing to say all drz, Ltz400 quad and Kawi variants would fit. Tue bb kits all list the entire spectrum

[ThatoneDRZguy]

This one is a little clearer.

[BLKRAWB]

Hows the cam cap look? U cant buy those. They go with the head I believe.

[BLKRAWB]

Its not terrible, but never seen something like it before. Hope it comes out on the cheap. Scout a replacement now, just in case.

Edited September 26, 2014 by BLKRAWB

[Erik Marquez]

Buy a used head, send it to http://fastheads.com/

Get it back in the mail in a few days, install, go ride

[Qqqqqqqqqqqq]

I have used Fastheads in the past .. Great Service

[ThatoneDRZguy]

Ok so, update. I have called fast heads and engine dynamics and both have quoted me for repairing the head. They are looking at pictures of the head that I sent them to see if its feasible for them to make the repairs. Both have offered to repair the head. They however have offered to do it in two different ways. The gentleman at engine dynamics says that he will machine the cap and head will insert a brass sleeve. The people over at fast heads plan to machine the the head and change the clearance (without a sleeve) as I understand. 

 

The prices are as follows

fast heads-$107 

engine dynamics- <$200

 

Also engine dynamics offered to do a valve adjustment for $60 (I already have shims and everything to do it though, should I just do it myself?)

 

It would seem to me (a total laymen) that engine dynamics has a better repair to offer for a minimal monetary increase. Anybody want to weigh in here? Im going to start disassembly now and will check back and decide where to send the head.

 

Thanks,

 

thatoneDRZguy

Edited September 26, 2014 by ThatoneDRZguy

[BLKRAWB]

Changing clearances would mean custom camshaft. Not a bad way to go, but I presume they would weld up the cams and turn, then grind them to New spec. Brass inserts you could get a spare set of them made and be good for wear.

Edited September 26, 2014 by BLKRAWB

[Noble]

The gentleman at Engine Dynamics says that he will machine the cap and head will insert a brass sleeve.------OK, this was one of the options I presented earlier.

 

The people over at Fast Heads plan to machine the the head and change the clearance (without a sleeve) as I understand.-------You need to clarify this as this description does not make sense.  Only 2 options I can think of - weld and machine to original size or machine for a insert to restore original size.  I suppose it is possible to machine the head to a larger size and weld the cam to fit the head but I would not do that.

 

The prices are as follows

fast heads-$107 

engine dynamics- <$200

 

Engine Dynamics offered to do a valve adjustment for $60.------Do it yourself.  Very easy and quick with the head off the motor.

 

Obviously this does not involve any valve replacement or resurfacing.  I would add that to the list at least for evaluation and valve stem seals in any case.

[BLKRAWB]

Glad noble thinks the increased clearance way is the same thing I was thinking.

[ThatoneDRZguy]

 

The gentleman at Engine Dynamics says that he will machine the cap and head will insert a brass sleeve.------OK, this was one of the options I presented earlier.

 

The people over at Fast Heads plan to machine the the head and change the clearance (without a sleeve) as I understand.-------You need to clarify this as this description does not make sense.  Only 2 options I can think of - weld and machine to original size or machine for a insert to restore original size.  I suppose it is possible to machine the head to a larger size and weld the cam to fit the head but I would not do that.

 

The prices are as follows

fast heads-$107 

engine dynamics- <$200

 

Engine Dynamics offered to do a valve adjustment for $60.------Do it yourself.  Very easy and quick with the head off the motor.

 

Obviously this does not involve any valve replacement or resurfacing.  I would add that to the list at least for evaluation and valve stem seals in any case.

 

 

When I spoke to FastHeads on the phone I didn't really understand what they where talking about doing. I did however get from the conversation that they where not going to use a brass insert like the guys at engine dynamics. I sent them a photo of the head, and hey where supposed to call me back but I did not hear from them (friday afternoon they where probably busy). I had planned on asking them to explain when they called back. As far as the valves to they both said that they would check them out and see if they needed any attention as well. 

 

Hope this clears things up  ?

thatoneDRZguy

[BLKRAWB]

Any updates?

[ThatoneDRZguy]

Any updates?

Ok so. As we sit I found a local shop here in Sarasota to hon the cam journals. Price was comparable to everyone else (150$) They honed then out and the cams turn great, and there is no play. I got the valves into spec myself. The bike burned a bit of oil before this all happened so I decided while I had it torn down it would be a good time to change the piston rings. As it has a stock piston I had to order them from suzuki. They arrive tomorrow ?! I got the e model base gasket for the extra pep. Got an appointment at 2 tomorrow to get the cyl honed and have new seals put in for the valves. I'll be assembling tomorrow night. Anybody know any good threads for cam timing??

 

Thanks and stay tuned for a final update by the end of the weekend.

 

Steve   

[ThatoneDRZguy]

It lives! Got it all set. Runs great, valve train seems to be as loud as normal. Took it out on a nice 70 mile ride around town and no problems. Thanks everyone for your help!

Steve