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URGENT: 300RR will not start

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Thank you in advance for any help. I am at my wits end, and not sure where to look next.

I am supposed to be taking off for the Klim Cow Tag event bright and early Thursday morning, and all of the sudden my bike does not want to start :(. It was running just fine a couple of weeks ago (albeit pretty rich), and when I went to start it this past Saturday, nothing even after kicking it about 1,000,000 times and trying to use the electric start as well. I have went through and checked literally everything that I can think of, and still nothing :(. I really haven't gotten a chance to ride it yet this year (other than up and down the block dialing in my Rekluse), and I did a bit of work to it over the winter, so I don't know if one of those things is coming back to haunt me. I am going to include everything done just to set the picture for everyone.

Bike

2014 Beta 300RR Race Edition

Mods done over the winter

  • Rekluse Core EXP 3.0
  • Rekluse left hand rear brake
  • Lectron 36mm
  • New Shorai battery (LFX14L2-BS12)
  • Enduro Engineering rad guards (rad braces were on the bike when I got it)
  • Lots of other mods done in the past, but no engine work. I doubt that they are relevant to this issue.

Other pertinent info

  • Just put in a fresh BR7ES  plug
  • Brand new 91 gas w/ Motul 800 mixed at 50:1
  • Brand new, properly oiled Twin Air filter
  • Lectron 4-2M metering rod set to 2.050" (the carb originally shipped with the 2-3 rod)
  • Float height is spot on
  • Compression is 120psi. Normal at my altitude (~6,700ft) is ~138psi, so it is a little low, but not enough that it would cause it to not start. This was with a quality Motion Pro gauge
  • Spark is good. I even took my old plug and clipped off the ground electrode and it arced to the side without any issues
  • Verified that the kill switch is working properly
  • Verified that fuel is in fact getting to the engine (plug was a little damp)
  • I took off the Lectron and put my stock carb back on and that didn't solve my issue either

The one thing that I did to the bike between when it was running and now is remove my slave cylinder to install a helicoil in the bottom bolt (the threads popped when I was snugging up the slave).

Edited by BearcatRR

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Has the bike been started with the new metering rod? Have you recently washed the bike and perhaps forgotten to pull the butt plug out of the exhaust? Make sure that something (kill switch for example) isn't grounding out..just a few ideas. Maybe have someone tow you to try to bump start it...Shooting in the dark here.

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You didn't forget a rag in the airboot or something wonky like that?

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Thanks for all of the help! I am going to try and hit the dealer as soon as they open this morning. Fingers crossed that they can get me taken care of today...

7 hours ago, dyrtmon said:

Has the bike been started with the new metering rod? Have you recently washed the bike and perhaps forgotten to pull the butt plug out of the exhaust? Make sure that something (kill switch for example) isn't grounding out..just a few ideas. Maybe have someone tow you to try to bump start it...Shooting in the dark here.

No it has not. It would not start with the original 2-3 metering rod either. I checked continuity of the kill switch and it is good. In addition, I am getting spark, so I would assume that the kill switch is functioning properly

7 hours ago, silver_fox said:

Condensation... water in fuel?

Nope. I just put fresh premix in it last night, including completely emptying the carb out

7 hours ago, OscarFox said:

You didn't forget a rag in the airboot or something wonky like that?

Nope, no rag or other obstructions in the intake/exhaust

3 hours ago, bikesandcars said:

Are you getting spark?

Yes.  I even took my old plug and clipped off the ground electrode and it arced to the side without any issues

1 hour ago, BassMan said:

Spark plug boot fully seated on plug? Push it down.

Yes, one of my first thoughts was that I was only getting partial contact on the plug, but it is properly seated

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I'd suspect something electrical.  They are kind of known for their crappy electrical connections.  A friend did a top end and thought everything was good to go.  After the fact, the bike wouldn't start.  Of course, he thought he did something wrong on the rebuild.  Tore it all back down, rechecked everything (it was fine) and put it back together.  It ended up being the kill switch.  

I hate it when things don't work the way they are supposed to, especially when you have an event coming up :(

 

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Double check that lectron, it sounds like a fueling problem to me. Put your old carb back on and see if it fires

You got the throttle cable in the slide crrectly right?

The flat side of metering rod needs to face a certain direction. I forget which way but its either facing the motor or away

Check the manual and double check that. 

Def sounds like a lectron issue. To verify put old carb back on and start it

 

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My buddy has a Lectron on kit KTM 150 and randomly can't get it started.  Have to pull the plug and kick it over to clear it out, it's loading up/flooding. Will usually start after that while holding the throttle wide open but even then not always.  I'd suspect the carb, since you're getting spark I doubt it's electrical.

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All you need to run an engine is air, fuel, compression and ignition.

I doubt compression is an issue.

If air is coming out of the exhaust when turning over you have air and it's pumping.

If you have spark by grounding it is not electrical

It is clearly fuel related.

Fuel problems are too much or not enough.

Too much smells funny and wets the plug. None doesn't smell and the plug stays dry. Not enough smells a little bit plug doesn't get that wet.

Stuck float? Hit that lectron with a rubber mallet.

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Suspect the float in the lectron........my old smart carb would do this sometimes and always a fuel starve issue . Tapping on it usually did the trick. Also, no exhaust blocking issue ( removed and replaced packing lately? Vent tube "venting" on gas tank?

 

Joe

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32 minutes ago, trailmeisterjoe said:

Suspect the float in the lectron........my old smart carb would do this sometimes and always a fuel starve issue . Tapping on it usually did the trick. Also, no exhaust blocking issue ( removed and replaced packing lately? Vent tube "venting" on gas tank?

 

Joe

Yep. i have also seen this

 

1 hour ago, Danceswithtrees said:

My buddy has a Lectron on kit KTM 150 and randomly can't get it started.  Have to pull the plug and kick it over to clear it out, it's loading up/flooding. Will usually start after that while holding the throttle wide open but even then not always.  I'd suspect the carb, since you're getting spark I doubt it's electrical.

pull the metering rod out, give it 90 to 180 degree turn counter clock

Start with 90

Did this on my wifes bike and it took care of it

 

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Make sure your metering rod isn't installed backward, I did that once.  Doesn't run so well.

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Lectron float operation is easy to verify due to the opaque nylon bowl.  You can quickly visually verify fuel flow and level.

The flat side of the metering rod needs to be facing the engine (towards the front of the bike) but I'm not sure it's even possible to install it any other way and have the slide drop into place.  It's pretty easy to tell if the metering rod is sliding smoothly into the fuel outlet hole.

Initial metering rod position on the new rod should be the same as the rod that shipped from the factory on the carb.  This measurement number should be on your invoice.

IMHO the fact that you're experiencing the same problems with both Keihin and Lectron carbs indicates that the carb itself likely isn't the issue.

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22 minutes ago, wwguy said:

Lectron float operation is easy to verify due to the opaque nylon bowl.  You can quickly visually verify fuel flow and level.

The flat side of the metering rod needs to be facing the engine (towards the front of the bike) but I'm not sure it's even possible to install it any other way and have the slide drop into place.  It's pretty easy to tell if the metering rod is sliding smoothly into the fuel outlet hole.

Initial metering rod position on the new rod should be the same as the rod that shipped from the factory on the carb.  This measurement number should be on your invoice.

IMHO the fact that you're experiencing the same problems with both Keihin and Lectron carbs indicates that the carb itself likely isn't the issue.

I didn't want to dick around with it all day and still not fix it, so I was waiting  at the door of my local Beta shop when they opened this morning, and they said they should be able to get it fixed today (fingers crossed). 

  • Flat portion of the metering rod is pointing towards the engine as it should
  • Float is exactly where it should be. I have a black sharpie line on the lower level (top line is covered by the aluminum ring bracing the bowl), and it is a little over the minimum line when the carb is leveled out. I don't think that it is sticking as it moves freely when I fill the bowl. Gotta love the clear bowl :)
  • I got the Lectron from Slavens Racing, and they did not have the measurement on the invoice :(. I got the new metering rod from them as well (they are local), and they recommended setting the height at 2.050", which I did. Unless I was insanely rich or lean, it should still fire up
  • I cleaned out the cylinder by pulling the plug and kicking it several times
  • I too thought that it was the Lectron, so I was equally baffled when it didn't start with the stock carb with JD jetting kit. It used to start on first or second kick when cold. The only times I had issues was when it was pretty cool in the morning (40ish F) and at pretty high altitude, like when I was in Silverton, CO last summer (9,300').

 

 

 

 

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Just got a call from the dealer saying that it is all good now :).

And....it looks like it was the Lectron float that bit me in the ass after all. They said that the bike was horribly flooded, and that the float stuck on them once as well causing the fuel to overflow. Even though I hit the stater a couple of times with the plug out thinking that would clear it, I guess that they had to kick it numerous times before the gas squirted out. After that, she fired right up. Stupid mistake cost me $100, but I actually get to bring her with m up to Idaho, so it isn't that bad :). Thanks for all of the help guys!

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