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[TURNING] Supermoto vs. Sportbike

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Always wondered this:

 

Why when on a supermoto, instructors (when cornering) suggest sitting up on the bike (opposite side of turn) and pushing the handlebars down, and when on a sportbike leaning off the bike (to the inside of the turn) and extending the bike more upright? 

 

I know the sportbike way promotes better traction, but why the opposite on a supermoto? 

 

 

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That technique is only for the dirt...if you rode like that on pavement you'd be dragging pegs everywhere and risk low siding... watch some super moto race vids...most guys just sit centered on the bike and some hang off a bit to the inside...I don't know of any fast guys who corner using the dirt technique on pavement).

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24 minutes ago, lakeportmike said:

That technique is only for the dirt...if you rode like that on pavement you'd be dragging pegs everywhere and risk low siding... watch some super moto race vids...most guys just sit centered on the bike and some hang off a bit to the inside...I don't know of any fast guys who corner using the dirt technique on pavement).

Thanks for the insight! 

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2 hours ago, lakeportmike said:

That technique is only for the dirt...if you rode like that on pavement you'd be dragging pegs everywhere and risk low siding... watch some super moto race vids...most guys just sit centered on the bike and some hang off a bit to the inside...I don't know of any fast guys who corner using the dirt technique on pavement).

What?

It's called backing it in. Watch Mark Marquez race sometime! 

Jordan, what you're looking for is this: 
 



 

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23 minutes ago, LuckyLucky said:

What?

It's called backing it in. Watch Mark Marquez race sometime! 

Jordan, what you're looking for is this: 
 



 

YESSS! 

 

So why in supermoto do they do this instead of getting the most traction you can by leaning off the bike and tilting the bike upright? Looks like they're going to be going through the turn slower... is that a supermoto thing?

Ive heard it's because most of the weight in a supermoto is towards the front...

Edited by Jordan Crisologo

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It's not necessarily tied only to supermoto. As I understand it, the idea is basically this:

When you're cornering, you can only feed (relatively) little power to the rear. When you're going in a straight line, you're hard on the throttle. Minimize the amount of corner time maximizes the time you've got the throttle open, and is theoretically faster. So when you back it in, correctly done you should be able to get the bike pointed through the exit faster, and thus back on the throttle faster.

It's not to say backing it in versus conventional sport bike riding is necessarily faster. If you haven't already, watch Marc Marquez race in the MotoGP class, and compare it to someone like Yamaha-era Jorge Lorenzo. It'll really highlight how fundamentally, they're just two riding styles; Marquez sliding everywhere and Lorenzo as if he were on rails. Hell, a lot of these world class racers flat track because it's such good practice anyways, most notable of which is King Kenny Roberts himself, who blended dirt tracking style into street riding. He went on to help pioneer the knee dragging style that is so prevalent today in track/road racing.

I can't speak to the weight distribution of supermotos. However, they are basically dirt bikes. Dirt bike ergonomics tend to the rider weight over the front wheel and off the rear, whereas street bike ergos tuck their riders to distribute their weight more evenly across both wheels.

Edited by LuckyLucky
a word
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7 hours ago, Dramabeats said:

Foot out is merely to reduce lean angle.. some guys do it and some don't

Correct. Putting the inside foot out by the front axle:

- moves the weight of the bike forward, not just the weight of your foot and lower leg, but it causes the rider to lean forward. This seating position allows for harder braking and faster rotation

- lowers the CG of the bike. Much like hanging-off (which also lowers the CG), with a lower CG the bike doesn't need to lean as much therefore creating a safety margin (street riding - where we want to reduce risk) or allowing more lean angle (racing - where we are willing to accept more risk)

Putting a foot forward on a streetbike isn't practical due to the rearsets and low ground clearance, but on a supermoto there is plenty of room and it easy(ier), less commitmet, then hanging off.

Edited by Gary in NJ
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Do whatever is fastest for you

1200px-Pilotsupermotard.jpg

Sosnova_jpg.jpg

Crf2.jpg

Edited by HansLanda

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I guess there are a lot of different techniques used by different riders but the majority of guys I see racing usually do it like this...they stay relatively centered on the bike. I've road raced my DRZ several times and that's how I do it as well... and it's earned me a few trophy's :).

supermoto%20slide.jpg

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31 minutes ago, lakeportmike said:

I guess there are a lot of different techniques used by different riders but the majority of guys I see racing usually do it like this...they stay relatively centered on the bike. I've road raced my DRZ several times and that's how I do it as well... and it's earned me a few trophy's :).

supermoto%20slide.jpg

F'ing badass man! 

You race your DRZ? 

Also, I'm guessing you just stay more centered, and push down the handle bars? I'm also guessing you back it in a lot huh? 

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15 minutes ago, Jordan Crisologo said:

F'ing badass man! 

You race your DRZ? 

Also, I'm guessing you just stay more centered, and push down the handle bars? I'm also guessing you back it in a lot huh? 

Actually I'm  not a "back it in" kinda guy. I'll do it on occasion ...usually unintentionally lol...but I prefer to slide as little as possible.   It works for me :).  Funny story...first time I rode on a Kart track (Sears Point), there was a guy on a tricked out 450 Aprilia who was backing it in to every corner...but I consistently pulled away from him in the corners! Between every session he would walk over and ask me questions about my bike..."what have you done to the motor?"...just a carb and pipe, motor is all stock lol.  "what kinda brakes you running?"...stock lol.  "How long you been doing this?"...first time lol. I kinda felt bad for the guy!

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2 minutes ago, lakeportmike said:

Actually I'm  not a "back it in" kinda guy. I'll do it on occasion ...usually unintentionally lol...but I prefer to slide as little as possible.   It works for me :).  Funny story...first time I rode on a Kart track (Sears Point), there was a guy on a tricked out 450 Aprilia who was backing it in to every corner...but I consistently pulled away from him in the corners! Between every session he would walk over and ask me questions about my bike..."what have you done to the motor?"...just a carb and pipe, motor is all stock lol.  "what kinda brakes you running?"...stock lol.  "How long you been doing this?"...first time lol. I kinda felt bad for the guy!

:smirk:

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You gotta get comfortable with laying the bike out in the corner Big sweepers first. Big 300ft. Circles in the sand or packed dirt with street tires at 1/3 throttle. Then go to figure 8's as you burn in your track. I like practicing in riding arenas and stubble fields after they are cut and bailed. Get permission first of course!

Throw a set of kouba links in to get the rear down and pull em out as you learn speed/turn in.

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