2002 XR200 Carb issues

[Bwilliams6]

So my xr200 if it has been setting over night will fire 2 or 3 kicks With the choke on and I’ll let it warm up and take the choke off still running fine then hop on the bike run it down the road runs fine for a minute starts sputtering then dies and then I can’t get it to fire until I let it sit for a while.  I’ve rebuilt the carb every thing is clean and I’m running 110 main 38 pilot clip on the 3rd mixture screw 1 1/4 turns out. New spark plug and It’s arcing great. The bike had an aftermarket carb on it when I got it and it was running super lean and getting got so I put a kehin factory carb back on because the other was a knock off piece of junk. I’ve tried adjusting the mixture screw, idle everything and nothing works. Could it be the valves being out wack? This is nothing I’ve ever experienced on. Dirtbike and I no one had anything posted on her like this. Need some expert advice and where to start. 

[wazzabie]

When you rebuilt the carb did you use steel wire to clean the jets?  If you did the jets may have changed size.

[Bwilliams6]

10 hours ago, wazzabie said:

When you rebuilt the carb did you use steel wire to clean the jets?  If you did the jets may have changed size.

No I just soaked them in carb cleaner and blew them out with an air hose 

[Doogee57]

4 minutes ago, Bwilliams6 said:

No I just soaked them in carb cleaner and blew them out with an air hose 

  If it's the pilot jet that's plugged carb cleaner and soaking will never get it clean. Yank the pilot and look thru it. It should look nice and round thru there but the hole's only .016" or so. I've cleaned pilot's by pulling ONE wire out of a wire brush, threading it thru the jet, and gently spinning it with my fingers. You gotta have "the touch". DO NOT force it or ream out the jet AT ALL. If you do the jet's toast and you'll have to buy a new one. (less than 10 bucks)

[Chuck.]

Soaking in carb cleaner will damage non metallic parts so hopefully you removed those parts before soaking. Some other Keihin carbs have multi part bodies with gaskets and soaking damages them. The bad news is Honda doesn't sell the gaskets and new FCR carbs are very expensive.  The good news is the PD series have one piece bodies. 

I'm puzzled by the change in running after turn off the choke, makes me think lean which could be caused by an air leak so check the carb/manifold and manifold/head O rings. 

As Doogee point out the carb does have passages and small openings that should be checked and that means removing all of the jets, and jet holder. I use bright light from a window or a LED flashlight to sight all openings and passages, and check blind passages with aerosol carb cleaner (then blow dry with compressed air). There are two very small discharge ports in the floor of the carb that need to carefully checked; one is above the pilot jet and the other is above the mixture screw.

One common problem is the pesky little O ring for the mixture screw because it often sticks inside the carb body, or randomly falls out  and then hides somewhere.  Assembly on the mixture screw is the spring, washer, and last the O ring.

Final thought is if the bike sits for any period of greater then one week I would switch to pure gas. And for any storage periods greater than a few months drain the tank and carb.

[Doogee57]

10 minutes ago, Chuck. said:

inal thought is if the bike sits for any period of greater then one week I would switch to pure gas.

  Yup. And add some "stabil". On bikes that have sat for several months it's almost always the pilot jet that gets plugged. It's almost at the bottom of the float bowl and it's got that tiny hole. It's the first jet that plugs on bikes that have sat for a long period. The symptoms of a plugged pilot are: Runs "OK" on the choke and with the throttle opened a bunch but dies at low speed/throttle opening because you're getting no fuel thru the low speed/pilot circuit.

  Seen it (and fixed it for guys) a bunch of times over the years, especially on bikes that have sat thru the winter.

[RK-REX]

Refer to this thread for some possible help. 

 

[wazzabie]

If you are going to use wire on the jets use copper wire from an electrical wire and not steel.  And don't go crazy with it.

[Old School Al]

13 hours ago, Bwilliams6 said:

So my xr200 if it has been setting over night will fire 2 or 3 kicks With the choke on and I’ll let it warm up and take the choke off still running fine then hop on the bike run it down the road runs fine for a minute starts sputtering then dies and then I can’t get it to fire until I let it sit for a while.  I’ve rebuilt the carb every thing is clean and I’m running 110 main 38 pilot clip on the 3rd mixture screw 1 1/4 turns out. New spark plug and It’s arcing great. The bike had an aftermarket carb on it when I got it and it was running super lean and getting got so I put a kehin factory carb back on because the other was a knock off piece of junk. I’ve tried adjusting the mixture screw, idle everything and nothing works. Could it be the valves being out wack? This is nothing I’ve ever experienced on. Dirtbike and I no one had anything posted on her like this. Need some expert advice and where to start. 

 

It may not hurt to check fuel delivery to the carb here ............?   With the petcock on, open the carb drain into a container and see if the flow stays constant when draining for a minute or so.   Also when it "dies" and you "let it sit for awhile", where do you leave the petcock............off or on?  Float level is set correctly......?  Just some thoughts................

Old School Al

Edited January 18, 2019 by Old School Al

[Old School Al]

48 minutes ago, wazzabie said:

If you are going to use wire on the jets use copper wire from an electrical wire and not steel.  And don't go crazy with it.

 

I can't use torch tip cleaners or drill bits.........   Just kidding................!?

Old School Al

[Doogee57]

2 hours ago, Old School Al said:

I can't use torch tip cleaners or drill bits.........

  Shuure, go ahead. Just have a spare new jet ready.?

[wazzabie]

I think you should ditch the aftermarket carb.  Get the OEM carb and put a Moose rebuild kit and using stock settings.

[Old School Al]

59 minutes ago, wazzabie said:

I think you should ditch the aftermarket carb.  Get the OEM carb and put a Moose rebuild kit and using stock settings.

 

Quote from original post: 

"The bike had an aftermarket carb on it when I got it and it was running super lean and getting got so I put a kehin factory carb back on because the other was a knock off piece of junk. "

Old School Al

[Old School Al]

5 hours ago, Old School Al said:

 

It may not hurt to check fuel delivery to the carb here ............?   With the petcock on, open the carb drain into a container and see if the flow stays constant when draining for a minute or so.   Also when it "dies" and you "let it sit for awhile", where do you leave the petcock............off or on?  Float level is set correctly......?  Just some thoughts................

Old School Al

 

Something else you might try is when it starts "sputtering", reach down and pull some choke on and see how it responds.

Old School Al

[Bwilliams6]

Okay guys I appreciate al the feed back. Chuck I believe you was right. I just had a buddy over that has a lot more experience with carbs and we got the mixture right on the mixture screw and the bike was starting every time with 1 or 2 kicks. I rechecked the carb and all the jets are clear. I does have a 40 pilot not a 38. Also I did not use carb cleaner on plastic non metallic parts. After adjusting the carb in the ball park of being right it would idle fine but after throttle would hang and continue to idle high until I adjusted the idle screw down and repeat doing the same thing. We sprayed wd 40 over the carb the air box and finally we got a change for the boot that mounts to the motor connecting the carb and not a big change but after throttling it was way worse making me think it was sucking more wd 40 in and making it worse. Only problem I have is someone has tried to remove that boot and stripped out one of the screws and we have tried everything and can’t get it off. Even an easy out wouldn’t penetrate it. So he suggested possibly putting RTV around the boot for a temporary fix until I can find a way to get it off. Would that work?  Would it hurt anything or would the heat from the engine keep the rtv from sealing? Al you was also right it didn’t flow great with the fuel on but was flowing freely on reserve. 

[Bwilliams6]

Also I have a 38 jet I could put in but maybe the 40 will help idle some? 

[KTM520EXC]

BWilliams6,

I am going throw another potential issue no one has addressed,  but chasing a carburetor (fuel delivery) issue is more than likely the culprit. 

Bad stators have a propensity to run fine right up to the point they  get hot and then run like crap, sputter, die out, etc...

If you can restart the bike w/o issue with the choke on after warm up, then definitely the carburetor, if not, good chance the stator. 

Michael

 

[Bwilliams6]

1 hour ago, KTM520EXC said:

BWilliams6,

I am going throw another potential issue no one has addressed,  but chasing a carburetor (fuel delivery) issue is more than likely the culprit. 

Bad stators have a propensity to run fine right up to the point they  get hot and then run like crap, sputter, die out, etc...

If you can restart the bike w/o issue with the choke on after warm up, then definitely the carburetor, if not, good chance the stator. 

Michael

 

I do have a parts bike and a stator I could swap out. Thanks for the advice!

[Bwilliams6]

Not gonna lie al I usually leave the Petcock on. I think a good cleaning is in for the petcock becsuse bad flow when In the on position. Reserve flows freely but on its clogged and just some fuel comes out 

[Bwilliams6]

Also I don’t know how to set float level. I’ve seen where you all said 12.5mm setting but I don’t know how to set it or measure it.