Which GPS Unit for Trail Riding

[SLVR993]

Hey Guys - Thinking it would be a good idea to get a GPS unit to mount to my bars.  I have a shit sense of direction and I'm spending more and more time lately exploring new trails.  Anyway, I need something with an easy to read screen, rugged and easy to use.  I'm not doing anything fancy, I just need to find my way back to my truck at the end of the day.  I'm not afraid to spend a little for good gear that will last.  

 

Any reccomendations??? - I can read a million online reviews but I find the real world data from this group to be MUCH more valuable. 

 

Thanks 

Jeff 

Edited November 23, 2017 by SLVR993

[ohgood]

$40 used android rugged smartphone, $6 app, $2 silicon mount... no service needed, pretty easy

[bkoz]

I have excellent luck with the Garmin Montana.

[firstplacephoto]

13 hours ago, ohgood said:

$40 used android rugged smartphone, $6 app, $2 silicon mount... no service needed, pretty easy

which app do you use? I have no idea how to upload maps and tracks onto a gps. I use my android phone for my truck on road with the gps in it,and its easy. Anything "easy" for dummies?

[MattMc]

On 11/24/2017 at 8:41 AM, firstplacephoto said:

which app do you use? I have no idea how to upload maps and tracks onto a gps. I use my android phone for my truck on road with the gps in it,and its easy. Anything "easy" for dummies?

Not dummy proof but OsmAnd works for me and isn't too terribly hard to learn. if you want to just track your route you just click the GPS button on the screen and go. It's very accurate and easy to see your tracks. It's free and also does a lot more than you might ever need. 

[Cali Fourstroke]

Jeff - excuse my ignorance, but how are you utilizing the GPS without having service?  I'm trying to find the best solution for my husband without using his regular cell phone.   Any suggestions on an app vs. hand held GPS?

Thanks!

[ohgood]

On 11/24/2017 at 7:41 AM, firstplacephoto said:

which app do you use? I have no idea how to upload maps and tracks onto a gps. I use my android phone for my truck on road with the gps in it,and its easy. Anything "easy" for dummies?

normally I'll use locus for everything. everything gps related takes some trial and error. for a little easier starting, try Osmand. for better off road usability, locus 

[ohgood]

3 hours ago, Cali Fourstroke said:

Jeff - excuse my ignorance, but how are you utilizing the GPS without having service?  I'm trying to find the best solution for my husband without using his regular cell phone.   Any suggestions on an app vs. hand held GPS?

Thanks!

 

GPS is just an antenna, like Wi-Fi/cellular/NFC/etc. 

 

turn off the others to save battery and GPS works great by itself. 

 

Osmand, back country navigator, maverick, locus... locus is the most feature packed, Osmand the easiest

Edited November 29, 2017 by ohgood

[Cali Fourstroke]

Thanks so much for the info.

[rkebent]

What phone bar mounts are y'all using? Thanks

[ohgood]

26 minutes ago, rkebent said:

What phone bar mounts are y'all using? Thanks

I like the $2 eBay silicon holders, if you Google "Finn bicycle mount" it's pretty cheap/easy. 

 

there are other mounts that are full silicon that work easier. 

[Tye Durden]

8 hours ago, Cali Fourstroke said:

Jeff - excuse my ignorance, but how are you utilizing the GPS without having service?  I'm trying to find the best solution for my husband without using his regular cell phone.   Any suggestions on an app vs. hand held GPS?

Thanks!

Cell phone based GPS is limited. I would not rely on it solely as a map/tracking aid, especially in California (if that is what the Cali refers to) with all of the mountains that can kill cell signal.  If you already know where you are basically going then it can work fine. Always use paper maps as backup.

This gives you the basics on the difference between cell and "real" GPS...

https://www.diffen.com/difference/A-GPS_vs_GPS

With that said, I don't have a GPS yet, but I also thoroughly research and print maps for any area I am going to ride so my cell phone works fine for that when it has coverage.  With a bit of digging you can find sites that provide free contour maps and stuff, and GPS tracks that you can download onto your GPS unit, so basically you can get in for the cost of a GPS and mount, and get high quality contour base maps for free or way less than Garmin etc. charges with a new unit. 

Cheers, KTT

Edited November 30, 2017 by KaToomTime

[Cali Fourstroke]

15 hours ago, KaToomTime said:

Cell phone based GPS is limited. I would not rely on it solely as a map/tracking aid, especially in California (if that is what the Cali refers to) with all of the mountains that can kill cell signal.  If you already know where you are basically going then it can work fine. Always use paper maps as backup.

This gives you the basics on the difference between cell and "real" GPS...

https://www.diffen.com/difference/A-GPS_vs_GPS

With that said, I don't have a GPS yet, but I also thoroughly research and print maps for any area I am going to ride so my cell phone works fine for that when it has coverage.  With a bit of digging you can find sites that provide free contour maps and stuff, and GPS tracks that you can download onto your GPS unit, so basically you can get in for the cost of a GPS and mount, and get high quality contour base maps for free or way less than Garmin etc. charges with a new unit. 

Cheers, KTT

I really appreciate all the information.  Thank you!

[notoriousE-R-I-C]

The TT Voyager is the hot ish.
Surprised 10 people haven't said that already.

[ohgood]

On 11/29/2017 at 7:52 PM, KaToomTime said:

Cell phone based GPS is limited. I would not rely on it solely as a map/tracking aid, especially in California (if that is what the Cali refers to) with all of the mountains that can kill cell signal.  If you already know where you are basically going then it can work fine. Always use paper maps as backup.

This gives you the basics on the difference between cell and "real" GPS...

https://www.diffen.com/difference/A-GPS_vs_GPS

With that said, I don't have a GPS yet, but I also thoroughly research and print maps for any area I am going to ride so my cell phone works fine for that when it has coverage.  With a bit of digging you can find sites that provide free contour maps and stuff, and GPS tracks that you can download onto your GPS unit, so basically you can get in for the cost of a GPS and mount, and get high quality contour base maps for free or way less than Garmin etc. charges with a new unit. 

Cheers, KTT

that comparison would be helpful, if it were correct. unfortunately it is not. 

 

a-gps is not less accurate than GPS. 

a-gps is actually only assisted during startup of the location services. the rest of the time the GPS antenna in the phone, tablet, computer just uses satellite pings like any other GPS device would.

 

essentially "real GPS" is exactly the same as a-gps, except that it doesn't have the ability to update constellation data quickly like a-gps can. this is why turning on a stand alone a few hundred miles from its last use location takes so long to get location information , aka "satellite lock" in the old days. 

 

accuracy has been proven to be no different , several times, when comparing stand alone units to smartphones. 

 

for the longest battery life and better accuracy in smartphones, use "GPS only" in the location services setting. a-gps is only needed to speed up initializing after moving a long distance between usages. 

 

 

as far as a smartphone not working "in the mountains" or other mythical places where stand alone GPS units are rumored to be the only possible choice, that's totally bogus. there is no magic happening in stand alone units, its an antennaantenna, just like in smartphones. all they do is listen for the time stamped pings from satellites, and then do some math to approximate your location. no magic at all, just math. 

 

cellular service is not needed, ever. 

Edited December 2, 2017 by ohgood

[pat22043]

On 12/2/2017 at 9:04 AM, ohgood said:

cellular service is not needed, ever. 

More explicitly, GPS in the smartphone will know its location without cellular service. Works anywhere in the world. But most folk want to know more than the lat/long of where they are, they want to see where they are on a map so they can find the nearest town, food, gas, etc. You need to connect to "the internet" to get maps if you use a smartphone. Stand-alone GPS, like a Garmin 64ST, have maps built in. You can get to "the internet" using a cell service, or wifi at home. So you can, with planning, download the maps you need for the area you will be in, and then you do not need cellular service.

Where I ride (mostly RAC/FRO/AOAA and Hatfield-McCoy) there is never any reliable cellular service. Sometimes there is cellular service on mountain tops, but never down in the valleys between mountains.

I gave a buddy my old Samsung S4 yesterday, so he can see if it works for him. I carry a smartphone, but I rely upon my Garmin. The Garmin is mounted on my handlebars, the smartphone is burried in a pocket

[ohgood]

On 12/4/2017 at 1:25 PM, pat22043 said:

1 More explicitly, GPS in the smartphone will know its location without cellular service. Works anywhere in the world.

2 But most folk want to know more than the lat/long of where they are, they want to see where they are on a map so they can find the nearest town, food, gas, etc.

3 You need to connect to "the internet" to get maps if you use a smartphone.

4 Stand-alone GPS, like a Garmin 64ST, have maps built in.

5 You can get to "the internet" using a cell service, or wifi at home. So you can, with planning, download the maps you need for the area you will be in, and then you do not need cellular service.

6 Where I ride (mostly RAC/FRO/AOAA and Hatfield-McCoy) there is never any reliable cellular service.

7 Sometimes there is cellular service on mountain tops, but never down in the valleys between mountains.

8 I gave a buddy my old Samsung S4 yesterday, so he can see if it works for him. I carry a smartphone, but I rely upon my Garmin. The Garmin is mounted on my handlebars, the smartphone is burried in a pocket

1 correct! 

2 I totally agree. 

3 incorrect. just like the Garmin, the phone has the OPTION of using an sdcard loaded with maps. just like the Garmin, the phone has the option of updating its maps via sdcard. just like the Garmin, the phone has the option of using a PC/Mac to install new/updated maps. unlike the Garmin, which stops there in its abilities, the phone still has MORE options like:

cellular download

Wi-Fi download

Wi-Fi direct sharing

Bluetooth sharing

usb-otg transfers between other devices like hard drives, USB sticks, tablets, phones, slaved sdcards, etc

 

all of which does not require plugging it into a computer , loading additional software (basecamp/mapsource/mapinstall/etc) , to get it done. 

those map install options on phones are also available for sharing gpx tracks, waypoints, kmz, kml, tcx, CSV, and any other file type, and of course the online hosting services for storing them, which the Garmin can't do without plugging into a computer. 

now I know there is some borrowing of data from smartphones to get weather info (that the Garmin can't do on its own), and very minimal interaction between the explorer and phones, but it's extremely limited in comparison. 

4  are we taking about topo maps, base map, routable maps, for the globe or just a small section of the USA ? it matters because that's going to get cost prohibitive on the Garmin with "preloads" , VERY expensive.

5 now you're getting around to it. yup, free maps that cover the planet await both devices, but it's a lot easier on the smartphone to get them. 

6 not sure why that matters unless you're trying to upload selfies? the phone doesn't care if there is service , cellular, Wi-Fi, other. 

7 ditto

8 I have a nice, big, bright 5" screen on my handle bars. it cost thirty eight dollars, plus $2 for the mount and $6 for the application. my Garmin experiment devices were sold on eBay. 

again, cellular service is not needed, ever. it is nice to have once I get back to town, but otherwise, I just run airplane mode and enjoy the lack of interruptions. 

 

 

 

[pat22043]

2 minutes ago, ohgood said:

3 incorrect. just like the Garmin, the phone has the OPTION of using an sdcard loaded with maps. just like the Garmin, the phone has the option of updating its maps via sdcard. just like the Garmin, the phone has the option of using a PC/Mac to install new/updated maps. unlike the Garmin, which stops there in its abilities, the phone still has MORE options ...

you misunderstand me on connecting to "the internet" for maps. The maps, free or not, are on the Internet. You have to get them to your smartphone. You can use WiFi or cell or smoke signals, but you have to connect to the internet. Which you can't do on the trails. If you plan ahead, you can download before hand. If you don't plan ahead, you don't have maps.

My track record for planning ahead and downloading maps ahead of a trip is terrible. YMMV

[ohgood]

On 12/7/2017 at 8:08 AM, pat22043 said:

you misunderstand me on connecting to "the internet" for maps. The maps, free or not, are on the Internet. You have to get them to your smartphone. You can use WiFi or cell or smoke signals, but you have to connect to the internet. Which you can't do on the trails. If you plan ahead, you can download before hand. If you don't plan ahead, you don't have maps.

My track record for planning ahead and downloading maps ahead of a trip is terrible. YMMV

you can always pop in an sdcard also, on either the stand alone and smartphone. 

if the user doesn't plan ahead, it doesn't matter what the source used for maps might be. 

of course the smartphone can download maps on the way to the trail, and in some cases with good cellular coverage, while on the trail. the strand alone doesn't have that option.

[irme42day]

All this is well and good, but how well do any of them work in a horizontal position covered with a few inches of water or mud? And do any of them have an ALIEN EARLY WARNING SYSTEM?