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SmokeX

19 300XC at 60.5 hours

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1 hour ago, Trailryder42 said:

Please explain the thinking behind this, as it makes no sense to me.

No clue, I am not a battery expert, but it works every time when cold starting. 

Just because it doesn't make sense to you doesn't mean it isn't true. If you don't like it, don't try it. Simple as that. 

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15 minutes ago, shrub73 said:
No clue, I am not a battery expert, but it works every time when cold starting. 
Just because it doesn't make sense to you doesn't mean it isn't true. If you don't like it, don't try it. Simple as that. 


Some things work out for no apparent reason. I just go with what works 🙂  with that said, I have yet to try it. I’ll know this weekend. 
 

Edited by SmokeX
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30 minutes ago, shrub73 said:

No clue, I am not a battery expert, but it works every time when cold starting. 

Just because it doesn't make sense to you doesn't mean it isn't true. If you don't like it, don't try it. Simple as that. 

I didn't say it wasn't true. I just wanted you to state your understanding of how and why that would work, to "wake up" the battery. "Wake up" the battery?

"No clue, I am not a battery expert". OK, I accept that. You don't have an understanding of it. Simple as that.

Taking a few minutes to think about it myself, I surmise that by rocking the bike back and forth in gear with a cold engine might break the stiction of cold oil between the discs and plates in the clutch pack, allowing it to turn with less drag, making things easier for the starter to turn the cold engine over. Nothing to do with waking up or altering the power output of the battery.

Edited by Trailryder42
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10 minutes ago, Trailryder42 said:

I didn't say it wasn't true. I just wanted you to state your understanding of how and why that would work, to "wake up" the battery. "Wake up" the battery?

"No clue, I am not a battery expert". OK, I accept that. You don't have an understanding of it. Simple as that.

Taking a few minutes to think about it myself, I surmise that by rocking the bike back and forth in gear with a cold engine might break the stiction of cold oil between the discs and plates in the clutch pack, allowing it to turn with less drag, making things easier for the starter to turn the cold engine over. Nothing to do with waking up or altering the power output of the battery.

Nope. 

It has something to do with waking up or warming up the battery by rocking the bike in gear. Nothing to do with stiction of cold oil or some such. 

I am sure someone who is in the know on this will be by any time now to set the record straight on whats what.

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15 minutes ago, Trailryder42 said:
That sure is a pretty swingarm. Looks like my 2013 models, having been protected with these.
https://slavensracing.com/shop/swingarm-protectors-ktm-husaberg-husqvarna/
 
image.png.cf9d5b0cb65db614153c10185e4ea752.png


Thanks. I know. I need something for sure. I was hoping to get the stick on type with advertising on it. I’ve seen them while watching UTube but haven’t had any luck finding them.

Edited by SmokeX
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14 minutes ago, shrub73 said:

Nope. 

It has something to do with waking up or warming up the battery by rocking the bike in gear. Nothing to do with stiction of cold oil or some such. 

I am sure someone who is in the know on this will be by any time now to set the record straight on whats what.

For better coverage, I'll make a new post on it and reference this one.

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On 1/22/2019 at 12:48 PM, shrub73 said:

Nope. 

It has something to do with waking up or warming up the battery by rocking the bike in gear. Nothing to do with stiction of cold oil or some such. 

I am sure someone who is in the know on this will be by any time now to set the record straight on whats what.

LOL! You seem to have no knowledge of the electrical function of a motorcycle ignition and charging system yet you will staunchly defend your position and claim trailryder42 is wrong.  I'll be waiting for someone "in the know" to come by explain your theory of how rocking the bike wakes up or warms up the battery.

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LOL! You seem to have no knowledge of the electrical function of a motorcycle ignition and charging system yet you will staunchly defend your position and claim trailryder42 is wrong.  I'll be waiting for someone "in the know" to come by explain your theory of how rocking the bike wakes up or warms up the battery.

A lithium battery doesn’t “wake up” by moving the bike around. I can literally walk out to my shop and hit the button on my bike that’s in neutral on a stand and it will start, the same as it will if I was riding it for a few hrs. There is no circuit or input from the bike to the battery for it to “sense” anything. I have a lot of experience with lithium batteries in rc cars and you don’t have to shake them or do anything weird to them other then plug them in and they work. The battery in these bikes are the same, it’s a just a 4S lithium battery in a box, in fact the balance plug port on my old shorai battery was exactly the same as the ones I use on my RC’s, therefore I could charge it with my rc car battery charger. There is no black magic going on, it’s just a different form of electrical storage that is far lighter and more efficient then the old lead acid batteries.

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The ‘wake the battery up’ reference refers to EFI bikes, not carb. If you move the kick starter a little (or rock the bike in gear) it causes the fuel pump to prime.

It is said that the load from the fuel pump plus the ECU activating stimulates the cells in a lithium battery. Apparently they don’t give out 100% until they have had a load already put on them?

I too use this technique. Not because I know if it’s true or accurate, but because it takes all of 5 seconds and IF it’s true that it does help the battery, I’m all for it.

A carb bike however would do literally nothing as others have said above!

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8 hours ago, jamesw9404 said:

The ‘wake the battery up’ reference refers to EFI bikes, not carb. If you move the kick starter a little (or rock the bike in gear) it causes the fuel pump to prime.

It is said that the load from the fuel pump plus the ECU activating stimulates the cells in a lithium battery. Apparently they don’t give out 100% until they have had a load already put on them?

I too use this technique. Not because I know if it’s true or accurate, but because it takes all of 5 seconds and IF it’s true that it does help the battery, I’m all for it.

A carb bike however would do literally nothing as others have said above!

Thanks for that explanation James.

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LOL! You seem to have no knowledge of the electrical function of a motorcycle ignition and charging system yet you will staunchly defend your position and claim trailryder42 is wrong.  I'll be waiting for someone "in the know" to come by explain your theory of how rocking the bike wakes up or warms up the battery.

I don’t think shrub 73 was defending a position but rather giving some information he thought was pertinent. He also indicated that someone who knows more than he would come on this thread to clarify what he thought was the issue. He didn’t claim he was an expert. At least that isn’t the way I read it. :-).

Thanks for the clarification on the matter. Much appreciated!!


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I find others, including my self, fall into a post hoc fallacy regarding a  cause and effect relationship when diagnosing problems either in life or wrenching on bikes.

I swear it works every time but I may also fall into this post hoc category I believe. 

If I blip the throttle quickly three times before I start the bike it works first try. If I don’t. It may take one or two more times to start it.

Weird I know but it seems to work so I keep doing that lol. Is that dumb!!!

I’m waiting to be crucified;-)

Edited by SmokeX
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1 hour ago, SmokeX said:

Weird I know but it seems to work so I keep doing that lol. Is that dumb!!!

I’m waiting to be crucified;-)

LOL........After reading info here on how these TPI bikes work, I wouldn't be surprised if wicking the throttle is sensed by a throttle position sensor and wakes up the system, the pump and primes the fuel system.

In a regular non-pumper carb, wicking throttle would do nothing but raise and lower the slide.

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14 hours ago, dittohead said:


A lithium battery doesn’t “wake up” by moving the bike around. I can literally walk out to my shop and hit the button on my bike that’s in neutral on a stand and it will start, the same as it will if I was riding it for a few hrs. There is no circuit or input from the bike to the battery for it to “sense” anything. I have a lot of experience with lithium batteries in rc cars and you don’t have to shake them or do anything weird to them other then plug them in and they work. The battery in these bikes are the same, it’s a just a 4S lithium battery in a box, in fact the balance plug port on my old shorai battery was exactly the same as the ones I use on my RC’s, therefore I could charge it with my rc car battery charger. There is no black magic going on, it’s just a different form of electrical storage that is far lighter and more efficient then the old lead acid batteries.

As I stated in a prior thread this waking/warming up was told to me by the KTM dealership and was told to do it on very cold mornings when out camping on a cold start. If it's priming that the rocking back and forth does then I stand corrected. 

 

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18 hours ago, PTECH said:

LOL! You seem to have no knowledge of the electrical function of a motorcycle ignition and charging system yet you will staunchly defend your position and claim trailryder42 is wrong.  I'll be waiting for someone "in the know" to come by explain your theory of how rocking the bike wakes up or warms up the battery.

Trailyder42 was as incorrect on the theory at hand as I was. 

Dittohead's explain makes sense and my understanding was false. He was the guy in the know. 

I just got back from a 3 day riding trip and smell like shit..getting in the shower now. 

 

 

Edited by shrub73

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I just picked up a new 300xc, love the bike. Feels super light and motor is amazing.

 

300xc2.jpg

Edited by samhain44
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On 1/25/2019 at 2:38 PM, shrub73 said:

Trailyder42 was as incorrect on the theory at hand as I was. 

Dittohead's explain makes sense and my understanding was false. He was the guy in the know. 

I just got back from a 3 day riding trip and smell like shit..getting in the shower now. 

 

 

Hey shrub, as you know I ride alot when it is far colder than anything talked about here. 

The lithium battery does often need to be used a little to get it going when it's cold. On the mikuni carbed bikes it's something else, for some reason they just won't start in the cold. Only two ways to get it to fire. One is the rocking in gear, which my buddy does on his 300, the other is tip it over for a few seconds which I do on my 250 (primarily cause it works and I'm usually too cold to find neutral again for the start). 

The EFI 4 strokes are a different beast and usually at around -10 they need both a few stabs at the starter AND a sit beside the running truck with the exhaust onto the bike engine. This whole scenario is progressively dramatic from 250 XCF up to 450XCF.

 

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I just picked up a new 300xc, love the bike. Feels super light and motor is amazing.
 
300xc2.jpg.82d88a73fbad3fc9f8f74d3fd98257f6.jpg

Nice!!! How do you like it so far? I’m loving mine. With all the rain we are having is driving me nuts. O Lord. I look forward to at least 4 days of sun in a row so I can stop drooling all over my bike and go ride. :-)

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