Traded up to a XR400, with some problems.

[Pssymon]

Hi,

My name's Roy, I live in the Netherlands and have been riding a KTM 625SMC (supermotard) for 6 years. Since the roads here are literally covered in salt when it's freezing, my KTM was getting some damage/corrosion. I want to keep this bike in mint condition so I went looking for a cheap bike to be used in the winter and had good traction in snow. Another upside would be that I could use my second bike for a little bit of off-roading.
I found a Honda XR125L at a really low price, which I owned for three years. I feared it would not be powerful enough to really work for me, and recently I decided I would sell it and get a XR400 instead, mainly because I wanted more power but still a reliable enduro bike, and the 400 should fit that bill.

After letting a cheap one go, I found another one at a dealer which I liked. It was way out of my price range but the dealer insisted it was a great bike, new brake pads, new chain and sprockets, new oil and filters. He said it was all in order. I did a small test drive and it ran well, I didn't notice any real problems.

The dealer came down to a price I was just able to afford, but since I knew there weren't any other fair XR400's for sale and I liked this one, I bought it.





Here's the problem, it uses a big amount of oil. I called the dealer and asked him what engine oil he had used, he didn't remember but suggested I tried 10W50 oil. Got that and did an oil change. After driving about 100km, I checked the oil level, it wasn't showing on the dipstick. I had to add 600ml (!) of oil to get it back to the 'Upper' point on the dipstick.
I called the dealer again, he told me had seen worse and that the oil usage might nearly disappear if I gave the piston ring a while to settle (at this point I had driven about 300km, he said he had bikes before that would stop burning oil after 500-600km of driving).

Ever since I bought the bike I have been reading here a lot, and I also noticed that my brake light does not work and neither does my horn. If I understand correctly, the XR has two circuits, one of which is responsible for the brakelight, indicators and horn. Could it be a broken voltage regulator? Do I need a original Honda replacement or not, and is this an expensive fix?

Also, a couple of days ago my headlight stopped working when I visited a friend, I had to leave my bike overnight.... I opened up my low/high beam switch and checked all connectors behind the headlight, they all seem fine. Right now my high beam indicator light is constantly on, sometimes it flickers, as it flickers off the headlight turns on again. Maybe someone has an idea what can cause this.

I'd like to hear thoughts/experiences, can the oil problem resolve itself?
The dealer did agree to open it up and fix it if the problem persists, I will call him when I've driven 500km.

Except for these problems the bike runs perfectly though, I really like it!
Any help is greatly appreciated.

[Sam Foster]

I'd send that bike back to him as it sounds like a repair job. How long does your warranty last? As he may be trying to hold you back so that you go outside the warranty period. I'm guessing its just had a new piston ring if your needing it to settle?

[Pssymon]

The thing is, I bought the bike from him without discussing anything about warranty. He gave me his word on that the bike was in good technical condition. I figured that if I would have problems immediately, a good dealer would solve the problem. Especially since I definitely did not cause it, he sold me a bike that did not fit what he said it was.

Later a friend told me that he paid for warranty when he previously bought a car and that I could have problems with the dealer since we didn't discuss it.

So, he is not waiting for my warranty to expire, he told me he will open the engine up if the problem stays and that we would figure it out. I don't think it's reasonable that I should immediately pay hundreds of dollars in repairs for a bike that was bought in 'perfect mechanical condition'.

His reasoning about the oil usage disappearing: It had been standing still for a long time, that's why it might burn oil now and he had previously seen bikes stop using oil suddenly after 500 - 600km of riding. As far as I know there is no new piston ring installed.

[Twiggy0ne]

Have you followed the XR400 oil check routine? If you don't follow the correct procedure, you will not get an accurate reading of the oil level, and hence you might be chasing your tail thinking that your bike is burning oil. Does it exhibit other symptoms of burning oil? Black smoke? Black soot around exhaust outlet?

[Pssymon]

Yes, as far as I know I've been checking it correctly. Always when the engine is warm, I keep the bike upright, clean the dipstick and measure.

The bike definitely shows signs of oil usage, on startup it produces blue clouds of smoke. This disappears when the engine warms up but you can still smell it when driving behind it. Also, the dealer (or previous owner) had mounted the muffler in correctly which caused the exhaust fumes to come in direct contact with the rear fender. I got black smudge (oil) on the fender where it did. It also started to melt the edge of the fender, I fixed this now.

[michigan400]

Sounds like you need a valve job and a new top end. Sorry the dealer is talking crazy,, smoking bikes that use a bunch of oil don't just stop using it unless they completely run out.

[Pssymon]

I do expect him to be wrong, but I'll drive a bit more (have driven about 400km now), at 500-600 he can solve it for me. I'll make sure to keep enough oil in the bike in the meantime. Does anyone have some idea how to solve my electrical problems though?

Thanks.

[Trailryder42]

You need to trace down every wire of the wiring harness and check its ground point for corrosion, pull apart every connector, don't just look at them. Clean them and use a dielectric grease on them. Look for damaged wiring, kinking, etc.

 

Do you have a key switch in the system? Try to determine if there's a short in it causing the problem.

 

It does sound like you're burning a little oil, but to reiterate, you must ride the bike to warm it up, then let it set idling for a few minutes, level on a stand preferably. Then shut it down and check oil level immediately.

 

Smoking on start up for just a little while is usually a sign that the valve stem seals need replacling. Oil that remains in head after shutdown leaks past the seals, into the cylinder and is burned off when next started.

[thumpthis723]

I can tell you that when I got my xr it had been sitting for almost twelve years and did not burn oil when I got it running. It does make sense for a bike that's been sitting to smoke for the first couple mins. I have a funny feeling the salesman is going to leave you high and dry unless you throw more money at it. He has already proven himself dishonest and I wouldn't let him touch the bike with a ten foot pole.

You've got the bike and chances are you can't take it back now. It's time to buy a manual and start work with the thumper community backing you.

Did the brake light ever work? Look for banjo bolts with wires at the master cylinders. That will tell you if you have a wiring issue or if you need to wire a brake switches. Start at the lights and switches and make sure all those are tight and free of

Corrosion.

As for the oil burning. Try and figure out if you can determine when it's burning oil ie. start up, acceleration, deceleration etc. look back every now and then to see what's up.

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[Pssymon]

Thanks for the advice Trailryder and Thumpthis,

I do not have a keyswitch, just an on/off switch. I will do a more thorough check of the wiring soon.
I don't think the dealer will leave me high and dry, I came in contact with him trough a dealer who I've known for years, who is like a friend to me, I don't get the feeling he will wrong me. He has said the bike was in perfect condition, but that may have been what the guy who sold him the bike told him. I'm unsure what maintenance he actually did himself. As I understand the bike was owned by a guy who let this dealer service his bike before he sold it to him.

Since I had to stretch my budget a bit, I'm short on cash right now so I will definitely take him up on what he promised and have him fix the problem, that is, unless he wants me to pay a ridiculous ammount of money. If he acts difficult I will take it to the other dealer who I know well. He has helped me in the past, but I feel the dealer who sold it should stand by what he said and fix it.

Offcourse I will stick around here, you guys are helping me out tremendously already. Thanks for that.
I will take a closer look at the brake light switches as well.

On another note, I was aware of Gordons mods, and took a look at the bike (under the seat as well) a few days ago, but it seems that won't be neccesary:

 

 

Edited December 8, 2014 by Pssymon

[Sam Foster]

In England I think all dealers are obliged to sell cars/bikes with a certain amount of warranty. This is to stop buyers getting ripped off, especially as he said it was in "perfect condition" but of course I dont know if the same applies in the netherlands i'm afraid.

 

I would still take it back to him Asap and if hes happy to pull it apart at his expense then it will only be a positive for you  ? . I wouldn't keep pushing it back though as you may kick yourself for not doing it sooner.

[sTTeve]

Hi Roy - i am from Holland as well. I had the same problem with the light, turned out to be a broken wire at the regulator, bought an XR600 one at a breaker in Vaassen. Easy fix, and soldered the old one recently to keep it as a spare. Re your oil issues, i think a top end job is needed to fix it permanently. You have the legal right to a warranty, no matter what the seller tells you. No wondering were did you find it? Cheers / Steve-Hilversum

[Pssymon]

Hey Steve, I will take a closer look into that, good to hear your experience with this. I know the exact shop you mean, they have a good number of enduro bikes. I was looking for an XR over there as well.

I got the bike from Folkers motoren in Westerbork, a small Enduro / Cross bike shop. Putting some more miles on the bike and will contact him again soon.

[Pssymon]

So I took another look at the XR last night, after Steve's message I decided to check the regulator behind the headlight.

Unbolted the clamp and didn't notice anything weird:



But then as I was looking at these components some more, a wire just fell off the condensator, it had broken inside of the heat shrink tube:

 

I took the old heat shrink tube off and had to borrow a soldering iron (I never solder anything normally) and got it to attach well enough. I didn't have new heat shrink tubing so used some teflon tape and zip tied it to keep it from unraveling.



Having fixed this, I hoped that I had restored my headlight to normal but instead, I got my horn and breaklight back haha. The good news is that both my front and rear brake light switch work perfectly so this was an easy fix that managed to do a lot.

Now I have to find out what is causing my headlight to behave so oddly, I'm thinking I need to check and clean up my ground points on the frame first, but I have no idea where they are, can anyone here tell me?

[sTTeve]

Maybe the broken (now fixed) regulator caused the bulb to burn through? I'd first check that!

[Pssymon]

I'd ve very surprised. It still shows the high beam indicator light constantly, this is somehow connected, every time this light was on the heqdlight would not work. I'll probably switch it out just to be sure though.

[bourneaussie]

Check the earth to the headlight bulb (its the green wire on my xr250). My bike was difficult to start when i was on the bush so i disconnted the earth to my headlight so it wasnt powering up when i was kicking it over. When the bike started the main beam indicator was on, once i plugged the earth back in the indicator went out and headlight came on.

As for the oil problem... if its burning oil then its burning oil, it wont just stop thats bs. Has the bike being sitting for a long time or just had engine work done? Strange that he is telling you to ride it for 500k, could half understand that if it had work done to it or it was a new bike... but a used bike... strange thing to say

[Oil Baron]

Check the earth to the headlight bulb (its the green wire on my xr250). My bike was difficult to start when i was on the bush so i disconnted the earth to my headlight so it wasnt powering up when i was kicking it over. When the bike started the main beam indicator was on, once i plugged the earth back in the indicator went out and headlight came on.

 

I installed a switch on my headlight ground for similar reasons.  The high beam indicator is dimly lit when I break the ground.  

 

I also agree, there will be no improvement at 500km with oil consumption.

[Pssymon]

I appreciate everybody's feedback, but if it could in his mind, I'll just drive the remaining 100km and call him. Otherwise he'd probably tell me to drive more again. If that makes him happy I'll just do what he advised, if I keep a good oil level in the bike it can't really hurt right?

After this it's going to be serviced my the dealer I know well so it doesn't matter in the long run.

[thumpthis723]

I appreciate everybody's feedback, but if it could in his mind, I'll just drive the remaining 100km and call him. Otherwise he'd probably tell me to drive more again. If that makes him happy I'll just do what he advised, if I keep a good oil level in the bike it can't really hurt right?

After this it's going to be serviced my the dealer I know well so it doesn't matter in the long run.

Agreed, you will probably get way more out of the bike then you think. It's an xr after all. I'd carry two quarts and two spark plugs and have a good time.

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