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drz400e wide gear ratio..answer to my dilemma?

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So im having a dilemma highway speed at a comfortable rev and capable offroad bike that can handle most moderate technical dirtbike trails. not looking for a pro level easy gnarly dirtbike and race level, but a bike that can hang out with average dirtbike riders and do their basic/moderate trails and also hop on the highway when the trails end. I have my DRZ400E geared at 15/38. I can surf 70 75 mph fine but holy hell i better feather the clutch at low speeds if not bike will shut off but I can do open roads all day.

 

the issue is when I need to go slow and need that low end boost. My idea gearing for my taste is 15/44 but forget highway riding.

 

seeing this wide gear ratio setup, im seeing he has 15/44 and dang the revs are so low at 70 / 80mph!!?? I believe first gear is untouched so it has that low end pull if needed. 

 

you guys have any experience or any recommendations? is the DRZ-E a capable dirtbike that can do most dirtbike trails? again not looking for race performance bike for super advanced 5 foot boulder climbs lol. Mostly the last video is what 80% of our trails are like

 

 

**not my videos just posting for demonstration on what i ride**

 

 

 

 

 

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I talk as many ACT requests out of them as I do install them.... Think Ive done 9 installs now.

8 like them, one does not and we have worked final gearing to the point it is super low in 1st and hardly higher in 5th then it was with stock gears, and that is on a 60hp stroker, big bore, web cam, FCR39 build...To each his own.

ACT gears with final drive ratios of 15/44--46 14/44-42 require more then stock HP in my opinion to be satisfactory to most riders and the rider has understand it will be like driving a mid 1980s 5 speed econ box in the top gears... Cruse is fine in 5th , want to pass, climb a hill, down shift, maybe twice.
That suits most, but not all
Yes 1st gear is unchanged by the ACT gears, they effect only 2-5

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6 minutes ago, Erik Marquez said:

I talk as many ACT requests out of them as I do install them.... Think Ive done 9 installs now.

8 like them, one does not and we have worked final gearing to the point it is super low in 1st and hardly higher in 5th then it was with stock gears, and that is on a 60hp stroker, big bore, web cam, FCR39 build...To each his own.

ACT gears with final drive ratios of 15/44--46 14/44-42 require more then stock HP in my opinion to be satisfactory to most riders and the rider has understand it will be like driving a mid 1980s 5 speed econ box in the top gears... Cruse is fine in 5th , want to pass, climb a hill, down shift, maybe twice.
That suits most, but not all
Yes 1st gear is unchanged by the ACT gears, they effect only 2-5

 

 

so my current gearing is 15/38 now. Im pretty happy with it now except the low end due to the high gearing. me shift down 2 times im ok with (do it with my klx250s) but that youtube video, can it cruise 75 MPH on stock HP? or would I definitely need a bigbore?

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2 hours ago, willc86 said:

 can it cruise 75 MPH on stock HP? or would I definitely need a bigbore?

can it? yes
Would I like that under powered heavy bike that can not get out of its own way? NO
But some will...its preference.
I built a 4mm stroker ACT gear, every thing else stock from Mikuni BSR carb to cams and bore. The bike was used once, and set aside till he could afford the rest of the build... it was all but un rideable do to low power overall and pre detonation without VP 110 gas.
The 4mm crank was the reason for the real issue pre detonation, but the lack of power was just not fun either. 

Others may be fine with it...to each his own.

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Posted (edited)

thanks for the reply! so getting a wider gear ratio I will lose some power then since technically the gear will be higher?.. kind of like my 15/38 now

I might look into a bigebore kit then if thats the case unless I can find a bike with good highway cruising and can handle like a klx250s offroad

Edited by willc86

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I sure wouldn't do the ACT gears without at min a BB kit and higher comp that borders needing 91/93 . With a stroker, high comp(91 min but mixing MS105L because I can ), plus a BB/cams/pipe/fcr41, it's now a fun bike that can pull those gears . I went 40 miles @ 85mph with the motor just about idling , no way even a bb would do that but then you can always stick with lower gearing to match the power , bonus is first gear can then be low like it should be and the jump to 2nd isn't much more than stock @ a bit higher gearing .  I think to go as far as the gear swap , put in the stroker crank and leave the topend till later and see how you like it, maybe do the single layer base gasket .

Another option that may be better is the Nova gears instead of the ACT . They are roughly ½ way between stock and the ACT , but OMG the cost. http://www.novaracing.co.uk/ProductSuzukiDRZ400WideRatioGearbox20002013.html

.

Edited by jjktmrider

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2 hours ago, willc86 said:

thanks for the reply! so getting a wider gear ratio I will lose some power then since technically the gear will be higher?.. kind of like my 15/38 now

I might look into a bigebore kit then if thats the case unless I can find a bike with good highway cruising and can handle like a klx250s offroad

Just to be clear. the power has not changed with the taller gears...But yes, it will "feel" less powerful do to the gear change

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gotcha thanks all. ill look at this and see maybe ill try it out at the end of this year. might be a good light ADV/exploring bike in Colorado for me. 

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2 minutes ago, jjktmrider said:

I think to go as far as the gear swap , put in the stroker crank and leave the topend till later and see how you like it,

I tried it for a customer...it was a colossal failure making the bike unusable till the rest of the build was done.
the cases needed split due to a broken drive shaft, so in went the stroker crank to "save money now" on labor vice splitting the cases again later..

The plan was ride the bike for the rest of the year and see if he liked it at all (was a new used bike to him that sheared the drive shaft end the day it was test ridden after sale) what it ended up was a bike with a new bottom end and transmission that sat in the shop till months later when i did the rest of the planned build.

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so if I do the ACT gears (i prefer the longer gears) and possibly gear it 15/45

 

I should do Cams, Big bore, maybe exhaust and headers right? anything else? I have a DRZ400E so I think I already have the FC41r carb? i think....

 

I probably wont mind spending this dough on a bike since I think the DRZ400 is exactly the perfect bike for my needs. basic 50 in trails and highway for exploring. 

can you guys provide me info if the DRZ400E is capable of doing those trail I posted above? I just want to make sure before I spend this kind of dough.  then eventually ill probably get a EXC-F 250 for more technical stuff down the road possibly

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thanks man really appreciate it! ill prob do the ACT gears first, see how they feel, then proceed with full upgrade

man cant wait to get this done! finally a bike that can do highway speeds and trails!

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3 hours ago, willc86 said:

thanks man really appreciate it! ill prob do the ACT gears first, see how they feel, then proceed with full upgrade

man cant wait to get this done! finally a bike that can do highway speeds and trails!

Amen brother, I do alot of adv touring and trails like that on my DRZs 434 with stock pipe and carb. (bsr) but I chose not to put the ACT gears in my bike when I replaced the crank in the winter. With the tall gearing I like (similar to yours at 16/42) I just keep up some speed through the tougher sections. And if I'm doing only super tight narly trails, I'll swap the front sprocket  for 14 or even 13 in about 10 min. using the same chain. I just did not want the huge jump between gears, that the ACT would give you.

You may like it, but still, if your into adv touring and trail riding with one bike, I don't think you can beat the DRZ. I've contiplated other newer bike's, but all give up things that I like in the DRZ.

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My Aussie E now as ACT gears, no big bore or stroke, and is all good.  I use the standard 14/47 sprockets (used 15/47 with the standard gears).  

ACT 4th gear isn't that much different to standard 5th (a little lower), which should give you an idea of how the bike will perform.  Gears 1-3 are still close enough, feel like a factory gearbox spacing, but 3-4 and 4-5 have noticeable gaps.  4-5 is a fairly wide gap but there is enough overlap not to be a problem.  I doubt any motorcycle manufacturer would be happy with it though.  5th is for highways only, no use below 80kph.  Our speed limits are ridiculously low so 14/47 is sufficient.  Not sure how much faster I'd want to go on a DRZ anyway! 

As already stated, the Nova gears are closer and probably better spaced for the DRZ but are soooo expensive, anyone would have to really love DRZs to invest!  

IMHO the gears do improve the DRZ.  I won't repeat myself in relation to whether I think it was worth it!

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I tried it for a customer...it was a colossal failure making the bike unusable till the rest of the build was done.
the cases needed split due to a broken drive shaft, so in went the stroker crank to "save money now" on labor vice splitting the cases again later..

The plan was ride the bike for the rest of the year and see if he liked it at all (was a new used bike to him that sheared the drive shaft end the day it was test ridden after sale) what it ended up was a bike with a new bottom end and transmission that sat in the shop till months later when i did the rest of the planned build.
The problem wasn't the stroker, his compression is too high for his stock cams.

Without enough overlap of bigger cams or additional gaskets to lower CR, it will ping like an 80's pinball room.

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3 hours ago, revelc said:

The problem wasn't the stroker, his compression is too high for his stock cams.

Without enough overlap of bigger cams or additional gaskets to lower CR, it will ping like an 80's pinball room.

It had 11.3 or so compression....so not "high" compression either static or dynamic due to lack of cam lobe overlap.
Yes the stock cams were an issue of course, but it was not due to compression..

 

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It had 11.3 or so compression....so not "high" compression either static or dynamic due to lack of cam lobe overlap.
Yes the stock cams were an issue of course, but it was not due to compression..

 
The compression of the piston doesnt dictate overall compression.

http://www.enginebasics.com/Advanced%20Engine%20Tuning/Static%20vs%20Dynamic.html

Cams can absolutely influence this.

That's why it is recommended to run big cams with the stroker setups. Otherwise predetonation (pinging) and head gasket issues can arise.

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Just now, revelc said:

The compression of the piston doesnt dictate overall compression.

http://www.enginebasics.com/Advanced%20Engine%20Tuning/Static%20vs%20Dynamic.html

Cams can absolutely influence this.

That's why it is recommended to run big cams with the stroker setups. Otherwise predetonation (pinging) and head gasket issues can arise.

LOL, ok, thanks for that....
Yes Im aware...

Not trying to be difficult, but I was not guessing when I posted.
Not guessing on what the static and dynamic compression was (within a small range)
Not guessing that compression being "to high" was not a single reason as you seemed to imply in your other response.
Not guessing that a DRZ with 90mm bore, 4mm stroker crank, triple base gasket and stock S, E, or Hotcams "stage 2" will not run well.

Thanks for the discussion

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LOL, ok, thanks for that....
Yes Im aware...

Not trying to be difficult, but I was not guessing when I posted.
Not guessing on what the static and dynamic compression was (within a small range)
Not guessing that compression being "to high" was not a single reason as you seemed to imply in your other response.
Not guessing that a DRZ with 90mm bore, 4mm stroker crank, triple base gasket and stock S, E, or Hotcams "stage 2" will not run well.

Thanks for the discussion
Someones touchy.

I inferred the cams can be too small and lacked sufficient overlap thus raising compression.

I didnt just say compression alone was an issue.

If you weren't "guessing" why did you agree to build an engine for someone when you knew it wouldn't work?
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