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suzuki NECJ needle

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I don't doubt the suzuki needle works better than the stock yz needle (I just ordered one). Otherwise there's about 200 guys on this site that are deluded and I doubt that. So why, if it is such a simple fix, wouldn't Yamaha change it after all these years? I'm wondering what logic could there be behind keeping an inferior, underperforming, tough to jet around needle in Yamahas year after year? Any thoughts?

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Maybe it's made exclusively for Suzuki to Suzuki specs, by mikuni , ? Maybe!!!! Just a thought!!

You mean Keihin , and that's a very good point, could be some protection rights there, never thought of that. I'm a brand loyal old dog that also finds it hard to believe that a Yamaha can't be made to work with Yamaha stuff! I have it very close now with Yamaha stuff but I am close to waving the white flag! If it was referred to only as NECJwhatever I probably would've tried it! Having the name Suzuki in there kind of killed it for me! But this old dog is slowly coming around :-)

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 So why, if it is such a simple fix, wouldn't Yamaha change it after all these years? I'm wondering what logic could there be behind keeping an inferior, underperforming, tough to jet around needle in Yamahas year after year? Any thoughts?

 

I have wondered the same thing! Same can be said of the slide. So many saying the No 8 is much better then the No 7 so why hasn't Yamaha changed it? Same thing about the ignition timing. Why are all the bikes shipped too advanced? Same thing about squish. Why make it so wide? Well, some will say it is to allow for variations of course.

 

So now Yamaha releases a brand new 250x with different cylinder porting, head, power valve, governor spring, CDI, and exhaust pipe, but they leave the carb totally unchanged. Why?

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Ah, thanks for the correction! Lol

I haven't tried the needle or the other slide, but I did ride the bike, I thought it was Awsome , I'm sure yamaha thinks so too!

But I guess there's always room to improve

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Ready to pop my suzy needle in there tonight or tomorrow morning just need to research the PJ and MJ to go with it.  Any info on that would enhance this thread, not to mention my riding fun.  LOL

 

elevation 1200-4k

temps high 40s high 70s

Edited by Sycamore

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Maybe it's made exclusively for Suzuki to Suzuki specs, by mikuni , ? Maybe!!!! Just a thought!!

But if it works so well, why wouldn't Yamaha use the Suzuki taper specs to cure their jetting issues? I'm sure a taper is not patentable, just like a jet hole size isn't. And with regards to the squish... there's no way they can't hold to much tighter specs--so they give themselves a .050 margin of error. I think there might be something else about the squish behind their thinking. 

 

But again, if the squish is such an improvement and easy to fix and the needle is such an improvement and easy to fix--why don't they? 

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It would be great to get a perfect bike from the show room floor and I'd MUCH rather be riding then messin with stuff that should have been done at the factory.  BUT, there hasn't been a bike I have bought new that didn't need some work.

 

Maybe that's why I'm kinda having fun fixing stuff on my cheap-o 06, I expect things to be wrong with it and it's fun bringing it up to speed.  Last week I hand tightened the clutch saver bolt and it just broke off, I actually laughed.  I doubt very much that I'd laugh with a new bike.  LOL 

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I don't doubt the suzuki needle works better than the stock yz needle (I just ordered one). Otherwise there's about 200 guys on this site that are deluded and I doubt that. So why, if it is such a simple fix, wouldn't Yamaha change it after all these years? I'm wondering what logic could there be behind keeping an inferior, underperforming, tough to jet around needle in Yamahas year after year? Any thoughts?

 

Yamaha spec'ed that duel taper N3xx needle for mx use. That rich to lean transition provides that hit that mx guys like at the expense of a little rougher running bike just before the transition. There are a few other series of needles that are richer than the Yamaha N3xx needles at the transition and run even rougher, NOZx , N1Ex to name a few of the more common needles.  I'm sure that Keihin would provide that NExx needle to Yamaha for a price. There are a few cases where the OEM's share a series needle. Currently both Yamaha and KTM share that N3xx series needle. KTM also uses that exact same taper profile, but with varying clip heights, N8Rx, N4xx,. Suzuki and Kawasaki also share a triple taper N3xx needle that is very good and works well in the YZ. They also shared an NOZx and N1Ex series needles. Even Honda and Suzuki shared  keihin series needles at one time. So in short, I think they could, if they really wanted to.

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So how much of a difference is there in the Yamaha N3CJ and Suzuki NECJ needles?  I own a number of Yamaha needles, the stock N3EJ, N3CK, N3EK, and N3CJ needle (which I have not tried yet).  I'm late to the whole NECJ needle discussion.  

Edited by Captain.Olives

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So how much of a difference is there in the Yamaha N3CJ and Suzuki NECJ needles?  I own a number of Yamaha needles, the stock N3EJ, N3CK, N3EK, and N3CJ needle (which I have not tried yet).  I'm late to the whole NECJ needle discussion.  

 

Both needle jets have a  starting diameter of 2.745 (J), but the Suzuki needle has a 3rd taper, where as the Yamaha needle only has 2 tapers. The Suzuki needle provides a smoother transition off of the 1st taper and into the 2nd, due in part to that additional taper.

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Ready to pop my suzy needle in there tonight or tomorrow morning just need to research the PJ and MJ to go with it.  Any info on that would enhance this thread, not to mention my riding fun.  LOL

 

elevation 1200-4k

temps high 40s high 70s

 

Don't be surprised if that NECJ needle is a little lean. It's cold up  here in the north east. You may need to use a W or even an H starting diameter needle for this weather.

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Don't be surprised if that NECJ needle is a little lean. It's cold up  here in the north east. You may need to use a W or even an H starting diameter needle for this weather.

Really? for morning lows (crack of dawn) in the high 40s to mid day highs of high 70's.  I'm in AZ and this time of year those temps are what we are having typically, right  now highs mid 60s. So that needle may be too lean?

Edited by Sycamore

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Really? for morning lows (crack of dawn) in the high 40s to mid day highs of high 70's. I'm in AZ and this time of year those temps are what we are having typically, right now highs mid 60s. So that needle may be too lean?

if your using a xxxJ now it won't be any worse. I've found the J to be lean even in the summer on my bike.

Remember to go down on your main with the suzuki needle. Compare the tips of each and see.

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if your using a xxxJ now it won't be any worse. I've found the J to be lean even in the summer on my bike.

Remember to go down on your main with the suzuki needle. Compare the tips of each and see.

J as in stock needle or J as in NECJ, or does the J designation mean they are the same and that's your point?  the 06 uses the stock J needle #2 position I believe and I'm on that now and hoping to use the suzy needle. 

 

I was going to try a 45 PJ the NECJ #3 and undecided on the main.  Currently it is a 172, thinking 170??  Next month I will go to the 8 slide but for now playing with it.  again temps crack of dawn 40s to 70s elevation 1.2k to 4k 

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The last letter (J) is the diameter. Is is the same on the stock and NECj. The rest of the needle is different.

I think I dropped one on the main. Could be two. Sorry can't recall.

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Yamaha spec'ed that duel taper N3xx needle for mx use. That rich to lean transition provides that hit that mx guys like at the expense of a little rougher running bike just before the transition.

 

But they just used this same needle in the new YZ250X, which was designed for decidedly non mx use, and apparently is super smooth everywhere.

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