Jump to content

Web 40mc/402 Cam is Now 340/402

Recommended Posts

Thanks for noting this change. I plan on ordering this cam for my 230, but I didn't see it listed as an option for a 230. I did find it as specified for a 03-05 crf150, but this is the correct cam for my crf230? This is the cam that has the best reviews on TT when used in a 230 with a compression boost? It's odd that is is listed on web's site specifically for a 03-05 crf150.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Thanks for noting this change. I plan on ordering this cam for my 230, but I didn't see it listed as an option for a 230. I did find it as specified for a 03-05 crf150, but this is the correct cam for my crf230? This is the cam that has the best reviews on TT when used in a 230 with a compression boost? It's odd that is is listed on web's site specifically for a 03-05 crf150.

 

The cams in the early CRF150 and CRF230 are interchangeable.  All the cams listed for the 2003-2005 CRF150 work in the CRF230.

 

We are using this cam with a Wiseco piston as personally recommended by Mike Coe (and a few others) to me.

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hmmm, I just got my cam in the mail 2 days ago.

On the box it lists Grind#40MC/402 PART# 57-031.

Did I get the last one? LOL

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Thanks for the clarification vortec. This is the cam I am going to use also as per your earlier posts. Please let me know how your 230 performs with this setup. I am still undecided if I want to use a std bore wiseco piston11:1 or go with an over bore. My cylinder looks really good and I'm having a hard time justifying the additional expense for a larger piston and boring. From the research I've done, a larger piston is about $100 more than the wiseco std bore, plus an additional $50 to bore. Do you think the additional costs of $150 will pay dividends in performance?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Thanks for the clarification vortec. This is the cam I am going to use also as per your earlier posts. Please let me know how your 230 performs with this setup. I am still undecided if I want to use a std bore wiseco piston11:1 or go with an over bore. My cylinder looks really good and I'm having a hard time justifying the additional expense for a larger piston and boring. From the research I've done, a larger piston is about $100 more than the wiseco std bore, plus an additional $50 to bore. Do you think the additional costs of $150 will pay dividends in performance?

 

We have the budget to bore (and a whole lot more) but we decided to see what we could do ourselves for the least amount of time and money while using pump gas.  In our book there's only two paths:  Cheap and fast or send it to an expert like Mike Coe, Frank Nye, or Terry Miller.  Anything in the middle is just that; in the middle.

 

I already went all the way once with my 1984 Al Baker XR265 so I wanted to try this route for fun.  Total cost for what we're doing will be right around $300 and that's pretty darn affordable for many CRF230 riders looking for just a little more power.  Most owners with a little experience and a few tools can do what we're about to do.

 

As far as displacement goes I definitely would not stop at BBR's big bore kit.  I would go all the way to 247cc or more.  Whatever I could get.  If I was going bigger I would port the intake side, use a bigger cam, carb, and piston, lighter flywheel, and have an expert do all the work.  That $300 just became $1,200.  Not interested.

 

For a small amount of time and money I believe this engine will really wake up and become the low-speed torque monster I'm looking for.  Adnohguy has given the 40mc/402 cam rave reviews, as have others and Mike Coe personally, so I am really excited to get it done.  I think the cam, piston. FMF pipe, ProCom CDI, and PoweRing will all work really well together.  Fortunately my suspension department is already taken care of!

 

After all this is worked out we still have the carb boring available as an option.  My guess is the new setup will tolerate an extra 1mm-2mm bore and not lose much off-idle torque.  I will probably bore the carb in 1/2mm increments until it feels questionable.  Should be a relatively safe approach.  Adnohguy has informed us on many occasions this cam still easily goes to the rev limiter so I'll bet the slightly-bigger carb bore will wake up the top end even more.

 

Low-buck sleeper trail and woods bike.  Except for the FMF head pipe, Fox shock, and PoweRing it will be hard to spot out there.  I'm putting the stock heat shield back on and the Fox shock and PoweRing are hard to spot unless you are a semi-knowledgeable rider.  To most it will look just like a bone-stock girlie bike.  Perfect!

Edited by VortecCPI
  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hmmm, I just got my cam in the mail 2 days ago.

On the box it lists Grind#40MC/402 PART# 57-031.

Did I get the last one? LOL

 

Did you buy directly from Web or from a distributor?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Thanks for the clarification vortec. This is the cam I am going to use also as per your earlier posts. Please let me know how your 230 performs with this setup. I am still undecided if I want to use a std bore wiseco piston11:1 or go with an over bore. My cylinder looks really good and I'm having a hard time justifying the additional expense for a larger piston and boring. From the research I've done, a larger piston is about $100 more than the wiseco std bore, plus an additional $50 to bore. Do you think the additional costs of $150 will pay dividends in performance?

IMO:

Once you add some power, you will really enjoy it. Then you will get used to it and want a little more.

There is no substitute for more cc's! And It's usually the least expensive way to make more power.

It costs way more to do it twice....its your budget, can you afford to just do it all while its apart the first time?

That way you won't be asking yourself "how much better would it be running if I spent the extra the first time I had it apart"

On a bone stock, uncorked, properly jetted 230f:

More cc = more power from idle up to the red line.

More compression = more power from idle up to the red line.

Camshaft selection= adjust power band to the rpm range that suites your riding style.

Usually one of the three. Low rpm torque, mid range surge, top end RPM pulling to the limiter.

Usually the ranges will overlap some what but on a stock, uncorked, properly jetted 230f, it's usually not all three with a "drop in cam" or with out porting the head properly.

The larger the cc's, the higher the compression, the better the porting, the more radical the camshaft can be with out loosing as much low rpm torque. This takes a lot of $ to achieve a wide power band from the very bottom to the limiter.

But extra cc's and added compression is a good place to start.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Did you buy directly from Web or from a distributor?

Direct from Web.

Where are you going for your piston? since I cant get the 240 I'm thinking of going std. bore HC.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Direct from Web.

Where are you going for your piston? since I cant get the 240 I'm thinking of going std. bore HC.

 

MX South via Amazon.   Great price.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

After reading and thinking about the above and Adnohguy's many posts it made me think of another small but valuable piece of information.  I'm not too sure if everybody realizes this so here goes...

 

All other things being equal the impact of a cam on engine performance is directly related to engine displacement.  What got me thinking about this was Adnohguy's many mentions about this cam being good to the rev limiter despite its design goal of low and midrange power in the CRF230.  The bigger the displacement gets the bigger (i.e., longer) the cam must be to maintain the intended usage.  As the engine gets smaller the cam's optimum operating range shifts up.  As the engine gets bigger the cam's optimum operating range shifts down.

 

The above is a generalized statement but those of you with auto engine knowledge know what I mean.  Consider the duration you would select for a small block, such as a 302 Chevy or Ford, and then consider the duration you would select for a big block such as a 454 Chevy or 460 Ford.  Sorry AMC and MOPAR guys -- I'm not very familiar with your engines.

 

So what's my tedious point?  Ahnohguy is making good power up high and getting to the rev limiter with a 40mc/402 in his big 250cc engine.  A smaller engine, like a stock 223cc displacement, should see the power shifted slightly from the bottom to the top as the displacement is only 89% of his 250.  Everybody should understand that displacement has an impact on a cam's optimum operating range.  All other things being equal the bigger the displacement the bigger (i.e., longer) your cam should be.  Of course all other components plays into this, which I why I stated "all other things being equal".

 

Just a little food for thought when you are making decisions about your builds...

Edited by VortecCPI
  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

IMO:

Once you add some power, you will really enjoy it. Then you will get used to it and want a little more.

There is no substitute for more cc's! And It's usually the least expensive way to make more power.

It costs way more to do it twice....its your budget, can you afford to just do it all while its apart the first time?

That way you won't be asking yourself "how much better would it be running if I spent the extra the first time I had it apart"

On a bone stock, uncorked, properly jetted 230f:

More cc = more power from idle up to the red line.

More compression = more power from idle up to the red line.

Camshaft selection= adjust power band to the rpm range that suites your riding style.

Usually one of the three. Low rpm torque, mid range surge, top end RPM pulling to the limiter.

Usually the ranges will overlap some what but on a stock, uncorked, properly jetted 230f, it's usually not all three with a "drop in cam" or with out porting the head properly.

The larger the cc's, the higher the compression, the better the porting, the more radical the camshaft can be with out loosing as much low rpm torque. This takes a lot of $ to achieve a wide power band from the very bottom to the limiter.

But extra cc's and added compression is a good place to start.

 

 

 

Good point ! Do it once and be done as in compleaty done. Big bore big bore big bore. Then you can get on to buying and building the Hayabusa to a 1500  :naughty::lol:

Edited by stevethe
  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Good point ! Do it once and be done as in compleaty done. Big bore big bore big bore. Then you can get on to buying and building the Hayabusa to a 1500  :naughty::lol:

 

I totally agree.  If you have the budget you should go as big as possible.  CR, cam, carb, bore, stroke, ports, valves, head pipe...  Everything!

 

When we get bored with the current little low-buck experiment the next step will likely be an all-in build, but still targeted for low and mid torque as opposed to top-end power.  I think a 270cc would be a major torque monster and be a ton of fun on the trails and in the woods.  If the bigger engine has less need to be spinning like crazy we should also enjoy a good long engine life.  The best of everything.

 

This engine already makes more low-end torque than an XR250.  I just can't imagine what we'd have at 270cc with a good CR and torquey cam.  I assume it would be starting to get somewhat close to the low-end torque of the four-valve XR400 by that point.

Edited by VortecCPI

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I totally agree.  If you have the budget you should go as big as possible.  CR, cam, carb, bore, stroke, ports, valves, head pipe...  Everything!

 

When we get bored with the current little low-buck experiment the next step will likely be an all-in build, but still targeted for low and mid torque as opposed to top-end power.  I think a 270cc would be a major torque monster and be a ton of fun on the trails and in the woods.  If the bigger engine has less need to be spinning like crazy we should also enjoy a good long engine life.  The best of everything.

 

So to a big degree it all works together. A big bore even helps to un shroud the valves. However there is a point at which a big motor torquer doesn't produce much more HP. You need a proper cam and a head to flow it. So the bigger you go the more important porting and a larger cam becomes. A 270cc sounds like fun. Time will tell us on reliability however I rev my 250cc to the moon at times and see no issues.

Edited by stevethe
  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Been talking with Vortec on the biggest bang for least $$$$. 

 

1. The 40/402 cam is simple and awesome bottom mid with great mild overall power compared to stock.

2. The CDI unit is cheap and really bumps bottom midrange.

3. Standard size hi-comp or bore piston to increase compression.

4. Proper jetting and airbox mods.

5. Stock muffler mods and/or power ring

 

These would make a significant change when used as a package. Simple and easy to do. Consider this Stage 1 power kit.

 

Stage 1.5 would be above plus a new headpipe. I will look to see if I can find Powroll old pipe jig and make a batch of inexpensive steel headpipes for these. Of course there is FMF etc out there but seems everybody wants affordable but worthwhile gains. The next part of Stage 1.5 would be mild headwork. On this I mean just fixing problems not a full portjob. A top notch 3-5 angle valve job with backcut valves will easily gain 10% flow at lower lifts.  This will liven response and allow cam to work just that much better. The second part of mild headwork would be to properly open throat are under valves. These are way undersize for relative valve sizing. By opening these you gain flow and flow is of higher quality. So now you have a head that flows more and flows "better" to take advantage of all parts in stage 1.

 

Stage 2 is where the money starts to come in. Either BIG bore or Stroker or both. Then you have some real headwork to consider. Depending on size of motor and intended uses/needs a different camshaft may be wanted. I will be making a hybrid cam for Vortec to give a try. He will compare to 40/402 with all of stage 1 package. This Cam may be best of 40/402 and allow more midrange and peak power with no sacrifices to bottom. May be the ultimate Stage 1.5 cam there is and would even work with stroker and/or big bore package.

  • Like 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Been talking with Vortec on the biggest bang for least $$$$. 

 

1. The 40/402 cam is simple and awesome bottom mid with great mild overall power compared to stock.

2. The CDI unit is cheap and really bumps bottom midrange.

3. Standard size hi-comp or bore piston to increase compression.

4. Proper jetting and airbox mods.

5. Stock muffler mods and/or power ring

 

These would make a significant change when used as a package. Simple and easy to do. Consider this Stage 1 power kit.

 

Stage 1.5 would be above plus a new headpipe. I will look to see if I can find Powroll old pipe jig and make a batch of inexpensive steel headpipes for these. Of course there is FMF etc out there but seems everybody wants affordable but worthwhile gains. The next part of Stage 1.5 would be mild headwork. On this I mean just fixing problems not a full portjob. A top notch 3-5 angle valve job with backcut valves will easily gain 10% flow at lower lifts.  This will liven response and allow cam to work just that much better. The second part of mild headwork would be to properly open throat are under valves. These are way undersize for relative valve sizing. By opening these you gain flow and flow is of higher quality. So now you have a head that flows more and flows "better" to take advantage of all parts in stage 1.

 

Stage 2 is where the money starts to come in. Either BIG bore or Stroker or both. Then you have some real headwork to consider. Depending on size of motor and intended uses/needs a different camshaft may be wanted. I will be making a hybrid cam for Vortec to give a try. He will compare to 40/402 with all of stage 1 package. This Cam may be best of 40/402 and allow more midrange and peak power with no sacrifices to bottom. May be the ultimate Stage 1.5 cam there is and would even work with stroker and/or big bore package.

 

Awesome.  I would call this an "NSA Kit" as in No Screwing Around.  It works right out of the box.  No missing parts.  No questions.  No guessing.  Install it and enjoy.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Question, has anybody tried the 110-X1 Megacycle cam???? Appears just a touch larger than 40/402 (especially on intake where needed) yet has great lobe centers of 102-106. Overlap is barely larger than 40-402 and will work with stock springs. 

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Wow.  One giant Thank You to Faith at Web Cam.  She checked on cores and they were out so she got on the phone with their Honda supplier and sourced two brand new cores right while I was on the phone with her.  Outstanding fast and efficient customer service.

 

Two 40mc/402...  I mean 340/402 cams on the way...

 

Thank you Faith and Web Cam!!!

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

When you receive your cam your invoice will show:

 

"Honda CRF 150 F (03-05) SOHC 2v - #340/402 RETARD IN 1.5° ADV EX 1.5° (.975 BC) HARDWELD"

 

I asked Melissa about this and this is NOT a change to the standard grind but rather instructions for the builder to open up the stock lobe centers.

 

That really scared me when I first saw it as I thought I got some sort of special cam intended for another customer.

 

I din't notice this until I received an invoice for the bad cam replacement.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 3/4/2015 at 8:26 AM, VortecCPI said:

 totally agree.  If you have the budget you should go as big as possible.  CR, cam, carb, bore, stroke, ports, valves, head pipe...  Everything!

...or just buy a stock YZ450F for the same price, triple your horsepower while keeping both bikes stock and making the CRF your beginner/buddy bike. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Reply with:


×