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KTM WP Forks on My X-Trainer

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I successfully swapped the forks off of my 2012 KTM XC to my XT. The suspension on my KTM is great and has saved my ass many times, I wanted the same on my XT. I had the WP forks tuned and shortened 1" previously so they were the same length as the XT forks. Here is what was involved with the swap:

I knew that the beta wheel would fit the KTM using the KTM spacers, and since I wanted to keep the Beta wheel no issue here.

The KTM forks would not fit in the Beta clamps, nor would the complete KTM triples fit in the Beta steering neck. The KTM forks were larger and would not fit into the lower Beta triple clamp. The KTM stem was also longer than the Beta stem and the top of the shaft was a different size, so the top clamps were not interchangeable.

I completely disassembled both bikes. I pressed both stems out and put the Beta stem in the lower KTM clamp. I then reassembled using the Beta top clamp. I used the complete KTM brake system. I transferred the Beta fork protectors over to take WP forks also. The Beta fender mounted perfectly to the lower KTM clamp. I then put the KTM axle spacers in Beta wheel an installed the front wheel.

Since the WP forks had already been shortened and were the same length, the bike sits level without having to move the forks up in the triple clamps.

In a nutshell: 2012 KTM 250 XC WP forks on a XT. I used the KTM lower triple clamp, Beta stem and bearings, Beta top triple clamp. Beta fender, fork guards and front wheel. KTM axle and wheel spacers, complete KTM Brembo brake system.

image.jpeg

Edited by jeffrow68
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Nice job Jeffrow - looks factory, and hopefully you like the WPs on the Beta as much as you liked them on the KTM.

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I like it jefrow68! Does the XC have the closed-cartridge fork, or the open-cartridge forks? From the sounds of your clamps that means the XT triple clamps are different to the RR triple clamps then because the KTM stem is 8mm shorter than the Beta stem on the RR. I know coz I am having a set of KTM triple clamps modified at the moment to be able to fit the RR. Let us know how the bike performs with these forks.

 

Utter insanity to actually choose WP forks for anything

 

What is the basis of your opinion? ALL WP forks, or just one of the OC, CC, 4CS, or CV forks? All of them are superior once tuned by a tuner that is worth their salt when compared to the Marzocchi's I have on my 498RR - and I actually really like my zokes except for the durability of them. And the Olle forks are pretty much an unknown quantity in this segment, so your opinion smacks of just being a WP hater rather than an objective and informed opinion. Am I wrong, or do you have something to back your opinion up?

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I like it jefrow68! Does the XC have the closed-cartridge fork, or the open-cartridge forks? From the sounds of your clamps that means the XT triple clamps are different to the RR triple clamps then because the KTM stem is 8mm shorter than the Beta stem on the RR. I know coz I am having a set of KTM triple clamps modified at the moment to be able to fit the RR. Let us know how the bike performs with these forks.

 

 

What is the basis of your opinion? ALL WP forks, or just one of the OC, CC, 4CS, or CV forks? All of them are superior once tuned by a tuner that is worth their salt when compared to the Marzocchi's I have on my 498RR - and I actually really like my zokes except for the durability of them. And the Olle forks are pretty much an unknown quantity in this segment, so your opinion smacks of just being a WP hater rather than an objective and informed opinion. Am I wrong, or do you have something to back your opinion up?

 

You can like what ever you want, of course, it is your right.

But that doesn't not make it a good or logical desicion, from my point of view.

WP makes pretty much the worst suspension on the planet, when it comes to taking control of the wheel/shaft speed under all conditions.

This is inclusive of all modification forms from any aftermarket company.

 

WP forks are precision made and light. That's thier advantage

WP forks have tiny little pistons, flex like crazy, and wear out bushings very fast. That's their disadvantge. The flex and binding issue is huge with all thier models.

 

I have sent (4) sets of WP forks (CC and OC) to multiple tuners to try and get them to perfrom as good as stock KYB SSS or Showa 2005+ CC forks.

I never would expect them to perform as well as properly set up KYB or Showa

I am no stranger to custom tuning suspension specifically for my riding needs.

I ride 45+ times a year using typically (4) separate bikes, so one is always ready.

I have used the following companies to try and solve the problems on my 2012+ 450 SXF, 500XCW, 350 XCFW, and have dealt with friends problems as well.

 

To be fair, all the tuners made an overall improvement to the ride quality....they effectively raised the speed at which the problems were happening on rough choppy hard terrain.

 

Smart performance

KTM World

Super Plush

NV2

Precision Concepts

Steric Racing Suspension

 

KTM World came in with the best results......at $1300 for a complete change in the design of the damping systems front and rear.........but they would still flex and bind.

http://www.ktmworld.com/suspension-service.html

All they really did was raise the speed at which the forks start to go 'nuts' from about 25 mph to 35mph.

 

The problem is in the design.

Virtually everyting inside the fork is undersized.

Terrible support for the leg bushings makes them bind and wear out in a few hours of hard riding.

The flex makes the front wheel hunt, and when landing from small slow speed jumps, makes them bind to the point of loosing control.

I tried Billet triple clamps from the SXF models which improved the flex problem a few percent.

 

You should really try using LT or Stillwell to re-do your stock forks.

 

Just my opinion, but it's like I feel a duty to fellow dirtbikers to warn them of the WP nightmare....

Edited by KRANNIE
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The WP forks I used are closed chamber, fully adjustable with compression and rebound clickers that actually work, and have already been shortened 1". I did not want to spend the money to attempt to revalve the XT forks since there are no adjustments for rebound, similar to polishing a turd. Too many unknowns. I got lucky with this swap since most of the parts interchanged. Does it feel better? HELL YES! No more po-go sticks or uncontrolled brake dive. It is a completely different, planted feel. Not quite as plush as the XT forks but 100% better everywhere else.

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Not trying to get into a pissing match, but this thread was about a fork conversion on the XT. There have been plenty of questions and interest in a fork conversion for the XT. I did it, and explained the process above, using KTM WP CC forks. I have a complete KTM in my shop that I used for the conversion. That is "why on earth I used the worlds worst forks" for this conversion.

It doesn't make sense to revalve the Olle forks, too many unknowns and limited adjustability. Several others have tried with very limited results, I'm not wasting money or time on this approach.

As far as WP forks, I like them. I haven't heard all the negatives about these nor have I experienced any negatives in performance. I have really pushed my KTM and it has performed extremely well. The Olle forks are like bouncy sticks. Are there other forks that are better than the WP, probably so. I don't have a pair in my possession, nor do I have the triples or axle or brakes to test trial fit them.

So, back to my original thread. For those of you who are interested in a fork conversion on the XT, here is what you need: 48mm WP USD forks, KTM lower triple, KTM axle and wheel spacers, and brembo wheel cylinder. The stem and upper triple are XT, as are the wheel and plastics.

For me and my personal riding style, these WP forks that KTM uses on their woods bikes are awesome and I love them. My confidence level on the XT is much higher with these WP forks vs the Olle. More to come.

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Utter insanity to actually choose WP forks for anything

The current wp oc forks even in stock form are pretty darned good imo.  Its my feeling that for me the revalved wp 48 cc are the best forks I have ever ridden,and Ive ridden a few.

Edited by widebear
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I rode several WP equipped bikes and the ones that were tuned a bit more then an average guy were very good.  On the KTM bikes, WP seemed to need more knowledge and investment then when they are on other brands. Same forks on different bikes/frames do perform very different. This is not the first Beta I seen/heard with WP and most likely not be the last. These forks would not be my first choice however if they were in the garage I certainly would give them a try.

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Nice work!

As A former xt owner, you made the right choice in dumping the stock forks...imho..they are junk and so is the shock.

I think Beta under estimated their buyer market when they targeted it at mainly beginner or put-put riders.

Beta should consider offering a xt race model...just upgrading the suspension and correcting the rake and trail for higher speeds.

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:thumbsup: The simplicity of the the swap gives me hope for doing the same on my 2010 rr without having to do all the necessary groundwork myself. Kudos to Jeffrow for pioneering the way.

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Nice work!

As A former xt owner, you made the right choice in dumping the stock forks...imho..they are junk and so is the shock.

I think Beta under estimated their buyer market when they targeted it at mainly beginner or put-put riders.

Beta should consider offering a xt race model...just upgrading the suspension and correcting the rake and trail for higher speeds.

 They do, its called rr

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Now that you have the wp forks, you should try an

E axle.

 

A few problems with your suggestion mate:

1) Do you know what the difference in triple clamp offset and axle offset are between the Xtrainer and the KTM to know whether there is actually a difference in the ground trail between the 2 that needs to be compensated for by using an e-Axle to change the axle offset? On the RR the triple clamp offset is 23mm whereas the KTM clamps off a 2013 350XC-F is 22mm, but other KTM clamps are anywhere from 18mm through to 22mm, so that would be worth checking. Measuring the axle offset is difficult without specialist equipment, and info on the web is limited too, so finding out what the stock trail is versus the trail using the KTM kit could be very difficult to know whether any sort of offset adjustment using an relatively expensive e-Axle is necessary without actually riding the bike first.

2) I don't think Rekluse do e-Axles anymore - at least, on my searches I didn't come across much anyway. If you know different then please let me know where to look?

3) I believe KTM/WP changed the size of the axle recently so there are 2 different diameter axles available that could result in the "old" e-Axle not fitting newer WP forks.

 

All that being said, I think the e-Axle is a clever idea and it could well be a useful tool if the effects of any trail changes on the Xtrainer with the WP kit is undesirable. From the calculations I have done moving my Beta to the KTM/WP forks off of a 2013 350XC-F will result in more stability from just over 2mm more ground trail. That suits my riding style and terrain as I don't really want a sharper turning bike - I prefer more stability, especially on fire trails.

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A few problems with your suggestion mate:

1)  On the RR the triple clamp offset is 23mm 

 

The Betas have two different offsets - 20mm for the 2Ts and 23mm for the 4Ts

 

GP did the KYB swap on his 300, lost 3mm with the KYB axle lug and made it up with the 4T clamps (our upper and the Beta lower and stem)

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Now that you have the forks figured out, what about the shock?

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