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Yamaha's stab at KTM


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As you probably already know, Yamaha released the new 2015 YZ250FX and updated WR250F, both based on the YZ250F. I would really like to see them do the same thing with the YZ250 two stroke to make it more woods friendly from the factory. I would like another 2T and don't want to blindly jump on the KTM bandwagon just because there aren't many options for singletrack bikes available. I have always been a huge yamaha fan and would like to see them expand their lineup. Does anyone know if they are planning on making an offroad version of the YZ250?

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Just curious as to why you want to stick to a brand which has basically had the same 2T for almost 10 years? Why not look into Beta, GasGas, Husqvarna TE300, etc...? All bike that are specifically designed for offroad? 

 

I definitely think it'd be good for yz to redo the 250, maybe even make a 300, but they seem pretty stuck on their current design. 

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I don't see them doing it, given the limited changes we have seen over the past 10 years, although I hope I am wrong.

The good news is that if you don't need a wide ratio gearbox, it is easy and inexpensive to do the conversion yourself and the result is as good as anything out there.

The advantage of the Yamaha (or KTM) is that you can sell it when you are ready for a change and there are lots of parts and knowledge around to make it work at whatever you want it to do.

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Other than making a factory 300. I don't see a better woods bike out there than the YZ250. Sure it lacks some basic woods equipment. But that stuff's easy to come by. If you look back over the years at all the woods two strokes make by the Japanese manufacturers. You quickly find that people found it much easier to start with the motocross bike if you wanted to end up with the best woods bike. Sometimes the woods bikes would be a good source of parts. But often that wasn't even the case. 

 

My biggest issue sourcing a bike now is finding a nice 2004 because I don't like the aluminium frame.

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  • 2 weeks later...

Ya, KTM's suck! Specially those tiny batteries and the button on the right side that weigh like 10 pounds and only start the bike like 10 times. Shoulda put them on the left where they'll weigh less and last at least twice as long. Screw the electric start anyway - I'd much rather kick start my bike on a rooty and rocky hill, even on a river crossing. Stupid KTM's.

Edited by zderekv
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When comparing prices between the KTM and Yamaha, you could deck the blue one out with all sorts of crap before you reach the price of the orange. BUT, the Yamaha still won't have the magic button...

 

The &%$#@! are you talking about?

 

2014 YZ250 MSRP - 7150, 7290 in 2015

2014 250SX MSRP - 7199 (couldn't find 2015 MSRP right off)

 

$49 worth of crap to deck a bike out with? And to get an engine that has had no real updates in a decade, lesser suspension, etc. You got a real winner there.

 

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The &%$#@! are you talking about?

 

2014 YZ250 MSRP - 7150, 7290 in 2015

2014 250SX MSRP - 7199 (couldn't find 2015 MSRP right off)

 

$49 worth of crap to deck a bike out with? And to get an engine that has had no real updates in a decade, lesser suspension, etc. You got a real winner there.

Woods bike not MX bike was the comparison.

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The &%$#@! are you talking about?

 

2014 YZ250 MSRP - 7150, 7290 in 2015

2014 250SX MSRP - 7199 (couldn't find 2015 MSRP right off)

 

$49 worth of crap to deck a bike out with? And to get an engine that has had no real updates in a decade, lesser suspension, etc. You got a real winner there.

Are you honestly saying the KTM susp compares to the Yamaha? You sober?

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Are you honestly saying the KTM susp compares to the Yamaha? You sober?

Plus the hydraulic clutch feels like shit and those damn Brembo brakes couldn't stop a tricycle!

But all kidding aside, unless you're 160 lbs you need to send your forks and shock out to be worked anyway and when you get them back from a reputable shop, ya, I can see them comparing.

What's up with the recall on the '15 YZ's? I think I read it was some sort of engine failure but I was just scanning trough.

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Woods bike not MX bike was the comparison.

Yamaha doesn't have a two stroke woods bike, at all. OP was wishing the YZ250 would be updated like the YZ250FX and WR-F. The only Yamaha woods bikes (all four stroke) have a electric start, another thing that has been stated as a 'bad' for the KTM in all previous posts. Now why would I have been thinking everyone in this &%$#@!ing thread has been talking about the YZ250....?

 

As you probably already know, Yamaha released the new 2015 YZ250FX and updated WR250F, both based on the YZ250F. I would really like to see them do the same thing with the YZ250 two stroke to make it more woods friendly from the factory. I would like another 2T and don't want to blindly jump on the KTM bandwagon just because there aren't many options for singletrack bikes available. I have always been a huge yamaha fan and would like to see them expand their lineup. Does anyone know if they are planning on making an offroad version of the YZ250?

Just curious as to why you want to stick to a brand which has basically had the same 2T for almost 10 years? Why not look into Beta, GasGas, Husqvarna TE300, etc...? All bike that are specifically designed for offroad? 

 

I definitely think it'd be good for yz to redo the 250, maybe even make a 300, but they seem pretty stuck on their current design. 

I don't see them doing it, given the limited changes we have seen over the past 10 years, although I hope I am wrong.

That would be the YZ250, not the just recently spawned into existence YZ250FX woods bike.

the YZ250. Sure it lacks some basic woods equipment.

Yz250 ... Yes it would be awesome to for them to come out with a more trail oriented bikes. But you can build a yz woods weapon for damn near the difference in price between a Yamaha and ktm.

 

 

And as far as woods bikes...

YZ250FX MSRP - $8749 (2015)

250 XC MSRP - $8199 (a year old MSRP, couldn't find '15 prices)

 

So where's this giant gap between KTM and Yamaha? Only thing I see is a price gap in bike type, regardless of manufacturer.

 

 

Suspension wise - well, really any bike should be set up for the rider's weight if not at manufactured spring rates. Personal preference and what you use the bike for really decides what works best for you. I'll give you that they can be equal or Yamaha suspension better.

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Yamaha doesn't have a two stroke woods bike, at all. OP was wishing the YZ250 would be updated like the YZ250FX and WR-F. The only Yamaha woods bikes (all four stroke) have a electric start, another thing that has been stated as a 'bad' for the KTM in all previous posts. Now why would I have been thinking everyone in this &%$#@!ing thread has been talking about the YZ250....?

 

That would be the YZ250, not the just recently spawned into existence YZ250FX woods bike.

 

 

And as far as woods bikes...

YZ250FX MSRP - $8749 (2015)

250 XC MSRP - $8199 (a year old MSRP, couldn't find '15 prices)

 

So where's this giant gap between KTM and Yamaha? Only thing I see is a price gap in bike type, regardless of manufacturer.

 

 

Suspension wise - well, really any bike should be set up for the rider's weight if not at manufactured spring rates. Personal preference and what you use the bike for really decides what works best for you. I'll give you that they can be equal or Yamaha suspension better.

 

Using your figures, the 14' YZ250 (2stroke mx bike) = $7150 while the 14' 250XC (2stroke woods bike) = $8199. Difference = $1049, I suspect it is this difference in price that 4strokerepelent is applying to a YZ250 to make his "woods weapon". That difference would be even greater if you used the MSRP of the 250XC-W instead of the XC.

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Plus the hydraulic clutch feels like shit and those damn Brembo brakes couldn't stop a tricycle!

But all kidding aside, unless you're 160 lbs you need to send your forks and shock out to be worked anyway and when you get them back from a reputable shop, ya, I can see them comparing.

What's up with the recall on the '15 YZ's? I think I read it was some sort of engine failure but I was just scanning trough.

That's a good point, I just read about the recall. Luckily it was only on here from your post. If Yamaha could sort out there suspension and just stick to a proven engine design with some minor refinements they might just be onto a winner.

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That's a good point, I just read about the recall. Luckily it was only on here from your post. If Yamaha could sort out there suspension and just stick to a proven engine design with some minor refinements they might just be onto a winner.

They're making strides in the right direction anyway. I'm a woods rider and I ride a euro bike because it's more sensible than modifying an MX bike. Others will disagree and they can ride whatever they want but Yamaha obviously knew they were losing ground by the mile in the off road market or they wouldn't be going through such a major overhaul to create a true woods bike.

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That's a good point, I just read about the recall. Luckily it was only on here from your post.

Not much of a Yami guy but this was actually posted here. Looks legit.

https://thumpertalk.com/index.php?/topic/1115839-Yamaha-Recalls-YZ250-Competition-Off-Road-Motorcycles-Due-to-Risk-of-Injury%2C-Death

Edited by zderekv
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