No clutch Freeplay

[model_1894]

I adjusted the clutch cable to the max and i still dont have enough room to attach the cable to cable lever and perch.  I check the clutch pack and it is still looks like new.   I ordered a motion pro cable and replaced it, but still having the same problem.  I read somewhere to add more metal plate or replace the clutch throw out washer?????

Suggestions?

THanks

[William1]

You can press the clutch actuation arm in and then slip the cable in though it is pretty easy to do it without going to that extreme.

Make sure the inline adjuster is fully screwed together,

Make sure the adjuster on the perch is all the way in and the slots aligned.

Remove the lever (take out the bolt and nut) from the perch

Cable in the lever, slip the cable inner through the perch adjuster.

Slip the lever back into the perch.

Reassemble, set free play to about the thickness of a nickel.

[Noble]

+1 ^.  Remove the lever often will allow the cable to be attached. Ultimately the lever on the motor can be re-positioned but that is a huge change and probably not necessary. Or just remove, attach the cable, and replace the lever on the same spline. You'll figure it out.

[model_1894]

On 11/9/2017 at 11:23 AM, William1 said:

You can press the clutch actuation arm in and then slip the cable in though it is pretty easy to do it without going to that extreme.

Make sure the inline adjuster is fully screwed together,

Make sure the adjuster on the perch is all the way in and the slots aligned.

Remove the lever (take out the bolt and nut) from the perch

Cable in the lever, slip the cable inner through the perch adjuster.

Slip the lever back into the perch.

Reassemble, set free play to about the thickness of a nickel.

I tried pushing the clutch actuation arm, but it is not possible.    But i was able to attache the cable to the perch without the lock washer.  Even then, there is really no freeplay on the clutch lever.  What is causing this?

Is the push rod defect?

Is the clutch arm defect?

Is there some part that is worn out that needs to replace?

 

[William1]

1 minute ago, win94 said:

I tried pushing the clutch actuation arm, but it is not possible.    But i was able to attache the cable to the perch without the lock washer.  Even then, there is really no freeplay on the clutch lever.  What is causing this?

Is the push rod defect?

Is the clutch arm defect?

Is there some part that is worn out that needs to replace?

 

A worn out clutch 'could' do it but it would also be slipping a lot as well.

Are you sure the inline adjuster (covered by a rubber boot) is screwed together and not apart/extended?

[ohiodrz400sm]

Assuming you have the correct cable, perch and lever then you need to reevaluate your routing. It runs to the right (throttle) side of the bike.

[model_1894]

It is the correct clutch cable.  The cable is long enough to reach the lever and the clutch lever arm.  It is the length of the inner metal cable within the plastic sleeve.  I attached the cable to the clutch lever arm first.  Since the metal cable is attached to the clutch lever arm, it is being pulled out of the plastic sleeve.  The plastic sleeve is attached to a bracket an inch from the lever arm, causing the metal cable to be pulled out the plastic sleeve.  As result, on the direct opposite end of the cable, the amount of metal cable that is exposure is much shorten.  This shortening of the metal cable is what prevent attached to the lever handle and perch.  

What are the other common metal parts that can be worn down that can cause this.  

[Backwoods-Bomber]

Are you sure the inline adjuster (covered by a rubber boot) is screwed together and not apart/extended?

^^^^^^^^ Have you checked this?

[ohiodrz400sm]

As the parts in clutch assembly wear the stack up becomes shorter and cable free play increases. The only explanation for an internal issue is incorrect assembly.

The issue is routing or in line adjuster as mentioned above, you are over thinking things.

[model_1894]

4 hours ago, Backwoods-Bomber said:

 

^^^^^^^^ Have you checked this?

 

Yes, that adjust has turned to maximize the length of the inner metal wire.  

I opened the clutch and the clutch pack looks good.  The o ring with bearings on the clutch cover plate looks good.......the clutch push rod appeared normal but i dont know if there is any wear and tear on the ends.    The sleeve that go over the push rod looks good.   

What is the torque spec for the springs?

What else can be wrong?????

[Backwoods-Bomber]

Let's take a step back so I can understand the original problem.

Why did you take it apart in the first place? Was it in working order before taking the lever off?

[model_1894]

2 hours ago, Backwoods-Bomber said:

Let's take a step back so I can understand the original problem.

Why did you take it apart in the first place? Was it in working order before taking the lever off?

There has always been low free play on the clutch cable.  In addition the plastic cable of the clutch cable is broken.  This inhibit me from being able to spray lubricant into the cable.  

I even ordered a new clutch pack and tried it on, but even with the a brand new clutch pack, it made free play even less.  

[Backwoods-Bomber]

There has always been low free play on the clutch cable.  In addition the plastic cable of the clutch cable is broken.  This inhibit me from being able to spray lubricant into the cable.  
I even ordered a new clutch pack and tried it on, but even with the a brand new clutch pack, it made free play even less.  

Gotcha, sounds like the actuator arm is off by one spline.

[model_1894]

21 hours ago, Backwoods-Bomber said:

Gotcha, sounds like the actuator arm is off by one spline.

yes, if only i can turn it one to two spline more, stretching out the metal cable, i will have more run to attach it to the perch and lever handle.  

Anyone know why this happens.  

[William1]

7 minutes ago, win94 said:

yes, if only i can turn it one to two spline more, stretching out the metal cable, i will have more run to attach it to the perch and lever handle.  

Anyone know why this happens.  

First, let's make a few assumptions. No one had ever taken the clutch apart nor had anyone removed the clutch actuation arm. All that happened was your STOCK clutch cable on the STOCK perch failed, correct? If that is correct, you should be able to get a OEM cable on with little fuss.

If any parts had been messed with OR you had a catastrophic problem like an exploded fiber clutch plate then without a complete checking it is a complete guess.

Stock clutch actuation arm position (when lightly pressed) will be so the arm is appx 90 degrees to the cable. No cable on, it will go to 90,degrees but can easily be moved away (there is no spring to hold it 'in'. A common mistake people make is they take it off and then do not put it back in the same spot. There is no reason to remove it for a cable replacement.

[Noble]

On 11/12/2017 at 9:58 AM, ohiodrz400sm said:

As the parts in clutch assembly wear the stack up becomes shorter and cable free play increases.

 

This is incorrect.  As the clutch pack wears the free play becomes less.

[ohiodrz400sm]

This is incorrect.  As the clutch pack wears the free play becomes less.

Learn something new everyday. Thanks for setting me straight Noble.

[model_1894]

On 11/13/2017 at 1:24 PM, William1 said:

First, let's make a few assumptions. No one had ever taken the clutch apart nor had anyone removed the clutch actuation arm. All that happened was your STOCK clutch cable on the STOCK perch failed, correct? If that is correct, you should be able to get a OEM cable on with little fuss.

If any parts had been messed with OR you had a catastrophic problem like an exploded fiber clutch plate then without a complete checking it is a complete guess.

Stock clutch actuation arm position (when lightly pressed) will be so the arm is appx 90 degrees to the cable. No cable on, it will go to 90,degrees but can easily be moved away (there is no spring to hold it 'in'. A common mistake people make is they take it off and then do not put it back in the same spot. There is no reason to remove it for a cable replacement.

I bought the bike 2nd hand so i dont know if it has been messed with.   Hence that is why i want to know more about the push rod, the sleeve, and the other moving components inside that affect the movement of the clutch 

 

[Noble]

Some problems are easily diagnosed in person but not so easy over the internet.  Let me ask this.  If the cable is not connected to the release lever on the motor, is there some motion of the lever where it is free to turn?  The release is a cam,  as it turns CCW (counter clock wise as viewed from the top) it contacts the release push rod.  Further motion CCW pushes on the rod and lifts the clutch pressure plate.  So there needs to be  some place in the motion of the release lever where it is free not contacting the release rod.  Reply and we can go from there.

[model_1894]

On 11/14/2017 at 4:18 PM, Noble said:

Some problems are easily diagnosed in person but not so easy over the internet.  Let me ask this.  If the cable is not connected to the release lever on the motor, is there some motion of the lever where it is free to turn?  The release is a cam,  as it turns CCW (counter clock wise as viewed from the top) it contacts the release push rod.  Further motion CCW pushes on the rod and lifts the clutch pressure plate.  So there needs to be  some place in the motion of the release lever where it is free not contacting the release rod.  Reply and we can go from there.

Yeah, at the lever actuation arm, it can rotate freely when the cable is not attached.  I really dont know how much it can rotate, maybe up to the point where it points directly perpendicular to the left side of the bike.  

Yes, the the adjustment on the plastic sleeve is adjusted to maximize the the metal cable when trying to attached it to the handle lever and perch of the handle bar.