Jump to content
Bryan Bosch

Video: KTM'S CARB VS TPI (TRANSFER PORT INJECTION)

Recommended Posts

On 1/17/2019 at 7:39 PM, luckypunk said:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zEkR24sfS5A

I was just watching some vids and saw this one that popped up that seems to be a montage of the (facebook) user posted problem vids

Sheeez that’s a pretty &%$#@!ed up vid!!! Holy shit!!!! Thanks for sharing... warning ⚠️ whatever. To me it seems ktm and Husky are on the highest point right now  with the carbed 17 and 18 ‘    300 counterbalancer and the finally fixed estart.  The suspension doesn’t matter to me. It’s setup and go with the better modded for ones type of riding and weight. I know some are all crazy about kyb.. whatever. To me for right now stick to the carb and watch the tpi guys. Just wait and watch and see what needs to be done.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
58 minutes ago, 240ZDAN said:

Im not sure what you're implying here. Are you taking about running premix in your TPI and ditching the oil injection? Have you forgotten about the crank bearings?

Again.... @uniflow had a working TPI design FOR SEVERAL YEARS prior to KTM that WAS PREMIX ONLY.  

The TPI injector on time is greater than the duration of transport port airflow.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
10 minutes ago, hawaiidirtrider said:

Sheeez that’s a pretty &%$#@!ed up vid!!! Holy shit!!!! Thanks for sharing... warning ⚠️ whatever. To me it seems ktm and Husky are on the highest point right now  with the carbed 17 and 18 ‘    300 counterbalancer and the finally fixed estart.  The suspension doesn’t matter to me. It’s setup and go with the better modded for ones type of riding and weight. I know some are all crazy about kyb.. whatever. To me for right now stick to the carb and watch the tpi guys. Just wait and watch and see what needs to be done.

Let's see here....nope, no KTM in that signature.  Why are you here HDR?  You scream bloody murder anytime I step foot in the Beater forum.

  • Like 1
  • Helpful 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
20 hours ago, redrider144 said:

Again.... @uniflow had a working TPI design FOR SEVERAL YEARS prior to KTM that WAS PREMIX ONLY.  

The TPI injector on time is greater than the duration of transport port airflow.

I can't speak for KTM but with our YZ TPI  (2012) bike we ran a whole season with just premix fuel. You would be surprised where the twostroke oil ended up once it was deposited on a crank case or transfer port wall. Runs down to the bottom of the crank case and then ends up everywhere. We did run 40 to 1.

Next season we hooked up a crude, oil system as an added safeguard ( we didn't want any expensive problems while developing the rest of the TPI system) although it was largely a finished product by then. See it for yourself in youtube. 

There is a better injection system in the wind, TM may know something of it, once this is out it will spell the end to carburetors, no mater how 'smart'. 

Mark my words.

 

IMG_0854.JPG

Edited by uniflow
  • Like 5

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
10 hours ago, hawaiidirtrider said:

Sheeez that’s a pretty &%$#@!ed up vid!!! Holy shit!!!! Thanks for sharing... warning ⚠️ whatever. To me it seems ktm and Husky are on the highest point right now  with the carbed 17 and 18 ‘    300 counterbalancer and the finally fixed estart.  The suspension doesn’t matter to me. It’s setup and go with the better modded for ones type of riding and weight. I know some are all crazy about kyb.. whatever. To me for right now stick to the carb and watch the tpi guys. Just wait and watch and see what needs to be done.

Hey don’t worry, maybe Beta will come out with 2 stroke injection sometime this century and you too can enjoy the benefits. In the meantime, good luck tuning that marzochi garbage. 👍🏻 

  • Haha 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
11 hours ago, 240ZDAN said:

Im not sure what you're implying here. Are you taking about running premix in your TPI and ditching the oil injection? Have you forgotten about the crank bearings?

Somebody asked if the injectors could flow premix. Not implying ditching the oil injection, regardless of the hype here, the injection works good and does not easily lose Prime, the video shown is just used to reinforce already held beliefs of people who don’t like or don’t have a tpi.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
54 minutes ago, Boertmann84 said:

Hey don’t worry, maybe Beta will come out with 2 stroke injection sometime this century and you too can enjoy the benefits. In the meantime, good luck tuning that marzochi garbage. 👍🏻 

Sure Beta is going to have injection . It’s all part of EU . Duh you do know where Betas are made right. You know their 4 strokes are EFI right? And damn keep up. Beta has been running Sachs for years. Really there’s no reason to be sour . A couple  of my old Bikes with zokes work great  . And of course you can do whatever you like. Enjoy that tpi :thumbsup:we are in a ktm tpi thread. You don’t have to worry about an old style carbed Beta 2 t right.. or 4 t.. You should stick to the thread and the newest TPI ktm  here? Still I think that for now I  still think ktm’s best choice for 2 strokes are the 17’ and up ktm 300 with counterbalancer and  a carb. :excuseme::ride:  There’s nothing wrong with that. 

Edited by hawaiidirtrider

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
This thread is pretty funny, but also timely as I'm selling my 2 stroke 300, buying a new gen 4 stroke instead. 
My 300 is like the hot crazy chick, great sometimes, other times a major liability. 
I've ridden the new ktm 300 tpi and while I like it, I live in Washington State and our terrain has very significant elevation changes and our seasons can have us going from 30 degrees to 100 degrees. Considering where I ride, the 4 stroke really has the upper hand. 
The new generation of 4 strokes by KTM/Husky and Beta that I've ridden are so light, nimble and powerful, it takes away much of the downside of dumping a 2 stroke. 
So, Feb 1st I'm buying a 2018 fe450 to compliment my 2016 fe450 which I love... just want a lighter variation for extreme enduro days. One day I'll sell the 2016 and perhaps buy a 2 stroke again, but for now I'm glad to dump the hot chick..
Ok, carry on and keep clubbing each other like baby seals!
 

A bit off topic imo. Sounds like a good bye. Well go back to your big honken 4T and blaze on then.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4 minutes ago, hawaiidirtrider said:

Sure Beta is going to have injection . It’s all part of EU . Duh you do know where Betas are made right. You know their 4 strokes are EFI right? And damn keep up. Beta has been running Sachs for years. Really there’s no reason to be sour . A couple  of my old Bikes with zokes work great  . And of course you can do whatever you like. Enjoy that tpi :thumbsup:we are in a ktm tpi thread. You don’t have to worry about an old style carbed Beta 2 t right.. or 4 t.. You should stick to the thread and the newest TPI ktm  here? Still I think that for now I  still think ktm’s best choice for 2 strokes are the 17’ and up ktm 300 with counterbalancer and  a carb. :excuseme::ride:  There’s nothing wrong with that. 

2 stroke dirtbikes are notoriously difficult to fuel inject..... 4 strokes are relatively easy to do. Just because a manufacturer has injected 4 strokes doesn’t mean that tech will translate to smokers. I seriously considered a beta before I bought my tpi, but the suspension had me sceptical, if only I knew the xplor wasn’t great either. Have you ridden a tpi? If not, you should, there is not a better running two stroke out there.

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
30 minutes ago, Boertmann84 said:

2 stroke dirtbikes are notoriously difficult to fuel inject..... 4 strokes are relatively easy to do. Just because a manufacturer has injected 4 strokes doesn’t mean that tech will translate to smokers. I seriously considered a beta before I bought my tpi, but the suspension had me sceptical, if only I knew the xplor wasn’t great either. Have you ridden a tpi? If not, you should, there is not a better running two stroke out there.

Whatever..

“2 strokes are notoriously difficult to fuel inject...4 strokes are relatively easy to do”   Really???  You put fuel injection on 2 and 4 strokes???? 

. Like I said earlier I didn’t ride one yet . I’m just hanging out and learning and watching in threads and magazines  and watching friends bikes locally . In my case I have zero problems with carbs . I like them but I like to see new bikes and see what’s new and how everything works. For the guys riding different elevations I see fuel injection ought to be great.. tuning wise. 

As far as Beta suspension? Meh. It’s like KTM and every bike. You setup the suspension and go. Ive had no problems at all with my 3 Betas. They work great and I can upgrade to higher level suspension but haven’t yet. For my 300 rr at least . My other older bike forks work fine and not changing those forks. Maybe this year or next I might go endurospec cartridges. But that’s something else. 

It’s still just seeing how tpi works and if there are mods and tuning that might apply. You like your bike and it’s working good right? Well that’s good. 

Im just watching... and I know it’s coming for Beta and all euro bikes. It’s adapting to law. Is it better than a carb? Whatever.. we will see. 

Edited by hawaiidirtrider

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 1/17/2019 at 5:24 PM, SmokeX said:

The TPI bikes are cool!!

I think the next generation TPI will be awesome. I just want to thank everyone who has purchased a TPI bike thus far. This will help facilitate further funding for What’s to come. . :-).

you make a good point. Get a carburetor bike while you can. By the time the bike wears out, they will have the TPI sorted. 


 

Or it’s just dealing with negative and positive of TPI . 

It can be that a carb is better for many and you might aswell get the last one because.. well it’s better.  

Tpi is sounding great here from some. Hey that’s great!   Hope all this great news continues but that vid is still in the mix as far as seeing experiences from some.

Edited by hawaiidirtrider
  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Or it’s just dealing with negative and positive of TPI . 
It can be that a carb is better for many and you might aswell get the last one because.. well it’s better.  
Tpi is sounding great here from some. Hey that’s great!   Hope all this great news continues but that vid is still in the mix as far as seeing experiences from some.

It’s nice to see the technology come along. One day it will be as good a power delivery as the four strokes are today. It takes time and development.

Often times manufacturers implement a product knowing its flaws. As stated here on this thread pages back. The starter was one example. I feel safe with the carb for me. It also has the power delivery I want in a bike. The smile factor is a big factor for me. And a smile has been on my face since I got my 300XC.

:-)
  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The mikuni debacle has shown carbs are not perfect even after around 100 years

  • Like 1
  • Helpful 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
5 minutes ago, mog said:

The mikuni debacle has shown carbs are not perfect even after around 100 years

Agreed, fuel injection has made a world of difference in the four stroke world, unfortunately some people are clueless as to how the system works on four strokes and two strokes. It’s funny how people think the tpi is so complicated but if they bothered learning they would find the system is actually VERY simple. I think this fear of the unknown turns people off of tpi bikes.

  • Like 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Just now, Boertmann84 said:

Agreed, fuel injection has made a world of difference in the four stroke world, unfortunately some people are clueless as to how the system works on four strokes and two strokes. It’s funny how people think the tpi is so complicated but if they bothered learning they would find the system is actually VERY simple. I think this fear of the unknown turns people off of tpi bikes. Instead of watching dumb videos that affirm your already held beliefs, go out in a limb and actually learn how the system works.

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
9 minutes ago, mog said:

The mikuni debacle has shown carbs are not perfect even after around 100 years

Idk. On my cr Honda I ordered a keihin as many reported the Mikuni wasn’t good. By the the time my keihin carb came in my mikuni was jetted fine and just as good as the keihin.  I blew a couple hundred bucks for nothing.

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4 minutes ago, Boertmann84 said:

Agreed, fuel injection has made a world of difference in the four stroke world, unfortunately some people are clueless as to how the system works on four strokes and two strokes. It’s funny how people think the tpi is so complicated but if they bothered learning they would find the system is actually VERY simple. I think this fear of the unknown turns people off of tpi bikes.

So you can trouble shoot and fix you tpi and efi in the trails? 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
6 minutes ago, Boertmann84 said:

Agreed, fuel injection has made a world of difference in the four stroke world, unfortunately some people are clueless as to how the system works on four strokes and two strokes. It’s funny how people think the tpi is so complicated but if they bothered learning they would find the system is actually VERY simple. I think this fear of the unknown turns people off of tpi bikes.

What turns me off is needing a new ECU to properly tune it, and that the oil injection has zero feedback.   Well, I shouldn't say zero.  When the piston seizes in the cylinder from lack of oil, that's the current feedback mechanism.

Edited by redrider144
  • Haha 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The new mikini has 2 flaws ,JD jetting has all the info

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 minute ago, hawaiidirtrider said:

So you can trouble shoot and fix you tpi and efi in the trails? 

It’s never broke down. Complexity comes with performance. Do you know any 4 stroke rider wishing they still had a carb? I didn’t think so. Vast majority of tpi bikes are running flawlessly with zero issues. The so called failure points just are not failing.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Reply with:


×