17 500 RR-S Throttle stepper motor adjustment

[FORMA MOTO]

3 hours ago, MartyMOOSE said:

Just an idea Krannie I'd be surprised if it didn't I've never seen an injection system that doesn't use one as a major input. I've sold my bike so can't check it but there is one listed on the parts fiche under the head section called a "temp sensor" You can also see it on the engine service manual pictures.....  This may explain your intermittent idles issues worth a lookinto. 

MM t

MM, I know there is  temp sender on the motor or TB, but I think it is more about ignition retardation when it goes past a limit of temp.

[MartyMOOSE]

7 hours ago, THE KRAN said:

MM, I know there is  temp sender on the motor or TB, but I think it is more about ignition retardation when it goes past a limit of temp.

No its a major input for the EFI and would affect the isc duty based on temp for sure, this is how it idles up when cold there is no cold start button for idle up. It also fuel and maybe ignition. Its on the head. 

[cj_wai]

should never remove a thermostat , even on a carbed bike.  they are never a cause of over heating.they do keep the piston and cylinder at correct temperature for proper clearance.  I know the "fast "guys always have their bikes at full operating temperature all the time, that is why they think they need to remove the t stat.  premature cylinder wear is in your future.

[FORMA MOTO]

2 minutes ago, cj_wai said:

should never remove a thermostat , even on a carbed bike.  they are never a cause of over heating.they do keep the piston and cylinder at correct temperature for proper clearance.  I know the "fast "guys always have their bikes at full operating temperature all the time, that is why they think they need to remove the t stat.  premature cylinder wear is in your future.

On an offroad bike you always remove them, because they are plastic pieces of crap the crack and fail without warning.  The extra hoses and connections are part of that problem.

If it's a dual sport that gets ridden light to light in the am or in cold climates, you need a tstat. But that's not a real dirtbike, now is it.

[cj_wai]

I bet your bike is running too cold  far more often then you realize.  I suppose the quality of parts could be an issue.  I used to add thermostats to all my 2 stroke mx bikes when I used them as bush bikes. always ran and jetted much cleaner. I would not consider running a fi bike without one.

[ccullins]

2 hours ago, THE KRAN said:

On an offroad bike you always remove them, because they are plastic pieces of crap the crack and fail without warning.  The extra hoses and connections are part of that problem.

If it's a dual sport that gets ridden light to light in the am or in cold climates, you need a tstat. But that's not a real dirtbike, now is it.

What he said ? ? 

Once a thermostat gets warm enough to open there is no way a fourstroke would ever get cool enough that it would close back up while riding. Unless maybe it's freezing out. 

[FORMA MOTO]

8 minutes ago, cj_wai said:

I bet your bike is running too cold  far more often then you realize.  I suppose the quality of parts could be an issue.  I used to add thermostats to all my 2 stroke mx bikes when I used them as bush bikes. always ran and jetted much cleaner. I would not consider running a fi bike without one.

I'd bet you are wrong, but I don't gamble, and I don't care about your strong opinon based on your narrow view.

I OVERHEATED my bike 9 times so far, and rode it for 30 hours with the tstat, just becuase I was too busy to deal with it.

Dude, you live in a cold wasteland, of course you need a tstat...

[MartyMOOSE]

7 hours ago, THE KRAN said:

I'd bet you are wrong, but I don't gamble, and I don't care about your strong opinon based on your narrow view.

I OVERHEATED my bike 9 times so far, and rode it for 30 hours with the tstat, just becuase I was too busy to deal with it.

"Dude, you live in a cold wasteland", of course you need a tstat...

Thats a bit harsh Krannie was an idea to try and help thats all. My opinion comes for working with Various EFI systems for a living for many years. Do a little research on EFI and you will find engine temp is a main input on nearly all of them especially those that use an ISC.

As far as living in a cold waste land maybe do some research on Western Australian climate lower west coast as you have no idea where I live. You will find "Dude, you live in a cold wasteland"  not correct out of interest it is often over 40c here in summer. Made me laugh though every pic of your riding areas are rocky, dusty, dry and virtually treeless. 

If no using the thermostat works for you great it must not have anything to do with your idle issues. 

MM 

[FORMA MOTO]

1 hour ago, MartyMOOSE said:

Thats a bit harsh Krannie was an idea to try and help thats all. My opinion comes for working with Various EFI systems for a living for many years. Do a little research on EFI and you will find engine temp is a main input on nearly all of them especially those that use an ISC.

As far as living in a cold waste land maybe do some research on Western Australian climate lower west coast as you have no idea where I live. You will find "Dude, you live in a cold wasteland"  not correct out of interest it is often over 40c here in summer. Made me laugh though every pic of your riding areas are rocky, dusty, dry and virtually treeless. 

If no using the thermostat works for you great it must not have anything to do with your idle issues. 

MM 

As already pointed out, if I did have a tstat, it would be wide open in 5 to 8 min after starting, and it made no differece 'with my idling issues'  with it installed or not, and, I you have no information on how the temp sensor might have a direct effect anyway, just speculation, which is not actually helping.  

Have a nice day

 

[MartyMOOSE]

7 minutes ago, THE KRAN said:

As already pointed out, if I did have a tstat, it would be wide open in 5 to 8 min after starting, and it made no differece 'with my idling issues'  with it installed or not, and, I you have no information on how the temp sensor might have a direct effect anyway, just speculation, which is not actually helping.  

Have a nice day

 

Ok then hope you find your issue I look forward to hearing how you fixed it, at no point did I say it was the thermostat it was a passing idea. I didn't know if you had one or not which was why I asked.

As far as the ect goes you are wrong and don't know how efi works. I could easily prove this and its affect of ISC duty and Injector pulse width but there is no point as arguing on the internet makes us both fools and I'm not the one with the issue I can't fix. 

MM 

ps its night here and yes its nice ?

 

[cj_wai]

10 hours ago, ccullins said:

What he said ? ? 

Once a thermostat gets warm enough to open there is no way a fourstroke would ever get cool enough that it would close back up while riding. Unless maybe it's freezing out. 

a thermostat is not just open or closed

[cj_wai]

10 hours ago, THE KRAN said:

I'd bet you are wrong, but I don't gamble, and I don't care about your strong opinon based on your narrow view.

I OVERHEATED my bike 9 times so far, and rode it for 30 hours with the tstat, just becuase I was too busy to deal with it.

Dude, you live in a cold wasteland, of course you need a tstat...

ahh , the typical kran strong opinion . you know everything and everyone else is wrong. You are a trail rider not a racer, there is no way your bike is always at operating temps  I have seen your videos. just saying. your overheating has zero to do with a thermostat being in your cooling system. you do realize race bikes without thermostats still do things to control engine temps? 

[FORMA MOTO]

16 minutes ago, cj_wai said:

ahh , the typical kran strong opinion . you know everything and everyone else is wrong. You are a trail rider not a racer, there is no way your bike is always at operating temps  I have seen your videos. just saying. your overheating has zero to do with a thermostat being in your cooling system. you do realize race bikes without thermostats still do things to control engine temps? 

No, I don't know everything, but when someone makes a post telling me I'm doing it wrong, but has no specific evidence or course of action, it's just a waste of time. Then to repeat it over and over and insult me about what I know and don't know, is just uncalled for.  

 

If the left radiator water is at 190 degrees or higher you are at full operating tempratures, period. 

I have a laser heat gun, and have tracked my bikes temp for reasons of doing the ecu passive reset, which requires knowing the temp of the motor during warm up.

 

[cj_wai]

I never insulted you .back to dominating your forum. carry on.

[FORMA MOTO]

48 minutes ago, cj_wai said:

a thermostat is not just open or closed

Yes, it cycles if the water temp coming from the radiator is cold enough to close the tstat.....which where I ride, it is not, accept for maybe 3 rides a year.

[FORMA MOTO]

These comments about proper operating tempreture 'requires' a thermostat, and how I might not be aware of how I need an thermostat to reach proper operating temps, is just ridiculous

Honda does not sell a dirt bike with a thermostat

Yamaha does not sell a dirt bike with a thermostat

Suzuki does not sell a dirt bike with a thermostat

Kawasaki does not sell a dirtbike with a thermostat

Sherco does not sell a dirtbike with a thermostat

So, by the logic presented here, all of these bikes will never run at proper operating temprature.

KTM sells only EXC models with thermostats, and that is more for EPA tuning issues than for raising  operating temps 

You only need a thermostat if you cannot get the water temps in your radiators high enough. Simply blocking off one radiator  from the front or back, solves this.

....or if you want something 'automatic', you use  thermostat.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[cj_wai]

ktm xcw have thermostats even the 2 strokes. so more lies from kranman......back to dominating your forum with all your truths.  I know   you are never ever wrong.

[FORMA MOTO]

http://w.synerject.com/en/recreation/motorcycle/dla-p19-3

This is the brand on the Synerject throttle body

https://www.continental-automotive.com/en-gl/Passenger-Cars/Powertrain/Gasoline-Technologies/Gas-Exchange/Air-Path/Digital-Linear-Actuator

Edited October 12, 2017 by THE KRAN

[FORMA MOTO]

1. Irregular idle speed

One of the most common symptoms commonly associated with a problematic idle air control valve is irregular idle speed. The idle air control valve is programmed to regulate and maintain the engine idle speed at a constant rate. If the valve fails or has any issues it can cause the idle speed to be thrown off. This may result in an unusually high or low idle speed, or in some cases a surging idle speed that repeatedly climbs and falls.

[Piney Woods]

Well, is there a fix for this problem?