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Terry Miller SuperTorquer 1.5 Cam Test

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Admittedly I only had a 20-30 minute ride session before something electrical decided to rain on my parade...

But.... It was a very satisfying 20 minutes...

You know that the cam profile has the BIGGEST influence on the "personality" of a 4-stokes power delivery... Where the power is, and how it comes on... If your cam profile isn't condusive to the powerband you want... You are paddling with only one oar in the water...Lol...

I have previously setup 2 complete BBR 240 kits for friends of friends.... Cams, pipes, CDI , big bore, jetting.... And the results were much less than stellar.... There was certainly a gain... and the ladies were happy with it... But I thought each time that the gain vs what went into the bike was a huge disappointment....

We know big bores and more compression work every time... We know a good pipe and jetting help every time.... Especially over a stock "muffler" style exhaust like the 230 has...

So in this case, the wildcard has to be the cam profile...

The BBR kitted bikes had what I would call a "lazy" power delivery... Not a defined hit... More power for sure... But lacking personality....

Not so with the ST 1.5 from Terry Miller... Response is sharp and it has a real punch .... Low to midrange is wonderful....midrange is now midRAGE... Lol...If a 220cc thumper can actually rage... And truthfully it has a much better top end than stock cam or BBR cam...  I know the bias isn't top end, but brother, it ain't half bad :)

Very much the mini thumper powerband I was looking for...!!

Mine is geared up from stock ... +1front sprocket/ -1 rear sprocket...  I like to build engines that can pull...And then gear them to pull.... I'm not into revving to the moon and rowing a bike around a track or trail with the shift lever...

Anyways... A big thank you to Terry Miller Vintage Cycle for the time and talent used to offer some awesome specialty cams for the 230 crowd...  

The SuperTorquer 1.5 is aptly named.... I could not be happier with its impact on my power delivery....

Now I'm curious about the other 3 cams that Terry has developed for the 230...  But I will have to hear experiences second hand from those who have tried them... I'm pretty sure that ST 1.5 is staying in my 230 permanently....

 

Had to sneak in a pic of the sexy beast ;)

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

IMG_20170328_143033130.jpg

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Admittedly I only had a 20-30 minute ride session before something electrical decided to rain on my parade...
But.... It was a very satisfying 20 minutes...
You know that the cam profile has the BIGGEST influence on the "personality" of a 4-stokes power delivery... Where the power is, and how it comes on... If your cam profile isn't condusive to the powerband you want... You are paddling with only one oar in the water...Lol...
I have previously setup 2 complete BBR 240 kits for friends of friends.... Cams, pipes, CDI , big bore, jetting.... And the results were much less than stellar.... There was certainly a gain... and the ladies were happy with it... But I thought each time that the gain vs what went into the bike was a huge disappointment....
We know big bores and more compression work every time... We know a good pipe and jetting help every time.... Especially over a stock "muffler" style exhaust like the 230 has...
So in this case, the wildcard has to be the cam profile...
The BBR kitted bikes had what I would call a "lazy" power delivery... Not a defined hit... More power for sure... But lacking personality....
Not so with the ST 1.5 from Terry Miller... Response is sharp and it has a real punch .... Low to midrange is wonderful....midrange is now midRAGE... Lol...If a 220cc thumper can actually rage... And truthfully it has a much better top end than stock cam or BBR cam...  I know the bias isn't top end, but brother, it ain't half bad
Very much the mini thumper powerband I was looking for...!!
Mine is geared up from stock ... +1front sprocket/ -1 rear sprocket...  I like to build engines that can pull...And then gear them to pull.... I'm not into revving to the moon and rowing a bike around a track or trail with the shift lever...
Anyways... A big thank you to Terry Miller Vintage Cycle for the time and talent used to offer some awesome specialty cams for the 230 crowd...  
The SuperTorquer 1.5 is aptly named.... I could not be happier with its impact on my power delivery....
Now I'm curious about the other 3 cams that Terry has developed for the 230...  But I will have to hear experiences second hand from those who have tried them... I'm pretty sure that ST 1.5 is staying in my 230 permanently....
 
Had to sneak in a pic of the sexy beast
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
IMG_20170328_143033130.jpg


Good job on the overall bike, looks like you did a meticulous job from front to rear, top to bottom.
No stone unturned....(I have seen more than the one photo)

Glad to hear that you really like the camshaft, I had a 240 (BBR piston) with the original cam that your cam is based on and to this day, I wish that I kept it. Loved that cam! (HUGE mistake selling it to try out an 89a)

Now, with out hearing "the rest of the story" I'm hoping that you "share" the whole engine build with the rest of us fellow TT'ers?

Most of us know that any engine, to perform at its best, must be the the sum of the components, working together in harmony.

So we know about the cam, we see what pipe your using , (really nice colors on the header by the way) , Pro Com on order, (be ready for another noticeable bump with it)

How did the carb mod turn out? Jetting used? Elevation in your general riding area?

Were you able to utilize the (very well known in some circles) "Mixxer" porting techniques? Can you share ? (Intake manifold Port match to carb and cylinder head, port, bowl)

Compression ratio achieved? With Piston, gasket, different valves, etc?

Suspension: what's been done so far, any more upgrades planned in the immediate future or further down the road?
Weight of bike with a full tank of fuel?

Glad to hear that you went "up" on the gearing!
First gear, IMO, is pretty much useless stock or built.

Surprised: So you have built a few 230's in the past...

So that started the 230 gears to churn away in your head? Good glad to hear that.
What cam(s) and CDI box did you use in those?

(My first 150f started out whole hog with all BBR stuff)

I do like the BBR 240 (233cc 68mm piston kit) with the included copper head gasket. The rest of the components not so much (to be nice) (still have the piston with two sets of new rings and the cylinder for a future project)

Enjoy the bike, please keep us informed.

Guy

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Thanks for the props , Guy!

I will spill all the beans on everything when I get a chance...  I am at work and have to take care of biz ...Although on Friday/payday my interest in thinking about work is waning...

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The BBR kitted bikes I setup for friends were full BBR.... Everything from CDI to exhaust...

No port work .... I just did the install on everything... 

They ran better than stock, but not rewarding for all that was included, IMO...

I was looking for :

"Oh Hell YEAH!!"

and what actually felt like was:

"Well, that's kinda nice.. better than it was"

Edited by mixxer

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The BBR kitted bikes I setup for friends were full BBR.... Everything from CDI to exhaust...

No port work .... I just did the install on everything... 

They ran better than stock, but not rewarding for all that was included, IMO...

I was looking for :

"Oh Hell YEAH!!"

and what actually felt like was:

"Well...that's nice... better than it was"

Edited by mixxer

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The porting on my bike could be labeled in the HVP format that makes the powerbands I like...

I had gotten about another >3mm out of carb venturi size by matching the venturi to the available height of the fully open slide...  

Then as Guy, Terry, and I had discussed... There isn't a lot of meat on the port roof before you a saying hello to the intake spring seat.. my approach was to blend height into width as the shape went from manifold to port.... 

Also a LOT of extra guide boss material on the way to the intake guide... Way too much IMO.... So that was an easy cut and blend.... The small amount the guide protruded into the port is now cut and blended level with my modified guide boss...

Short side radius is now wide/ flat/ generous radius...

And Terry was again spot on with his info on bowl size and shape...

I cut a fresh 4 angle valve job and something I am fond of doing is moving the 45 degree sealing face out to the outer perimeter of.the valve.... You get to make more effective blending cuts with the other angles... Cut the bowl uniform and bigger... And sort of fake like you have a bit bigger valves when you are on stock size ,since you are actually using the periphery of valve as the sealing face and opening the bowl accordingly....

Lots of places even jack up oversize valve jobs... Just cutting the seat to fit a bigger valve... But not cutting the bowl and attendant blending angles.... In which case all you have done is put a bigger obstruction (valve) in front of the same size hole (bowl) .... Very common , albeit sad practice...  Bigger / heavier valve with less flow than stock...  

It's more fun for me to coax a bit more flow out of the same size oem valve....  Don't know why I like it so much... Maybe it's some sort of "and I kicked your ass with one hand tied behind my back" type of thing.... lol...

I saw a lot of "big valves over same hole with less flow" in the  450 quad performance world...  Big valves can flow more ... But not if you don't finish it up right....

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Now, with out hearing "the rest of the story" I'm hoping that you "share" the whole engine build with the rest of us fellow TT'ers?


How did the carb mod turn out? Jetting used? Elevation in your general riding area?

Were you able to utilize the (very well known in some circles) "Mixxer" porting techniques? Can you share ? (Intake manifold Port match to carb and cylinder head, port,



HVP and the Mixxer porting techniques has me very curious. I am not anytime soon up for the challenge to do internal mods, but am learning and acquiring information as to what mods will best suit my needs. So in searching for HVP I have encountered a very detailed description of the methods that I believe you have used for the 230. I think this method is universal for porting. The expertise comes in the expirience of knowing when to say when. It is very difficult to put back material that is removed.

I do hope you will share the details.

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I have shared details in the form of the most detailed how to port threads you will likely find anywhere.... I have covered epoxy filling techniques, for increasing velocity, or creating a better port angle, or both.... and also all the more common techniques of reshaping just the original castings...as far as I know I am the one who originated the term of HighVelocityPorting in order to simply say HVP to describe a style of Porting.. I have generally used HVP to describe the port layouts where I add epoxy to the port floor (although some models benefit from epoxy on the port floor and port roof).. unless something drastic has changed in the porting world, HVP epoxy porting is by far the least common porting technique...

 I have taken a lot of time to post detailed threads for both Yamaha and Honda porting... One on yfzcentral.com ... And the other on trx450r.org

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The bike runs so very well that I was looking on eBay to see if I could find a cheap deal on a complete rear wheel assembly... And mount a street tire up to it for Dyno use... I was really wanting to get some.real power and air/fuel readings...

I hate changing tires to do dyno work... On quads it's easy to swap to a dedicated set of inexpensive Dyno tires / rims...   So I was going to just make an easily swappable rear setup for the 230....

I have found a Dynojet Dyno shop near enough to me that it would work out...

No luck on a cheap wheel assy though....

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I have quite a few hours under my belt on my my Thunder Bunny 230 now...

I have to say that this stock bore engine pulls soooooooo well with this cam... It's a flat out hoot to ride....

Bottom end is wonderful.... Chugs down like a little tractor....

Throttle response is so sharp you would swear it has an accelerator pump carb... Instant and strong...

Mid and upper mid is a flat out grin :) ...  Love it's aggressive midrange pull... 

Top end is much better than stock cam too... 

I can recommend this cam 110% to anyone making a strong as hell stock displacement build ... It works well everywhere....

If I was going big displacement, I would seriously consider Terry's ST 2.5 .... But for what I went with on stock bore , I couldn't be happier ... If I didn't have to hang onto the bars to steer, I would probably just be clapping while riding it... Hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha!!!

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32 minutes ago, mixxer said:

I have quite a few hours under my belt on my my Thunder Bunny 230 now...

I have to say that this stock bore engine pulls soooooooo well with this cam... It's a flat out hoot to ride....

Bottom end is wonderful.... Chugs down like a little tractor....

Throttle response is so sharp you would swear it has an accelerator pump carb... Instant and strong...

Mid and upper mid is a flat out grin :) ...  Love it's aggressive midrange pull... 

Top end is much better than stock cam too... 

I can recommend this cam 110% to anyone making a strong as hell stock displacement build ... It works well everywhere....

If I was going big displacement, I would seriously consider Terry's ST 2.5 .... But for what I went with on stock bore , I couldn't be happier ... If I didn't have to hang onto the bars to steer, I would probably just be clapping while riding it... Hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha!!!

I was quite surprised at the increase in power I got after such a mild cam and piston.  PULL is right!  HOOT is an understatement!

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1 hour ago, mixxer said:

I have quite a few hours under my belt on my my Thunder Bunny 230 now...

I have to say that this stock bore engine pulls soooooooo well with this cam... It's a flat out hoot to ride....

Bottom end is wonderful.... Chugs down like a little tractor....

Throttle response is so sharp you would swear it has an accelerator pump carb... Instant and strong...

Mid and upper mid is a flat out grin :) ...  Love it's aggressive midrange pull... 

Top end is much better than stock cam too... 

I can recommend this cam 110% to anyone making a strong as hell stock displacement build ... It works well everywhere....

If I was going big displacement, I would seriously consider Terry's ST 2.5 .... But for what I went with on stock bore , I couldn't be happier ... If I didn't have to hang onto the bars to steer, I would probably just be clapping while riding it... Hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha!!!

I have a 1.5 st cam too in my 230f and today i ride my bike for first time with my new mods and sh... men I totally agree with you pull like a tractor. Very nice midrange too, big smile under my helmet. 

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