OEM Bearing cross reference

[MartyMOOSE]

Looking for a Yamaha OEM p/n 93306-20336, anyone have the dimensions for this bearing or a way of finding them non gen ? In a hurry to get a bike back together for a weekend race after a little mishap last weekend:) 

MM 

[MartyMOOSE]

Guys chasing a Yamaha bearing from a bearing supply company. Does anyone know how to take the OEM part number and cross referance it with a bearing company's numbers ?  The Yamaha part No is 93306-20336 . I also need a 93306-00426 which is a 20x42x12 bearing.

Cheers 

MM 

[GuyGraham]

Its a 6203 as per the middle numbers in the Yam Pt No.

17 x 40 x 12

Edited July 24, 2018 by GuyGraham

[MartyMOOSE]

Well you learn something everyday Cheers ?

 

MM 

[BOAB]

A lot of bearings nowadays are proprietary.  I discovered this recently working on a Honda.  The guy at the bearing shop said it is more and more common for this to be the case.

[ac717]

Measure bearing with caliper and give dimensions to bearing place. I cannot think of a single proprietary bearing on a dirtbike, but anything is possible.Most have a number on the side of the race. All balls has a crossover chart on their site also.

[babyarmholdingapple]

3 minutes ago, ac717 said:

Measure bearing with caliper and give dimensions to bearing place. I cannot think of a single proprietary bearing on a dirtbike, but anything is possible.Most have a number on the side of the race. All balls has a crossover chart on their site also.

I just bring them in and sit them on the counter at my locale (75 miles) bearing house and 30 minutes later he hands me the new ones. That simple. 

[BOAB]

13 minutes ago, ac717 said:

Measure bearing with caliper and give dimensions to bearing place. I cannot think of a single proprietary bearing on a dirtbike, but anything is possible.Most have a number on the side of the race. All balls has a crossover chart on their site also.

Hondas have a bunch of them now.  Swingarm/linkage bearings being a good example.

Edited July 24, 2018 by cjjeepercreeper

[kdxyardsale]

Most bearings have a number scribed on the face or the seal as well as a manufacturer, of course you have to get to them to read it. Any good bearing shop can then cross to whatever brand you want.

[BOAB]

59 minutes ago, kdxyardsale said:

Most bearings have a number scribed on the face or the seal as well as a manufacturer, of course you have to get to them to read it. Any good bearing shop can then cross to whatever brand you want.

They have a number.  Then they go to cross reference it and discover it is proprietary.  Happens a lot.

[Chuck.]

Honda part fiche descriptions list the metric bearing standard number,  and for most standard bearings it is also coded into the part number.  Sometimes you will find a bearing with a standard number on it but it is non standard. e.g tapered roller steering head bearings are 25x47 but Honda buys them with 1mm larger ID. 

Part description: "BEARING, RADIAL BALL (6904)" is a 6904 bearing.

As previously posted measure the ID, OD, and thickness.

Deep Groove Metric Ball Bearings
# . . . .  IDxODxTH
6000 ... 10x26x8
16100.. 10x28x8
6200.. . 10x30x9
6300. .. 10x35x11
16001.. 12x28x7
6201 ... 12x32x10
16101.. 12x32x8
16101.. 12x32x8
6301... 12x37x12
6301... 12x37x12
6802... 15x24x5
6902... 15x28x7
16002.. 15x32x8
6002... 15x32x9
6202... 15x35x11
6302... 15x42x13
6302... 15x42x13
6003... 17x35x10
16003.. 17x35x8
16003.. 17x35x8
6203... 17x40x12
6203... 17x40x12
6303... 17x47x14
6303... 17x47x14
6904... 20x37x9
6904 ... 20x37x9
6004... 20x42x12
6204... 20x47x14
6204... 20x47x14
6304... 20x52x15
6905... 25x42x9
6005... 25x47x12
16005.. 25x47x8
6205... 25x52x15
6305... 25x62x17
6006... 30x55x13
16006.. 30x55x9
6206... 30x62x16
6306.... 30x72x19
6207... 35x72x17

 

 

[kdxyardsale]

1 hour ago, cjjeepercreeper said:

They have a number.  Then they go to cross reference it and discover it is proprietary.  Happens a lot.

Not saying that is not true sometimes but for example here is one of the bearings he is chasing down. It clearly has a manufacturer and bearing number that is cross referencable to SKF or your favorite flavor.

http://www.skf.com/us/products/bearings-units-housings/roller-bearings/cylindrical-roller-bearings/single-row-cylindrical-roller-bearings/single-row/index.html?designation=NU 1009 ECP

[solimine]

There's more to it than width and diameter.  The primary consideration for IC engines is the ball to race clearance known as "class.".  There's also variations in cage materials. 

http://www.skf.com/us/products/bearings-units-housings/principles/bearing-selection-process/index.html   

[steamboatshadetreeme]

i believe from the yamaha part number the bearing you need is a 6203 bearing -- yamaha part numbers are a bit funny that way -- the other bearing you need is a 6004... 9330(6-004)26--- which measures what you said  therefore the 9330(6-203)36 is a 6203 bearing which is 17x40x12 .. should be a number on the bearing itself also or do the measure deal and use the chart from a previous poster

[Chuck.]

The clearance class is especially important for 2T engine main bearings because of the higher thermal dynamics than in a 4T, but you never know so I prefer to use OEM for mains unless I can determine the class.

For other bearing the standard and readily available Class 3 is all you need.

And the common failure mode for wheel bearings is not load and speed but dirt/water ingestion. So always buy sealed both sides and quality is not a issue.  Each bearing mfg publishes load, speed, and mean time to failure data for each model and a bearing shop can help you find a price point for your application.

[mbrick]

1 hour ago, solimine said:

There's more to it than width and diameter.  The primary consideration for IC engines is the ball to race clearance known as "class.".  There's also variations in cage materials. 

http://www.skf.com/us/products/bearings-units-housings/principles/bearing-selection-process/index.html   

Ball to race clearance is indeed what is very important, but that is not actually "class".

Class refers to the tolerances on the bearing (OD, ID and width) and one manner to specify is ABEC1, ABEC3, ABEC5, etc. with higher numbers having tighter tolerances.  There are also IT3, IT4, etc series. And also SKF Normal, P5 and P6.  And then, there are fit classes which are taken into account with the bore/shaftsuch as N6, P7, P6 in the case of an interference fit.

The ball to race clearance is called radial play or radial internal clearance and depends on the diameter but for SKF is called out in classes of C2, normal, C3, C4, C5  (not specified in the part number means 'normal').  On a 6004 bearing with 20mm bore diameter, C2 is 0-10um of radial play, normal is 5-20um, C3 13-28, C4 20-36, and C5 28-48.  It is hard to tell which original play was used just from the number on the side of the bearing, but in most cases 'normal' will probably work.

If you pick the wrong internal clearance and there is not enough play after the press fit, or during steady state running when the ID is hotter than the OD, it could last a very short amount of time.

And then there are different materials for both the races and balls, such as chrome moly steel, or chrome plated steel.

This is all determined by the full part number, such as SKF 6004-2RSH.

You can learn TONS about bearings including tolerances, fit classes and clearances from the SKF catalog, they have 200 pages of education before the actual part numbers: http://www.skf.com/binary/77-121486/SKF-rolling-bearings-catalogue.pdf

All this to say, you can get close to the same over the shelf but it's hard to know exactly what Honda/Yamaha designed for.  Wheel bearings are going to be a lot less sensitive than crank bearings.

Edited July 25, 2018 by mbrick

[GuyGraham]

On 7/24/2018 at 3:15 PM, cjjeepercreeper said:

Hondas have a bunch of them now.  Swingarm/linkage bearings being a good example.

This has been going on for decades

My YZ250 1988 has a 'special' in the rear suspension linkage which is only available from Yamaha

DRZ400 main bearings are specials but have the std code stamped on them. Theyare 1mm narrower than the code suggests

They do it to make you buy them from them but the bearings are still made by the usual bearing companys

Edited July 26, 2018 by GuyGraham

[BOAB]

1 hour ago, GuyGraham said:

This has been going on for decades

My YZ250 1988 has a 'special' in the rear suspension linkage which is only available from Yamaha

DRZ400 main bearings are specials but have the std code stamped on them. Theyare 1mm narrower than the code suggests

They do it to make you buy them from them but the bearings are still made by the usual bearing companys

Yep, the Hondas are Koyos.

[Chuck.]

13 hours ago, cjjeepercreeper said:

Yep, the Hondas are Koyos.

Honda also uses NTN bearings.

[solimine]

On ‎7‎/‎24‎/‎2018 at 4:59 PM, mbrick said:

Ball to race clearance is indeed what is very important, but that is not actually "class".

Class refers to the tolerances on the bearing (OD, ID and width) and one manner to specify is ABEC1, ABEC3, ABEC5, etc. with higher numbers having tighter tolerances.  There are also IT3, IT4, etc series. And also SKF Normal, P5 and P6.  And then, there are fit classes which are taken into account with the bore/shaftsuch as N6, P7, P6 in the case of an interference fit.

The ball to race clearance is called radial play or radial internal clearance and depends on the diameter but for SKF is called out in classes of C2, normal, C3, C4, C5  (not specified in the part number means 'normal').  On a 6004 bearing with 20mm bore diameter, C2 is 0-10um of radial play, normal is 5-20um, C3 13-28, C4 20-36, and C5 28-48.  It is hard to tell which original play was used just from the number on the side of the bearing, but in most cases 'normal' will probably work.

If you pick the wrong internal clearance and there is not enough play after the press fit, or during steady state running when the ID is hotter than the OD, it could last a very short amount of time.

And then there are different materials for both the races and balls, such as chrome moly steel, or chrome plated steel.

This is all determined by the full part number, such as SKF 6004-2RSH.

You can learn TONS about bearings including tolerances, fit classes and clearances from the SKF catalog, they have 200 pages of education before the actual part numbers: http://www.skf.com/binary/77-121486/SKF-rolling-bearings-catalogue.pdf

All this to say, you can get close to the same over the shelf but it's hard to know exactly what Honda/Yamaha designed for.  Wheel bearings are going to be a lot less sensitive than crank bearings.

I apologize, my over simplified post was misleading.