Roczen then Tomac

[Doug Fugly]

Roczen had a rough outing in SX in 2016... then pretty well dominated outdoors.
 
Tomac suffered from arm pump and struggled in SX at the first few rounds, then began rockin' it.
 
What do I think made the difference for them?... it's a matter that's top secret, it's a "If I tell ya I'll have to kill ya" thing.
 
Spring forks. [emoji106] [emoji469]

[phantom451]

Roczen had a rough outing in SX in 2016... then pretty well dominated outdoors.

 

Tomac suffered from arm pump and struggled in SX at the first few rounds, then began rockin' it.

 

What do I think made the difference for them?... it's a matter that's top secret, it's a "If I tell ya I'll have to kill ya" thing.

 

Spring forks. [emoji106] [emoji469]

 

 

Is this a fact? It wouldn't surprise me. The whole air fork revolution was based upon bikes being so heavy they would do whatever they could to lose 2lbs. Now I just watched the very first 450 shootout the weight gain from spring forks is being talked about. It sucks that 450cc bikes are a standard. I would prefer a 325-375cc open class bike that was more inline with what Ktm is offering weight wise. Although only 1lb less than the 450sxf. I think the Japanese would be able to drop some tonnage and benefit from a smaller displacement.

 

[markit]

They won more.

[redrider144]

Roczen was running air in 2016 MX.  Recall one of the few motos he didn't win was due to a leaking pressure sensor on top of the fork leg.

[mog]

Yes fake news and I don't think tomac got any different with spring forks , it was later on , in fact most weeks tomac doesn't look good now

 

 

[Doug Fugly]

Roczen was running air in 2016 MX.  Recall one of the few motos he didn't win was due to a leaking pressure sensor on top of the fork leg.

Not so sure. They want us to think the forks were air.

[Arctic Pride]

15 minutes ago, Husa your Daddy? said:

Not so sure. They want us to think the forks were air.

you could see the forks collapse when the air cap failed. That was an RCH modification 

start at 1:22

 

[redrider144]

1 hour ago, Husa your Daddy? said:

Not so sure. They want us to think the forks were air.

That's a pretty deep conspiracy.  They even got Roczen to throw away a moto!

[wielywilly-g]

11 hours ago, phantom451 said:

Is this a fact? It wouldn't surprise me. The whole air fork revolution was based upon bikes being so heavy they would do whatever they could to lose 2lbs. Now I just watched the very first 450 shootout the weight gain from spring forks is being talked about. It sucks that 450cc bikes are a standard. I would prefer a 325-375cc open class bike that was more inline with what Ktm is offering weight wise. Although only 1lb less than the 450sxf. I think the Japanese would be able to drop some tonnage and benefit from a smaller displacement.

 

I read there was 2 lbs difference between the 350 and 450. 222 vs 224.  Why not just get rid of the 350 if it is that close.  If someone cant handle the 450 power, give em a 350 emulation map.

[MANIAC998]

2 minutes ago, wielywilly-g said:

I read there was 2 lbs difference between the 350 and 450. 222 vs 224.  Why not just get rid of the 350 if it is that close.  If someone cant handle the 450 power, give em a 350 emulation map.

Reciprocating weight.

Mapping won't change that fact.

[wielywilly-g]

Are you saying there is a big gyro difference between 350 and 450 at a given speed and hp output?

[GBowman]

12 hours ago, Husa your Daddy? said:

Roczen had a rough outing in SX in 2016... then pretty well dominated outdoors.
 
Tomac suffered from arm pump and struggled in SX at the first few rounds, then began rockin' it.
 
What do I think made the difference for them?... it's a matter that's top secret, it's a "If I tell ya I'll have to kill ya" thing.
 
Spring forks.

 

Nope, not spring forks. The difference for Tomac was triple clamps and a link that made the bike more rear bias. Roczens change was a triple clamp that allowed more flex. 

I know for a fact that Roczen ran air, and I know that the forks of choice by the majority of factory guys are KYB PSF1s, which are air. 

[phantom451]

I read there was 2 lbs difference between the 350 and 450. 222 vs 224.  Why not just get rid of the 350 if it is that close.  If someone cant handle the 450 power, give em a 350 emulation map.

I'm one of the flat earthers that believes a smaller engine rotating mass makes the bike handle better.

[phantom451]

Are you saying there is a big gyro difference between 350 and 450 at a given speed and hp output?

I'm also saying that jap bike weights are far bigger gaps between engine size than ktm

[MANIAC998]

1 minute ago, phantom451 said:

I'm one of the flat earthers that believes a smaller engine rotating mass makes the bike handle better.

I'm all about Flat Earth myself!

250f Flat Earth theory!!!

[wielywilly-g]

I think the smaller mass 350 needs more rpm to give the same HP of the 450 so the gyroscopic forces are about a wash.

I know nothing of flat earth except as a finsh option on my guns and scopes.

[MANIAC998]

41 minutes ago, wielywilly-g said:

Are you saying there is a big gyro difference between 350 and 450 at a given speed and hp output?

Quite shockingly large difference in gyro.

[Cigaro]

12 hours ago, Husa your Daddy? said:

Roczen had a rough outing in SX in 2016... then pretty well dominated outdoors.
 
Tomac suffered from arm pump and struggled in SX at the first few rounds, then began rockin' it.
 
What do I think made the difference for them?... it's a matter that's top secret, it's a "If I tell ya I'll have to kill ya" thing.
 
Spring forks.

 

Didn't Roczen win like 6-7 Sx races that year? I don't think it was that rough. Dungey was just on it that year...

[mog]

The 350 feels nothing like the 450 for gyro ,it's way closer to the 250f ,in fact it feels like a 250f with an extra 6hp which is what it is

 

 

[babyarmholdingapple]

3 hours ago, MANIAC998 said:

I'm all about Flat Earth myself!

250f Flat Earth theory!!!

2t