Jump to content

2005 Kx 250f antifreeze in bottom end.

Recommended Posts

Sorry if this isn't the right place to post this but I found a 05 Kx250f on Craigslist today for $1000. I'm seriously considering it. The guy said it "was running good until it got antifreeze into the bottom end"? Not sure if he was talking about the overflow or what. He said it starts and runs however.

 

Does anyone know what's wrong?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Could be a couple things.

Could be a cracked cylinder or head, or bad gasket, or (more likely) a recent attempt to fix an overheat issue and a water pump seal either not installed, or installed wrong would be my guess.

Also, IMO, thats a lot of jing for a bike that old that has an issue like this.

Just my $.02.

Edited by Trfsrfr

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Could be a couple things.
Could be a cracked cylinder or head, or bad gasket, or (more likely) a recent attempt to fix an overheat issue and a water pump seal either not installed, or installed wrong would be my guess.
Also, IMO, your nuts to pay a grand for a bike that old that has an issue like this.
Just my $.02.



He said it might be the head gasket. Maybe I can ask if I can take the head off and see for myself. Otherwise I'm not buying.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I'm rebuilding an 04.

Including purchase price I'm just over a grand into it, and I haven't even touched the head other than to see if the valves leak solvent, which one does.

It books for 1150 low-end, 1650 top end.

Still needs a chain and sprockets, fork seals...

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
16 hours ago, riverrider650 said:

UPDATE: Just talked to the guy and he said it was leaking out the overflow tube but also had some oil in it. He had a brand new top end on it with the paperwork to prove.

What this update describes is a leaking head gasket.  Simple one not a big deal. If an '05 kx250f is a bike you want, go for it. REALLY look over the rest of the bike for wear and tear first.  Cables, hoses, fork and shock seals, swing arm tightness, spokes bent or loose, tires in good condition not cracking, bars and grips good, plastics fit well not cracked, seat and rear frame are straight, muffler good.  If those types of things check out the if were me, I would haggle as best possible and go ahead and buy it. On the handshake and after passing him the cash, sincerely thank the guy for being upfront about the coolant issue. Ask if the head gasket was new when the top end was done. Ask if there is anything else you need to be aware of or need to look at which he may have been thinking about doing.  Take the bike home and get started.

I always go through everything on a new2us machine anyways.  Specific to the coolant issue, chances are pretty good the head just needs to retorqued properly. The plan of attack would be:

#1 Just retorque the head bolts. Take the head cover off and cams out. Goto the 4 head bolts.  Back them off, loosen 1 turn.  Then retighten as follows.  Hand tight, then get your torque wrench and set to 50% torque (20 foot.lbs). Tighten in criss-cross pattern.  Reset wrench to full torque spec (36 foot.lbs), tighten criss-cross.  Reinstall the cams, and same thing - properly torque them (87 inch.lbs).  Time the cams and put it all back together.  Drain and replace the coolant.

Take the radiator cap off.  Go ahead and run it on high idle for a few minutes to get good and warm.  After a couple minutes, look in the rad hole.  If you see foaming bubbles with oil/soot, shut down, drain the coolant and refill.  Startup the bike again.  If you see the foaming bubbles with oil/soot again - then the gasket is still leaking and it will need to be replaced. Note when you are all done and put the rad cap back on, in the near future running it there will be some coolant out the overflow on the first ride.  AF expands quite a bit with temperature and needs a place to go.  If too full, it overflows.  This is normal.  Just check it for fluid level later after it is cooled off.

#2 Remove the head, cleanup the surfaces, and replace the head gasket.  Procedure is same as above but involves also removing the coil, the muffler header, the frame brackets.F

 

Hope that helps!  I hope you get a good deal on the bike, we have two '05 in the group here.  They are good bikes.

Screen Shot 2017-08-02 at 8.46.53 AM.png

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

No gentlemen. On this bike its the water pump seals. Get a full right right seal/gasket kit. The water pump impeller is driven by a gear inside the motor. Theres two seals. Ine to keep oil in the motor. One to keep water in the water pump. This is ten times more likely anything in the head. You know how many heads Ive taken apart and put back together with the same gaskets? Tens and twenties. You know how many times Ive reused water pump seals? Zero. 

You SHOULD replace ALL the gaskets and seals just for comfort. But its a bunch of times more likely its the soft stuff in the rigjt side. $40 for K+S...

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
No gentlemen. On this bike its the water pump seals. Get a full right right seal/gasket kit. The water pump impeller is driven by a gear inside the motor. Theres two seals. Ine to keep oil in the motor. One to keep water in the water pump. This is ten times more likely anything in the head. You know how many heads Ive taken apart and put back together with the same gaskets? Tens and twenties. You know how many times Ive reused water pump seals? Zero. 
You SHOULD replace ALL the gaskets and seals just for comfort. But its a bunch of times more likely its the soft stuff in the rigjt side. $40 for K+S...


Thank you so much. Soooo, just the pump seal? I can't find a gasket and seal kit for the right side but I did find a pump rebuild kit.

And is this most likely the problem? I just don't want to end up with a bike that needs hundreds and thousands of dollars worth of work.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
What this update describes is a leaking head gasket.  Simple one not a big deal. If an '05 kx250f is a bike you want, go for it. REALLY look over the rest of the bike for wear and tear first.  Cables, hoses, fork and shock seals, swing arm tightness, spokes bent or loose, tires in good condition not cracking, bars and grips good, plastics fit well not cracked, seat and rear frame are straight, muffler good.  If those types of things check out the if were me, I would haggle as best possible and go ahead and buy it. On the handshake and after passing him the cash, sincerely thank the guy for being upfront about the coolant issue. Ask if the head gasket was new when the top end was done. Ask if there is anything else you need to be aware of or need to look at which he may have been thinking about doing.  Take the bike home and get started.
I always go through everything on a new2us machine anyways.  Specific to the coolant issue, chances are pretty good the head just needs to retorqued properly. The plan of attack would be:
#1 Just retorque the head bolts. Take the head cover off and cams out. Goto the 4 head bolts.  Back them off, loosen 1 turn.  Then retighten as follows.  Hand tight, then get your torque wrench and set to 50% torque (20 foot.lbs). Tighten in criss-cross pattern.  Reset wrench to full torque spec (36 foot.lbs), tighten criss-cross.  Reinstall the cams, and same thing - properly torque them (87 inch.lbs).  Time the cams and put it all back together.  Drain and replace the coolant.
Take the radiator cap off.  Go ahead and run it on high idle for a few minutes to get good and warm.  After a couple minutes, look in the rad hole.  If you see foaming bubbles with oil/soot, shut down, drain the coolant and refill.  Startup the bike again.  If you see the foaming bubbles with oil/soot again - then the gasket is still leaking and it will need to be replaced. Note when you are all done and put the rad cap back on, in the near future running it there will be some coolant out the overflow on the first ride.  AF expands quite a bit with temperature and needs a place to go.  If too full, it overflows.  This is normal.  Just check it for fluid level later after it is cooled off.
#2 Remove the head, cleanup the surfaces, and replace the head gasket.  Procedure is same as above but involves also removing the coil, the muffler header, the frame brackets.F
 
Hope that helps!  I hope you get a good deal on the bike, we have two '05 in the group here.  They are good bikes.
5981f409d8d04_ScreenShot2017-08-02at8_46_53AM.png.7a957c068e4900f4e8d62514da95571b.png


Thanks for the chart! Will certainly help me when putting this back together.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Look in Tucker Rocky or something. The right side of that bikes been the same for ten years...Id hate to say just water pump kit and you go in and mess up your gasket then have new seals but still need new gaskets...you dont use condoms twice! You COULD coat gasketa with hi temp silicone...cant do that to seals. Get new seals. But you need new everything soft on the right side. That's the right way to do it.

K+S has right side kits for these bikes. A full right side kit would be the smart thing to do.

And torque everything correctly. Ie the water pump impeller...i think its 67 in lbs...post what it is.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Look in Tucker Rocky or something. The right side of that bikes been the same for ten years...Id hate to say just water pump kit and you go in and mess up your gasket then have new seals but still need new gaskets...you dont use condoms twice! You COULD coat gasketa with hi temp silicone...cant do that to seals. Get new seals. But you need new everything soft on the right side. That's the right way to do it.
K+S has right side kits for these bikes. A full right side kit would be the smart thing to do.
And torque everything correctly. Ie the water pump impeller...i think its 67 in lbs...post what it is.


Ok will do, would you mind sending me the link for the right side gaskets and seals? I can't seem to find them.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

A link? Bro I would just be searching like you! Id think a seller on ebay would have it for sure. Reason I said Tucker Rocky, is cause I used to work for Honda, thats why I only eff with Hondas, but Ihave other makes, so I still wanna get parts with my discount! So Tucker Rocky, or Parts Unlimited is an aftermarket supplier I can use my discount on. So thats where I get non Honda parts from. And K+S makes gaskets for everyone, so an aftermarket supplier has them somewhere. Go to any motorcycle shop. Theyll find it. Id even just call K and S and say whats up, youll get exactly what you need. Google k and s and hit em up. Youre business is wanted 

Itll be a whole right side gasket/seal kit...Under $50

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

And Face...I just noticed you pointed out the #5 post...well if a liquid is dripping out, then theres too much. If its oil with water in it it will be chocolate milk pudding. There's only supposed to be X amount of oil. Theres only supposed to be X amount of water. In their respective cavities. When these seals dont work then theres too much liquid in the motor now, and that liquids chocolate milk because the seals that separate oil and water are gone to ish. 

In my opinion...

This is ten times more likely the issue versus anything up top. Especially if these seals have never been replaced in over ten years.

But the bike is not in front of me. 

Id get new right side gaskets/seals either way....maybe throwa dirt digger in there. And itll rock another ten raceless years no problems

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Don't buy it unless your mechanically inclined and love Working on bikes . Spend another 1k and find one in good shape.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Your first statement applies to all four strokes.

You know how dope this bike would be with a grand to put into it? 

You know how hard another g would be to get for someone thats looking at thousand dollar dirt bikes to begin with?

The same amount of money youd put into a new to you working dirt bike, would get this one in great working order. 

I bet a new clutch went in and seals were reused...you dont reuse condoms!

If top ends fresh and documented, its not top end gaskets. Those last

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
7 hours ago, notoriousE-R-I-C said:

Your first statement applies to all four strokes.

You know how dope this bike would be with a grand to put into it? 

You know how hard another g would be to get for someone thats looking at thousand dollar dirt bikes to begin with?

The same amount of money youd put into a new to you working dirt bike, would get this one in great working order. 

I bet a new clutch went in and seals were reused...you dont reuse condoms!

If top ends fresh and documented, its not top end gaskets. Those last

I'm not a mechanic but milky oil = &%$#@!ed if your not really good with bikes. I know ive blown a few of them up! don't get me wrong you seem like you could handle this issue and really know your way around engines but IDK how handy the OP is.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Well this is a late response. But yes, yes indeed I bought the bike. And yes it was worth every penny. Drove two hours to pick up the bike and walked away with it for $800. Yeah call me crazy but I wouldn't have touched this thing if it hadn't started and drove good. I took it for a test drive beforehand and it ran and drove awesome. Starts up right away. The next day I pulled apart the water pump and found the seals went out and the shaft went bad. Already in the mail. Problem solved. Yeah I was gonna wait and spend $2500 on a bike but this was too good of a find.

Thank you all for the advice especially NotoriousE-R-I-C.

 

Here's the bike

 

IMG_8356.JPG

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Reply with:


×