Athena MONSTER Big Bore Kit 14.75:1

[WERNER1]

5 hours ago, bajatrailrider said:

If you ride open roads it would work,  trail mountain riding no

I've been researching this for quite a while now... (A couple of years..) ... it seems to me that the consensus was that on a Higher Compression engine with some good porting and carb/exhaust set up and everything dialed in in terms of Degree'ing the cam and everything, that the ST 2.5 would "Pull like a diesel" down low.... especially if geared appropriately(?) .... I'm not looking for Steep Slow Single Track type of performance out of my necessarily,... but this is what I've surmised after soaking all the info up on this subject.. ?  

[bajatrailrider]

1 minute ago, WERNER1 said:

I've been researching this for quite a while now... (A couple of years..) ... it seems to me that the consensus was that on a Higher Compression engine with some good porting and carb/exhaust set up and everything dialed in in terms of Degree'ing the cam and everything, that the ST 2.5 would "Pull like a diesel" down low.... especially if geared appropriately(?) .... I'm not looking for Steep Slow Single Track type of performance out of my necessarily,... but this is what I've surmised after soaking all the info up on this subject.. ?  

That is exactly how our strokers work with 2.5 cam. They can up shift on hill climb and  steep trail. As I stated both use 14/45 gear with heavy tall 400/18 tire. You never gear up trail bike like that. For tight single track hill climbing. Stock is 13/50 with small tire. Even with 15/45 gear they quickly run out of gear in 6th. What is the limit the 230 was never made to run at those speeds. In the dirt hold on baby . Repeat non stroke same build up to 233cc. With 2.5 cam  3/4 to top end strong screamer. Of course my opinion only the 230 is a low end grunt bike. Build engine that you need rev the piss out  of it. Short  shelf life  lots of clutch.slipping to climb trails. I would think  1.5 or 2.0 cam May give.more bottom end. 

[woodsryder]

Its always been known that a cam feels smaller as displacement goes up. In other words a mid range cam in a small bore feels like a torque cam in a large bore. Im now seeing that its a pretty big difference when displacement goes up . A friend had a 1.0 cam with 67 wiseco piston and it had a great balance with improved bottom and still better than stock everywhere else. Like stock but with the volume turned up 15% The engine then turned into a 254 6mm stroker but had to run the same 1.0 cam for a while until another one arrived. That transformed the engine into a bottom end monster that pings a lot but falls completely flat after mid range. Just like conventional wisdom says it should.

That's why some people say a 2.5 or 89A cam kills the low end and others say they have great low end. It depends on the displacement. You wonder how they could be describing the same cam?

For another reference point Im running a 67 bore 233 with 1.5 cam and it has better than stock low end with a playful midrange surge, I love it. If I ever stroke it, Ill run a 2.5 to get the exact same feel but amped up a bit.

[mixxer]

20 hours ago, woodsryder said:

Its always been known that a cam feels smaller as displacement goes up. In other words a mid range cam in a small bore feels like a torque cam in a large bore. Im now seeing that its a pretty big difference when displacement goes up . A friend had a 1.0 cam with 67 wiseco piston and it had a great balance with improved bottom and still better than stock everywhere else. Like stock but with the volume turned up 15% The engine then turned into a 254 6mm stroker but had to run the same 1.0 cam for a while until another one arrived. That transformed the engine into a bottom end monster that pings a lot but falls completely flat after mid range. Just like conventional wisdom says it should.

That's why some people say a 2.5 or 89A cam kills the low end and others say they have great low end. It depends on the displacement. You wonder how they could be describing the same cam?

For another reference point Im running a 67 bore 233 with 1.5 cam and it has better than stock low end with a playful midrange surge, I love it. If I ever stroke it, Ill run a 2.5 to get the exact same feel but amped up a bit.

Spot on perfect info....

I run a ST1.5 grind in my 233 ... Tight squish... Bigger pumper carb ... +1 intake valve and porting....

It pulls like a tractor down on the bottom..  gearing is +1front/ -1rear and it pulls it in the Appalachian Mountains perfectly... 

and close to the midrange statement about yours, mine feels a bit more than playful... the midrange rush is hard to believe, unless you ride it yourself....

 

Edited April 23, 2020 by mixxer

[ghostdancing]

On 4/7/2020 at 5:13 PM, WERNER1 said:

I guess I need to read through your "Squish" thread

cannot found it on TT...can somebody help me?

[ramz]

Check it out:

https://thumpertalk.com/forums/topic/1273642-puff-the-magic-squish-band/

 

I used a google  'site search' - "site:thumpertalk.com squish mixxer"

Edited September 11, 2021 by ramz

[adnohguy]

There are 11 pages of posts here in this thread. Most posted in this thread I’m guessing either have a stock Honda cam in there 230f or some version of a web cam in there 230f. 
If there there is any one that uses some other brand of cam in there 230f please post what brand of cam your using. 
Thank you. 

[Trialsalot]

Available CRF230F CAMs?

I’ve got an Athena kit to add to get some more low and mid range umph from my 230.   What available Cams are there now that are appropriate?   Web Cams is only listing the 282 cam now and I see the Engine’s Only Stage 1 Torquer Cam but it is a little pricey.   I think I would have liked a ST1.5 if they were still available and were reliable.  I think I heard that some that some of the Web Cam ST1.5’s were not wearing well?

Thx

[chadzu]

1 hour ago, Trialsalot said:

Available CRF230F CAMs?

I’ve got an Athena kit to add to get some more low and mid range umph from my 230.   What available Cams are there now that are appropriate?   Web Cams is only listing the 282 cam now and I see the Engine’s Only Stage 1 Torquer Cam but it is a little pricey.   I think I would have liked a ST1.5 if they were still available and were reliable.  I think I heard that some that some of the Web Cam ST1.5’s were not wearing well?

Thx

Web cams are listed under crf150f.  Myself and woodsryder are using the China cam, and that is going well so far

Edited June 23, 2022 by chadzu

[adnohguy]

1 hour ago, chadzu said:

Web cams are listed under crf150f.  Myself and woodsryder are using the China cam, and that is going well so far

The 283 Web cam is the only cam I have ever tried and is only better than the terrible BBR cam(and stock of course)  (it’s one of two most lack luster cams made for the 230f, that I have ever tired. Terrible! (And they claim 5 extra Hp with the web 282 cam.) Hogwash. 

Edited June 23, 2022 by adnohguy

[chadzu]

3 minutes ago, adnohguy said:

The only cam I have ever tried is only better than the terrible BBR cam(and stock of course)  (it’s one of two most lack luster cams made for the 230f, Terrible! (And they claim 5 extra Hp with the cam.) Hogwash. 

?

[adnohguy]

2 hours ago, Trialsalot said:

Available CRF230F CAMs?

I’ve got an Athena kit to add to get some more low and mid range umph from my 230.   What available Cams are there now that are appropriate?   Web Cams is only listing the 282 cam now and I see the Engine’s Only Stage 1 Torquer Cam but it is a little pricey.   I think I would have liked a ST1.5 if they were still available and were reliable.  I think I heard that some that some of the Web Cam ST1.5’s were not wearing well?

Thx

You want added torque then the Web 340-402 is the choice. You want top end and some loss of torque the the Web 89a is the choice. Your want torque and top end then you need excellent porting  with that 89a
 You want inexpensive and extremely quiet engine with a really wide flat power band that has no surges or steps in the power (like stock) the you need a China land cam roller cam and you have at least a dozen choices to choose from on E Bay, good luck experimenting with those. 

Edited June 23, 2022 by adnohguy

[adnohguy]

13 minutes ago, chadzu said:

?

Please excuse me, The web 282. 

[Trialsalot]

Adnohguy,   Thanks for your input.    I did not see 340-402 cam on Webcam’s website under the CRF230F or CRF150F cam listings.  Under the CRF150F listings I only saw one cam listed (Regrind# 223/167, Valve Lift .300/.280). 

Is this an issue that I should just call Web Cam and see if they have 340-402 profile and ask if they will grind that profile for me?

[adnohguy]

1 hour ago, Trialsalot said:

Adnohguy,   Thanks for your input.    I did not see 340-402 cam on Webcam’s website under the CRF230F or CRF150F cam listings.  Under the CRF150F listings I only saw one cam listed (Regrind# 223/167, Valve Lift .300/.280). 

Is this an issue that I should just call Web Cam and see if they have 340-402 profile and ask if they will grind that profile for me?

340-402 is correct, it’s a torque cam for a 2005 or older 150f or any year 230f they will charge you for a cam core of you don’t ship them your old cam and you should send in your rocker arms so they can hard Chrome  the pads on them where they run on the cam lobes  (for long life) also remove the nuts and adjusting screws from the rockers before sending them and the cam to Web. 
if you want to ride while your waiting for your cam and rockers to be processed, you can find used ones on E Bay to send to web. Just clean them up before shipping.  Otherwise you will be down with out a ride while your waiting. 
You also need a genuine Honda factory OEM shop manual for procedures and torque specs. ( plenty of photos and illustrations also) From E Bay Also.
If you want proper porting also, Pm me, for more information, I can help you….

 

 

Edited June 23, 2022 by adnohguy