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Tuning advice

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Been trying to get the suspension on my '11 GasGas EC250 dialed in for several months now and can't seem to get it where I want it.  It's pretty good but I know it can be better. I'm hoping for a little advice to get me going in the correct direction.

I'm right at 140lbs without gear and a mid to bottom B rider/racer. I ride rocks, hard pack, sand, and silt, from hike-a-bike technical to hare scrambles/GP's, and some very beat up trails.

Forks are Marzocchi PFP 48's, .38kg main springs, 1.4 cartridge spring, Maxima 85/150 5wt oil, 210cc cartridge, 300cc outer, 0mm main spring preload, PFP fully out, compression 19, rebound fully closed, 5mm above clamps. Shock is Ohlins 888, 4.8kg spring, sag 103mm, hsc 3, low compression 26, rebound 8. Suspension front and rear was re-valved by Motolab for the previous owner who was a 180lb rider of similar skill and when I bought the bike it had .44/5.4kg springs installed

Front is really plush eating up trail junk, does well on square edges, and zero deflection. However, the front wants to wash pretty easily and when riding sand it is really tough getting the bike to go where I want to and to hold a line. Tried slowing the rebound as much as I could without fixing the problem. Next I started dialing out the PFP in hopes of slowing it down. It seems to have helped some but it still feels like I'm maybe 3-4 rebound clicks away from being where I want it.

The rear kicks a lot but not severe as if it's going to eject me but it definitely feels busy.

So, my left fork seal started leaking so I gotta have them out anyway. Should I try to switch back to a heavier fork oil (26.7cst@40 vs 16.2cst) like factory? Maybe raise the forks some more? Trying to avoid a re-valve right now as my budget is tight being it's the holiday season. I just don't know which way to go as my mind is reeling from all the variables and I think I have lost sight on how to get it where I want it.

Edited by SS109
typos

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5 hours ago, SS109 said:

Forks 0mm main spring preload, PFP fully out, compression 19, rebound fully closed.

Shock, hsc 3, low compression 26, rebound 8.

Just looking at your setting I think you are way off or the revalve is fu**ed up. Suspensions need bleed on the midvalve and to rebound, the forks cannot work with the rebound fully closed. Springs need preload for traction, at least 3-4 mm. The shock setting looks unbalance, firm on the midvalve (-8) and very soft on the basevalve (-3 and -26), sounds like a cavitation machine.

I would start over. Be sure you have the right springs, fresh oil, preload your springs, and put all the clickers at 12. Ride and play with clickers, if you end up in extreme position (clickers and/or you 🙂) you need a revalve.

For your spring preload, if you have an external adjustment and it is at 0 maybe your springs are still preload. It is measurements you have to do while it is appart. On my WP OC I do set the preload at 3mm with external adjusters at 0.

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I serviced the forks (cartridge and outer) when I bought the bike since I needed to change spring rates. The shock I just slapped a new spring on. I'll go get a basic service done on it and start over. As for the preload, the cartridge has 4 internal positions like most other brands have. They are 0, 5, 10, 15mm preload increments. The PFP just changes the starting pressure in the cartridge.

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On November 28, 2018 at 6:12 AM, texasthierry said:

Just looking at your setting I think you are way off or the revalve is fu**ed up. Suspensions need bleed on the midvalve and to rebound, the forks cannot work with the rebound fully closed. Springs need preload for traction, at least 3-4 mm. The shock setting looks unbalance, firm on the midvalve (-8) and very soft on the basevalve (-3 and -26), sounds like a cavitation machine.

I would start over. Be sure you have the right springs, fresh oil, preload your springs, and put all the clickers at 12. Ride and play with clickers, if you end up in extreme position (clickers and/or you 🙂) you need a revalve.

For your spring preload, if you have an external adjustment and it is at 0 maybe your springs are still preload. It is measurements you have to do while it is appart. On my WP OC I do set the preload at 3mm with external adjusters at 0.

What would be considered sufficient bleed? Like a minimum 8-9 clicks from closed?

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9 hours ago, The Creature said:

What would be considered sufficient bleed? Like a minimum 8-9 clicks from closed?

It will depends of the needle shape, bleed size and mm/clicks but if it is well engineered it should be in between 8 and 15. I don't say to not go other that but if the bike feel better at 4 or 19 for example it can be an indication that it could be improved internally. The basevalve should definitely never be too much open to control the ride high (that's why some tuners use a bleed stack).

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Looking to slow my rebound down. Does anyone know what I can do with th existing shims I have to accomplish this? My rebound stack is...

Nut
11 x 2.5 spacer
11 x .10
11 x .30
14 x .15
17 x .10
20 x .10 (3)
12 x .10
piston (larger opening facing nut side and there is a small bushing/spacer in it on the same side if it makes a difference)
20 x .10 (2)
11 x .10
11 x .25
18 x .15

 

rebound stack.jpg

Edited by SS109

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The 12 looks like a bleed shim , you could remove it and put it into the stack in the taper

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So remove the 12 x .10 bleed to the top of the stack. What about the other side of the piston? Could I swap the 11mm shims around or even move the 18 x .15 closer to the piston and then the 11's further out from the piston?

Sorry, what I'm asking might not make sense to someone who understands valving as I know nothing about it really. This is literally the first time I've ever even thought about changing the valving myself.

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Possibly, it will stiffen compression, I'm not sure if that 18 shim is used to limit the bending if the shims on compression

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