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2017 500 RR-S, the normal teething pains . . .

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 . . . I had read a thread about flame-out on Beta's, where much of the debate was over flame-out vs stalling.  I've had stalling but do understand that my bike still has less than 6 hours on it.  I've also had a couple of strange incidences where the motor will idle at 4,000 rpm but a quick shut-down and start up will cure it.  One time where the motor just started wildly revving and another shut-down and start up solved it.  

One of you had mentioned the chain chatter and my gosh, I thought there was something seriously wrong with the bike as anything under about 5,000 rpm had the bike chugging and chattering and shaking and the only cure was revs.  With 5 hours it is getting better.  

Otherwise, the bike has been awesome on the road and while riding with a buddy this past Saturday, on a 2016 Harley Davidson EVO, I hung right next to him while he was full-out and I was holding back as I knew I could not go all-out while still in sort of break-in mode.  The 500 RR-S has sack and I've yet to fully exploit the full potential as I have to wait till 10 hours before I can really cane-it.  

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I have definitely not been babying the bike on the streets.  Even taking it sort of easy, I have been able to get the front wheel just off the ground just off idle as the motor has mucho sack-o.  

One of these days I'm going to finally get the bike on the dirt.  Soon, I hope, very soon.  I can only imagine the beast it is going to be off-road.  

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At 6hrs your bike has done most of it's break in,,,, the important parts that is. After that you either have bearing issues or not which was decided when assembled on line.

 

Beta's have always had the most chain slap of all my bikes. Just something the brand is known for.

Edited by weantright

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1 hour ago, weantright said:

At 6hrs your bike has done most of it's break in,,,, the important parts that is. After that you either have bearing issues or not which was decided when assembled on line.

 

Beta 's have always had the most chain slap of all my bikes. Just something the brand is known for.

This is a weird one but no deal killer.  I see two sprockets and the chain that connects them; powered by a typical four stroke engine.  I can't see why one brand would have more chain slap than another but I also don't doubt it is occurring.

 

NC

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At 6hrs your bike has done most of it's break in,,,, the important parts that is. After that you either have bearing issues or not which was decided when assembled on line.

 

Beta 's have always had the most chain slap of all my bikes. Just something the brand is known for.

I definitely don't have any bearing issues.  It is just the nature of the bike I'm sure.  Lugging on the road at anything under 4,000 rpm gets the chain chattering.  I just downshift.  I doubt I'd notice it on the dirt where the wheel can slip, admittedly I've not yet been on the dirt to find out.  I also realize I live in too much of a city as I don't really have any place nearby to ride off-road-boo hoo.  

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This is a weird one but no deal killer.  I see two sprockets and the chain that connects them; powered by a typical four stroke engine.  I can't see why one brand would have more chain slap than another but I also don't doubt it is occurring.

 

NC

Some have a theory that the motor bore vs. stroke plays a role. My thoughts go toward the notch-ness of the clutch that the Beta's are known for.

 

I definitely don't have any bearing issues.  It is just the nature of the bike I'm sure.  Lugging on the road at anything under 4,000 rpm gets the chain chattering.  I just downshift.  I doubt I'd notice it on the dirt where the wheel can slip, admittedly I've not yet been on the dirt to find out.  I also realize I live in too much of a city as I don't really have any place nearby to ride off-road-boo hoo.  

You will notice it in the dirt or anywhere you ride a gear high lugging the motor. No issues outside the irritating noise.

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Do the Californication mod and remove the carbon canister, run the gas cap vent moto style and plug the vacuum....eliminated my weird stalling issues.

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I haven't had any stalling/flameout issues on my '17 500.  I have noticed that the idle will be slower to drop down on occasion than I'd prefer but it's not bad. It's not consistent but not "out of whack" either. It seems more like Beta programmed the idle down to minimize engine braking which is kinda the opposite of what I'd prefer. Call me old school but I like engine braking.

As for the chain slap, I had mentioned that before and after playing with different sprockets etc. it's gone. I do suspect it's much to do about chain adjustment but also it seems to be somewhat affected by sprocket diameter. I also have the TM Designs front swignarm slider which seems to help also.

With my current 15/50 sprocket setup and the chain slack set right I don't have any chain slap even on the pavement under 4k rpm. To get the right slack adjustment for my bike I pulled the rear shock bolt and moved the swingarm through it's full travel. I then set it with about 1/2" of movement at the tightest point and then measured it at full droop with the bike on a stand. That's now my measurement. For my hands it's a "tight" 3 fingers between the bottom of the slider and the chain pulled down. I'm thinking to just buy Beta's measurement block the next time I order parts.

But I think I was running the chain too loose initially.

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I will say that I rode back and forth to work every day this week and the bike did not stall once.  I did have the 4,000 rpm idle twice.  

I got to finally get on the dirt today and my, the bike was awesome.  I can feel the extra weight compared to the 96 CR500R I used to tool around on but power wise, the bike feels like it has all that the CR500R did and the tractability/hook up is even better.  

I now know why there has been so much about going with a, is it a larger front sprocket?, to get the bike to creep/crawl a lot easier?  In the slow going I had to clutch just a little bit in a few places so I may consider changing the front sprocket with no worries about streetability as I know I'm not taking the bike on the highway.  

I also learned the lack of traction with the stock Michelin DOT tire.  I thought it would be pretty good as the tire is brand new but I realized quick on a long, muddy-ish, rocky uphill section, that the amount of space in between the knobs is a bit too much for getting the traction I was used to with a Pirelli pure-dirt tire that hooked like crazy in all conditions and also lasted a LONG time for a CR500R.  I doubt I'll go with the same tire once it wears out but I will stick with a 95/5 tire for sure.  

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Now, thankfully, after 250 miles and 13 hours, the chain chatter is about gone if not totally gone.  

I had done at least 70 miles off-road this past weekend and I think all the rocking on the dirt just have gotten everything loosened up as this morning on the way to work I did not have to maintain at least 5,000 rpm to get the chain snatch to go away.  Now I could almost lug in any gear and not have all sorts of shaking and vibrating.  

 

Freaking bike is fantastic.  I'll say it once I'll say it until it breaks down, the FI 500 RR-S is incredible.  

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On 4/13/2017 at 8:07 AM, NumberCruncher said:

This is a weird one but no deal killer.  I see two sprockets and the chain that connects them; powered by a typical four stroke engine.  I can't see why one brand would have more chain slap than another but I also don't doubt it is occurring.

 

NC

My thoughts.

Should be taken into account that the distance and height of the countershaft sprocket centerline in relation to the swingarm pivot "can" create more or less of a "slap" of a chain. But the rubbing blocks-pads/chain guides and the ratio of the countershaft to the final drive sprocket also can have a little to do with it also.... 

And of course the slack in the chain, which is a bigger issue than many would think. Many think that a DS bike should be as quiet as a street or bland adventure bike chain, ain't gonna happen. Gonna be more chain noisy, 11.5" of wheel travel Vs. 5.5" will play a little extra noise from the chain for sure.

Since many now are running their DS Beta's on the street a lot, those listed "possibles" for extra noise it can be very noticeable.....

   

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With the addition of the Mox cush drive sprocket, corrected chain tension, TM DESIGNWORKS front slider and sprocket size choices (opting for larger F&R) I have virtually no chain slap anymore.

 

The Mox sprocket really did smooth things out a lot, I was surprised. I did a 120 dual sport ride last weekend and I was really happy how smooth my bike feels now. It makes a difference in the longer rides. I also think it works better on the hard/rocky stuff to improve traction.

 

 

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The sound, the mechanics of it all, the shudder, the shake, the vibration, whatever it was that was so harsh when the bike was still so new, with 280 miles and 15 hours on the motor,  is just about all gone as I've been riding to and from work along with errands and I can now dawdle along at around 3,000 rpm and not get the feeling when before I'd have to be above 4,000 or the snatch-iness was almost brutal.  

I realize that the bike is a pure dirt bike with lights but never thought it would behave the way it did when it was new.  Now with more time I think everything has worn in and all is well.  

 

I am going to get that cush drive next, absolutely I will as most of my miles/useage of the bike from M-F will be on the street.  

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