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BBR 240 Big Bore Kit in 230L


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I am putting a BRR 240 Kit (Cam and Piston) in my 230L. I chose the BBR over Engines Only 247cc kit due to the price difference ~$500 to $600. Pulled the motor Friday night and tore down the motor today. Everything looked good. My L has 5.8K miles. My goal for the kit is to be able to hold 2nd gear in Colorado at 12K feet with the 10cc, BBR cam, and 11:1 compression. Right now, it won't hold second on steep inclines like Imogene Pass. My gearing is 12x45 with a 606. Earlier this year, I put Racetech springs and emulators in the forks and a Cogent Rear shock. The suspension was transformed.

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I would suggest if you want more torque to pull you up steep hills then a Web 40mc/402 camshaft would be a better choice.

I have used both...

The BBR is basically a reground stocker to give you more lift.

It creates a step in the power band at about 7,000 rpm similar to a 2stroke when it comes "on the pipe"

It does nothing for torque below that.

The Web cam with your BBR HC 233cc piston is a perfect match for the type of power that your asking for.

The BBR springs are junk and they break, causing bent valves.

(Been there done that)

The Web cam works great with stock springs.

Want even more torque?

1)Use a Pro Com CDI unit.

2)Port your existing Cylinder Head.

IMO:

Your existing cylinder head is more than capable of flowing the same amount of air flow as an "f" head.

They both need to be ported to flow better, no need to buy another head and then have to port it for more flow.

BBR will not give you the specs to degree your cam. Web Cam does!

Unless you degree, your wasting power.

If you advance your cam 1-2degrees you can get a little bit more torque also.

Without cam specs it makes it a lot harder to get that little bit of extra torque as easy.

Edited by adnohguy
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I would suggest if you want more torque to pull you up steep hills then a Web 40mc/402 camshaft would be a better choice.

I have used both...

The BBR is basically a reground stocker to give you more lift.

It creates a step in the power band at about 7,000 rpm similar to a 2stroke when it comes "on the pipe"

It does nothing for torque below that.

The Web cam with your BBR HC 233cc piston is a perfect match for the type of power that your asking for.

The BBR springs are junk and they break, causing bent valves.

(Been there done that)

The Web cam works great with stock springs.

Want even more torque?

1)Use a Pro Com CDI unit.

2)Port your existing Cylinder Head.

IMO:

Your existing cylinder head is more than capable of flowing the same amount of air flow as an "f" head.

They both need to be ported to flow better, no need to buy another head and then have to port it for more flow.

BBR will not give you the specs to degree your cam. Web Cam does!

Unless you degree, your wasting power.

If you advance your cam 1-2degrees you can get a little bit more torque also.

Without cam specs it makes it a lot harder to get that little bit of extra torque as easy.

Did you mean the 282 cam?  I spoke with Webcams and they said the cam you mentioned was for the 150 and specs are smaller than the stock cam both lift and duration wise. 

 

http://www.webcamshafts.com/index_blank.html?pages/vehicle_search.html - 282

 

http://www.webcamshafts.com/index_blank.html?pages/vehicle_search.html - 40mc/402

Edited by gnorv
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Nope if you use the 282 you will be disappointed...that cam is all hype!!!

(No possible way it would increase HP by 5)

You want torque by what you described then you want the 40mc/402. The 40mc/402 will still rev to the limiter quite easy but you will not feel the torque that this cam provides up there any way.

At the altitude your describing you need as much cylinder pressure as possible for that engine to produce any power. The 40mc/402 cam is your best bet for that.

If you want anymore power then you will need a 13-1 250cc piston kit

( PM Teamrude)

If you install the 40mc and are not Impressed, I will buy it from you as long as it's in good condition.

You can also run the 89a cam and get about 10% more power than the 40mc/402 but it will take the 10% from the low end torque and put it on the middle- top of the power band.

If you decide to use the 89a then you will need to change valve springs. (To be safe)

In order to get all the torque back that a 40mc/402 would provide by using an 89a, you will have to purchase and install the Procom CDI unit.

AND

I'm not sure if the "F" Procom will fit on an"L" (your on your own there)

Edited by adnohguy
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Porting the L head is fine if you want to be charged twice as much or do twice as much work yourself. The L ports are in no way comparable to an standard F head in size and flow rates.

An 05 and older 150f cylinder head has smaller ports than a 230 head.

Personally, no one that I'm aware of charges more for a 150 head than a 230?

IMO:

They both ( L-F) have to be ported for max performance...

Unless you get an F head for free, I would suggest to use another shop in that case.

Edited by adnohguy
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Nope if you use the 282 you will be disappointed...that cam is all hype!!!

(No possible way it would increase HP by 5)

You want torque by what you described then you want the 40mc/402. The 40mc/402 will still rev to the limiter quite easy but you will not feel the torque that this cam provides up there any way.

At the altitude your describing you need as much cylinder pressure as possible for that engine to produce any power. The 40mc/402 cam is your best bet for that.

If you want anymore power then you will need a 13-1 250cc piston kit

( PM Teamrude)

If you install the 40mc and are not Impressed, I will buy it from you as long as it's in good condition.

You can also run the 89a cam and get about 10% more power than the 40mc/402 but it will take the 10% from the low end torque and put it on the middle- top of the power band.

If you decide to use the 89a then you will need to change valve springs. (To be safe)

In order to get all the torque back that a 40mc/402 would provide by using an 89a, you will have to purchase and install the Procom CDI unit.

AND

I'm not sure if the "F" Procom will fit on an"L" (your on your own there)

I agree on the cylinder pressure; but, I don't want to go smaller on the cam than stock. I used to drag race and tried different cams.....but, I was dealing with 400 to 462 cubic up inches. How does the BBR cam compare to the 89A?
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Guy, recognize that cutaway head........ For anybody going to port their own head. Take a very good look at thickness at bottom of spring seat!!!! Do not grind too much there or oil leak will occur. If you look at photo's it shows how much room there is in rest of head.

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Installed the motor and ran it for 20 minutes. Also added a Q4. Love the sound. After break in, I let it cool down for a hour and then took it for a spin. Instantly you can tell the throttle is more crisp. The motor feels like it has more grunt down low; however, the biggest difference is the mid range, big difference, the top end feels stronger but I didn't hammer it up top. The motor still starts to fall flat at high rpm, just a lot less less pronounced. I don't have a tach is I don't know rpm. The engine felt snappy at 50 MPH in 6th vs before. I run 12x45 gearing. I can now put in first and pull the front wheel off the ground without the clutch. Will come up in second if you compress the forks without the clutch. Couldn't come close before the kit. My buddy wheelied through 3rd and he always struggled with my bike before..... I can't ride a wheelie.

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So tell us what did you do.

I hate when a thread takes off on a tangent and then ends in "It runs great!" But, which cam did you end up using, did you port the head, did you replace the valve springs? Did you degree the cam????

So many things were discussed and all we know for sure is that you put a Q4 pipe on it and put it back together again, and broke it in.

Not trying to sound like a dick but can you tell us what mods you finally decided on and made.

Thanks!!

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So tell us what did you do.I hate when a thread takes off on a tangent and then ends in "It runs great!" But, which cam did you end up using, did you port the head, did you replace the valve springs? Did you degree the cam????So many things were discussed and all we know for sure is that you put a Q4 pipe on it and put it back together again, and broke it in.Not trying to sound like a dick but can you tell us what mods you finally decided on and made.Thanks!!

I used the BBR Cam and cam springs. I took the sharp edges off the piston. I used the EO cam slotted sprocket and lined up the cam but did not degree it....BBR does not give the specs. The cam is a regrind with a smaller base circle. I did not port the head. I tried to keep the cost reasonable. With the machine work, kit, sprocket and a couple gaskets, new plug I had about $450 in the build. That's the reason I didn't go with the EO kit or do port work. I also had new valve seals installed. 6.2K on the motor. The rings were within spec.....we did not have to file.

I did not to experience the "on the pipe" that Adnohguy stated above with the BBR cam. Don't know if they changed the grind? My experience with cams is once you are close the differences aren't that big unless you really move the power curve with duration and lift...once you go that route you have to upgrade your head/s or port. That was on a stroker 461 Poncho. I wanted to keep the tractor... Going so slow you can count the thumps power curve. Plus I could end up putting in a ton of money and have a very expensive 230L. I did the emulators and springs on the front, Cogent rear shock (it's awesome!)...both transformed the bike. Now, with the big bore and pipe, I have a great trail bike for me. I was ok with the power here in KC; but, was frustrated in CO on the steep stuff above 10K even when jetted properly.

Edited by gnorv
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Way, way back when I traded 3gas powered scooters for my very first 2005CRF150f, I had all BBR items that they sold (at the time) that Improved performance.

Cam, springs, pipe, rev box, big carb, 170cc BBK, clutch springs, etc.

I also ported the head.

It was advertised with all that it would add 3hp (with out porting)

Yes it made a difference, it ran good, would go right to the limiter at any time. It had a big step in the power band at approx 7,000 rpm.

It felt like a 2stoke when it came "on the cam"

Three rides into it one outer valve spring broke and bent the exhaust valve.

I had to tow it out of the middle of no where for approx 5 miles with my sons XR70.... NO FUN!!!!

Very disappointed of course, I installed the stock springs and reinstalled the stock rev box. I rode it another three years with no more problems.

But then I got to know Mike Coe and he talked me into buying a 230.

Since I wanted low end torque for tight single track, he told me that I needed more compression, and a torque cam. He sent me Web 40mc/402 cam, I installed a BBR 233cc HC piston kit and ported the head on my 2005 230 that I purchased used at the time.

That bike had the best power band, tons of low end torque that would not quit! I short shifted it all the time and held it wide open. You could feel the power pulses and it Pulled like a tractor, but would rev to the limiter if required (up really gnarly steep single track if there was no way to shift, but I always up shifted as soon as I could.)

I started running a 15 tooth counter with that engine because 1st gear was useless with out it.

By far my favorite engine build of that time.

Of course, since then, Mike has talked me into many more builds that are all 12.5 250's (three bikes and 4 engines)

With Mike out of business now, I'm in the middle of another build....13-1 270cc stroker. (Teamrude)

The excitement never stops!

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As stated many times before, BBR does not divulge cam specs. (Maybe they don't want to be embarrassed?) lol

But just because they don't confess, does not mean you cannot degree it yourself. Just calculate the "LSA" or "LCA" (your preference) with your degree wheel. And set it up 1-2 degrees advanced.

Then unless you port your head your not going to feel it "get on the cam" and that will be about all you can get unless you add a "Procom" (more low end torque and 200 rpm over rev) or a larger carb. (More top end)

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I took the bike out on the highway today and it bounced off the rev limiter at 75 MPH. I run 606s. I have read the front 606 makes the speedo accurate. 50% wear on the tires. I didn't have to tuck much. Fastest I have gone before in similar position/wind etc was 68. I run 12x45 gearing.

Edited by gnorv
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I took the bike out on the highway today and it bounced off the rev limiter at 75 MPH. I run 606s. I have read the front 606 makes the speedo accurate. 50% wear on the tires. I didn't have to tuck much. Fastest I have gone before in similar position/wind etc was 68. I run 12x45 gearing.

 

Sounds like it runs well. I am considering this upgrade.

What pilot and main did you end up with?

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