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RFS Loud Ticking and Harsh Kicking After Valve Adjustment

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Last time I had my valves adjusted I had a shop do them, so I will preface this by saying that I may have adjusted them incorrectly myself because I do not recall this noise, and the kickstart problem that has come with it, after the previous adjustment. However, after completing what I believed to be a successful valve adjustment (I used the crank lock method to ensure I was at TDC) I immediately noticed this very loud ticking noise coming from the front right side of the engine that was not there before. This noise is separate from the normal noisy clutch sound that will go away when the clutch is engaged. This noise itself however, seems to subside when I pull in the decompression lever. The throttle response on the bike felt good when I rode it, and the electric start works just fine. The only noticeable issue (which is what is making me decide not to ignore the noise) is that my kickstart now feels like a brick wall and harshly snaps back at me, whereas before it would kick over the bike fairly effortlessly in no more than two kicks hot or cold. I will post a video of the bike riding and of it running while in the garage. Any suggestions for how to fix this are appreciated. Thanks in advance to all!

 

Garage (rip kickstart/excuse the monologue):

https://youtu.be/wG3lT3gixMw

 

Riding (everything seems fine):

https://youtu.be/ylqQpcufWzA

 

 

Edited by Smallen

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It sounds like you goofed the clearance of at least one of the valves and it's too loose (too much clearance).  That will cause a ticking noise, and can also cause the compression release to not work properly.  Double check your clearances, especially the valve that is affected by the compression release lever.  

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Now that you mention it, the exhaust valve connected to the compression release gave me the hardest time out of all of them. I'll go start ripping it apart again. Other than that one, I felt like everything else was good but I don't know if I quite have the feel down for the feeler gauge or not.

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2 hours ago, sirthumpalot said:

It sounds like you goofed the clearance of at least one of the valves and it's too loose (too much clearance).  That will cause a ticking noise, and can also cause the compression release to not work properly.  Double check your clearances, especially the valve that is affected by the compression release lever.  

Being that the ticking noise seems to be coming from the side where the decompression lever is (I am making the assumption that if I messed up the other exhaust valve then that side would be noisy as well), I might just try doing a 1/6 turn in on that specific valve itself .

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Don't guess at it, measure with the feeler gauge.  But be sure the compression release mechanism is not interfering.  I'm guessing that the compression release might have been interfering when you took your first measurement and that's why it's off by so much. 🙂  

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2 minutes ago, sirthumpalot said:

Don't guess at it, measure with the feeler gauge.  But be sure the compression release mechanism is not interfering.  I'm guessing that the compression release might have been interfering when you took your first measurement and that's why it's off by so much. 🙂  

I'll re-check the exhaust valves later today and get back to you. Any idea on how to make sure it is not interfering? Should I pull in the lever when checking that valve perhaps?

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I'm not familar with that exact motor, but you're going to want the lever to be the opposite of pulled in, you want it out so far that it's not putting any pressure on the valve.  When the lever is pulled in it's going to limit how far the valve can close, so when it's pulled in you will have zero valve clearance.  You want it out all the way so that you can measure the clearance before the compression release comes into play.  

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Your valves are out of adjustment.  Watch the valve action as your turning the bike over. I take the ignition cover off and turn it over with a breaker bar on the crank nut.  Line up you crank locking nut at TDC. Pulse coil should be at this position, 

20170502_200609.jpg

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1 minute ago, UH1H said:

Your valves are out of adjustment.  Watch the valve action as your turning the bike over. I take the ignition cover off and turn it over with a breaker bar on the crank nut.  Line up you crank locking nut at TDC. Pulse coil should be at this position, 

I used the crank locking nut method with rolling the rear wheel, it was a little bit more of a pain to get it to TDC but I believe it still does the trick. Line up the locking nut with the groove on the crank, check to make sure the valves have some play in them (apparently the groove might line up when not at correct stroke), install the locking nut without the washer and begin adjusting the valves.

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Option 1

You can line it up as described, but it still has to be on the TDC stroke for valve adjustment- not the overlap stroke. In overlap the valves open slightly.

The only way I can tell you how to check it for sure is: with the bike in 6th gear on a stand, use a 17mm on the c/s sprocket nut and rotate CCW. You should see the valves slightly dip, close. Then the intake dips deep, followed by the Exhaust, and after that you can search to lock the crank & bolt lock it.

Option 2

DJH uses this method instead of TDC and I use  it sometimes.

The intake is adjusted when the exhaust is opening.

The exhaust is adjusted when the intake is closing.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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4 minutes ago, Burnrider said:

Option 1

You can line it up as described, but it still has to be on the TDC stroke for valve adjustment- not the overlap stroke. In overlap the valves open slightly.

The only way I can tell you how to check it for sure is: with the bike in 6th gear on a stand, use a 17mm on the c/s sprocket nut and rotate CCW. You should see the valves slightly dip, close. Then the intake dips deep, followed by the Exhaust, and after that you can search to lock the crank & bolt lock it.

Option 2

DJH uses this method instead of TDC and I use  it sometimes.

The intake is adjusted when the exhaust is opening.

The exhaust is adjusted when the intake is closing.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

The way I did it was by rotating the rear wheel until I was able to see the piston at the top of the cylinder via a zip tie where the spark plug is installed, then I checked if both of the intake and exhaust valves all had some play in them instead of being locked shut. At this point the slot for the crank-lock bolt was almost already perfectly lined up without any searching necessary. I locked the crank, then adjusted all valves.

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16 minutes ago, KTMinSP said:

I used this guys method om my '05 400, worked a treat.

I'm going to try that method for just my intake valves as they are easier to get to simply to check the prior adjustment I made. I believe that the way I did by locking the crank as he mentions in the video means I was able to adjust all valves at once.

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Don't guess at it, measure with the feeler gauge.  But be sure the compression release mechanism is not interfering.  I'm guessing that the compression release might have been interfering when you took your first measurement and that's why it's off by so much. [emoji4]  

 

I loosened up the compression release lever and re-adjusted just the exhaust valves using the procedure I talked about in my last post/reply to Burnrider (tightened both up by about .002). The bike now seems to kick over great again (at least while cold). However, the same ticking noise is still there only this time the decompression lever being pulled in does not seem to make any difference on it so perhaps I need to recheck my intake valves now. Will edit later with video link when I get a chance to upload.

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There was another good point made above.  When you set the crank to TDC, be sure it's TDC on the compression stroke.  Otherwise some of the valves might be slightly open, which means zero clearance, and if you open them up to get clearance in that situation then they will be really really loose when you start the motor.  You can tell you're at TDC on the compression stroke when the lobes on the cams are a long way from the valves or the rockers.  

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If you do these valves on the overlap stroke they will all be way t0o loose resulting in hard starting and ticking.

The method outlined in Travis's video above is by far the easiest and most accurate.  Using a feeler gauge can lead to errors.  No need to open up any side covers either.  Simply watch the action of the valves as you rotate the rear wheel in top gear.  Adjust one set when the other set is about half way open.  You can find a spot right before the engine leaps forward where it stays still.

 

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Video as mentioned from earlier. Tightened the exhaust valves. Perhaps this is an intake tick now?

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Sounds better, now adjust the intakes.  You'll have to check these every 20 to 25 hrs of run time.  Once you properly adjust the intakes now you have a base line. Note the hours.

 Exhaust valves don't move much, intakes will need slight adjustment as the are softer.  Now let er rip?

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Sounds better, now adjust the intakes.  You'll have to check these every 20 to 25 hrs of run time.  Once you properly adjust the intakes now you have a base line. Note the hours.
 Exhaust valves don't move much, intakes will need slight adjustment as the are softer.  Now let er rip[emoji16]


Hopefully intakes will do the trick. Last time the valves were checked was a modest uhh.. 200ish hours ago [emoji50]
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It would appear that you did the previous adjustment on the overlap stroke.  I bet the intakes will make it all better.

 

I'm surprised you didn't do all four while you had it all apart.  At least the intakes are cake.

 

 

 

 

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