Engine Braking WITH Oil Injection

[Snaithoss1710]

Is engine braking bad for your engine with the OIL INJECTION STILL ACTIVE, or is it fine?

Looking to hear some opinions.

Cheers!

[bh867]

I've never thought twice about it not had any issues in about 50 hours so should be fine?

[FORMA MOTO]

4 hours ago, Snaithoss1710 said:

Is engine braking bad for your engine with the OIL INJECTION STILL ACTIVE, or is it fine?

Looking to hear some opinions.

Cheers!

I think you are thinking the pump stops working if the throttle is closed, which is not the case.

It makes no difference.....

If that were the case, idling would be really bad for the motor.......

 

Edited July 7, 2019 by KRAYNIAL

[wwguy]

 

 

 

15 minutes ago, KRAYNIAL said:

I think you are thinking the pump stops working if the throttle is closed, which is not the case.

It makes no difference.....

If that were the case, idling would be really bad for the motor.......

My take was that the OP was referring to the engine operating at higher RPM while only receiving the 100:1 oil ratio delivered with the throttle closed.

I've never heard of any OI issues attributed to that,  but there are enough other potential problems with OI that I've removed mine and have been happily running premix for several years now.

[dirtbird]

First of all, engine braking is not a correct term when associated with power produced since there is not any, instead the inertia of the bike turns the rear wheel and in turn the gearbox and the cranck shaft. 

Hence the engine is not under load therefore the OI ecu will feed the oil needed for this occasion which certainly be less than when accelerating. 

Actually this was the best part of OI that I noticed after the first rides on my '17 RR. Even after a long downhill single path where most of the time the throttle was closed, the engine would not load up and respond instantly when I hit an open space. 

 

But there were some bad parts as well... 

 

[motumatai]

someone may correct me, but I believe the OI system receives input from both throttle position AND engine revs, so with throttle closed  on a downhill run but engine revs at say 7 grand, it may well deliver more than 100:1

[wwguy]

3 minutes ago, motumatai said:

someone may correct me, but I believe the OI system receives input from both throttle position AND engine revs, so with throttle closed  on a downhill run but engine revs at say 7 grand, it may well deliver more than 100:1

Very interesting... I've been following the Beta OI topic closely since it was introduced and have never seen this discussed before, including in the OI troubleshooting bulletins published by Beta.  But theoretically this is possible since the ECU contains both the OI controller and the CDI, which monitors engine revolutions via the stator's Hall Effect sensor.

I wish Beta wasn't so tight-lipped about OI system design, mapping, and other principles of operation.  However I do know that they're using Dellorto's ECS CDI controller and PLE oil pump.  I've read through these instructions for Dellorto's 2013 version of ECU diagnostic software, which do show RPM as well as TPS values.

Ironically Dellorto is the same company manufacturing components for KTM's TPI solution too.

[Snaithoss1710]

14 hours ago, wwguy said:

My take was that the OP was referring to the engine operating at higher RPM while only receiving the 100:1 oil ratio delivered with the throttle closed.

I've never heard of any OI issues attributed to that,  but there are enough other potential problems with OI that I've removed mine and have been happily running premix for several years now.

That's exactly what I was thinking. Is going from regular riding / throttle, to coasting down a long hill at mid RPM with the throttle closed (TPS is at its lowest setting), bad for the engine?

I know to engine brake a regular 2 stroke is no good, wondering if that principle applied to the injected 2 strokes.

[Snaithoss1710]

10 hours ago, motumatai said:

someone may correct me, but I believe the OI system receives input from both throttle position AND engine revs, so with throttle closed  on a downhill run but engine revs at say 7 grand, it may well deliver more than 100:1

Can someone confirm this - I thought it was purely off the TPS, although I HOPE it takes RPM into account (but I don't think it does). I hope someone corrects me here!

[willie]

I'm sure when Beta or whoever did the engine testing for the OI took into account every possible operating scenario while programing the parameters for it including long coasting. While coasting there is very little engine load and very little air turbulence to scavenge the oil out of the engine so very little oil is needed to be pumped in.

 

Edited July 8, 2019 by willie