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Battery, again.

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Kind of my thought too. I had the kick starter installed too but if the charging system is compromised then the kick start is useless. No wonder bikes aren't coming stock with them. At least that's from my understanding from the dealer when I took it in for running like garbage. They said I need to keep the bike on a tender always if not the battery will not have enough charge to run the bike properly. If battery voltage drops it causes the bike to run like garbage, so then I have to have the dealer hard reset the ECU again. On top of that my speedometer intermittently stopped working then completely stopped. The orings on the oil fill plugs were letting oil seep out. The gas cap gasket failed and no I didn't over tighten it. Been at the dealer for 17 days business days so far (36 days total). 
Edit: I have a 2019 500 RRS. 


My bike came with the kicker but I’ve been flirting with taking it off for the past year or so. Its pretty much worthless weight in my opinion.
I keep the bike on a charger usually a couple days out of the week. Last week i went to check it and the battery showed about half a charge so i put the kicker on. After hearing about some of you guys being glad you had your kicker, i figured id give it another go. With the battery full its a one kick wonder but if the key doesnt work the kicker wont either! The one good thing about the kicker is that if your out on a really tuff trail and theres alot of stopping and starting; its good turn off the lights and use the kicker to save the battery for the fan. But other than that scenario its junke’

My bike also spent its first couple of months at the dealer: for the fan and fuel guages not working properly. When i got it back there was alot of wear on my brand new 333 rear tire, so i guess the test rides must have been fun.

No bikes been perfect from the getgo, but i think my betas been the second most trouble of any bike I’ve ever bought. I had a ducati that was a lemon, i traded it back for a cbr1000 and life was wayy better. I might have liked the ducati but it left me walking and having to call a tow truck far too many times in one year and the service engine light never turned off so i got a honda and life was much better. Same with my bmw 6-series, i had to call the tow truck too many times so i got a chevy.
My betas starting to make me feel the same as those other nice rides I’ve had...



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Any of the bikes with the diode pack should be capable of running without a battery at all, they don't get any current back from the battery anyways. I suspect the bikes without diode packs really are no different either, they should be able to run without a battery.
Assuming the battery is dead, you are probably better off disconnecting the battery before you try to kick it over. At that point, all the battery would be doing is drawing down the voltage.
Someone try to kick their bike without a battery hooked up and let me know please! I would also be interested if there is a difference between RE's and RR-S's is this regard. I've kick started my buddies 350RE when its battery was too weak to turn the engine over. Wasn't too hard to start, IMO.
I have been wondering if there is a market for repaired/soldered/modded wiring harnesses for these bikes. I mean, guys shell out boat loads on suspension upgrades.
Anyone willing to pay to have their harness soldered/modded?
It's not hard to do honestly, and I posted a video of myself doing mine. That said, if you just don't want to do it and would rather ship it off I would be happy to do it, assuming it's worth my time $$ wise. My only concern is without the bike there would be no way to test anything or see if perhaps you have a different problem.
This issue is way easier to sort out than engine tuning or mechanical problems. I mean, if you do it the way Krynal did his it should take all of an hour. Probably less time than it would take you to pull the harness and send it to me.
If battery charging is your only issue just solder the red and black bundles(super easy to get to), tape it back up good, check grounds are clean, move on with life.
This issue is annoying because it's stupid, not terribly complicated or earth shattering. Honestly the simplicity of the issue is why it bums me out to see people struggling with it and missing ride time over it. If you could just drop your bike off at my house I'd have it fixed up by morning. Ya know?


Yeah ive fixed the issue before.

Ive made diode packs to take the place of the battery.

Ive kicked with no battery.

Ive disconnected the battery with the engine running

Ive tried bump starting with my diode packs and without the battery

Ive also kicked the bike about a thousand times with all those different tests ive tried.

Ive also done about every fix and mod to my bikes harness and starting / charging system plus ive also added manual fan switch and a blackout switch. And i replaced the old corroded diode packs. I think its probably those again but i’ve got a full plate and some unruly clients im trying my best to not drop-kick so i’ll work on this charging issue when I can find the time.

My bike was as dialed as it gets and now here we go again.

Probably bens right about the new diode packless 2019 harness. Then ill probably have to fix the neck wires AGAIN!!!

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20 minutes ago, surfer-dude said:

 


Yeah ive fixed the issue before.

Ive made diode packs to take the place of the battery.

Ive kicked with no battery.

Ive disconnected the battery with the engine running

Ive tried bump starting with my diode packs and without the battery

Ive also kicked the bike about a thousand times with all those different tests ive tried.

Ive also done about every fix and mod to my bikes harness and starting / charging system plus ive also added manual fan switch and a blackout switch. And i replaced the old corroded diode packs. I think its probably those again but i’ve got a full plate and some unruly clients im trying my best to not drop-kick so i’ll work on this charging issue when I can find the time.

My bike was as dialed as it gets and now here we go again.

Probably bens right about the new diode packless 2019 harness. Then ill probably have to fix the neck wires AGAIN!!!

 

f-n a.

Yea if i have that experience mine will be gone with the wind.

I want a dirt bike that's like my CBR. Turn the key and go.

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It's just frustrating to have these issues when my old bike was '16 WR250F and never had it on a tender. I never had electrical or any issues. Never had to do a soft reset. I was hoping for a similar experience with a Beta. My main issue currently is my bike doesn't run well. Even after a hard reset and soft reset. The RPMs will hang or go up and down. Last time I rode it I was coming to a corner and rolled off the throttle only to have my rpms stay at about half throttle. Luckily my brakes still work and this was just a gravel rode. The mountains where we ride would not be as forgiving. I don't understand why we have to keep our bikes on a tender even just overnight to have a properly running bike. I can't go on a multiday trip with how my bike currently is. 

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1 hour ago, DentonC said:

It's just frustrating to have these issues when my old bike was '16 WR250F and never had it on a tender. I never had electrical or any issues. Never had to do a soft reset. I was hoping for a similar experience with a Beta. My main issue currently is my bike doesn't run well. Even after a hard reset and soft reset. The RPMs will hang or go up and down. Last time I rode it I was coming to a corner and rolled off the throttle only to have my rpms stay at about half throttle. Luckily my brakes still work and this was just a gravel rode. The mountains where we ride would not be as forgiving. I don't understand why we have to keep our bikes on a tender even just overnight to have a properly running bike. I can't go on a multiday trip with how my bike currently is. 

What's your reset process? 

 

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13 minutes ago, firffighter said:

What's your reset process? 

 

Cold start, let the bike warm up then shut off. 

Dealer reflashed the ECU in November. Brought it home and RPMs still wonky. That was after they charged my battery up thus "fixing" all my problems. 

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52 minutes ago, DentonC said:

Cold start, let the bike warm up then shut off. 

Dealer reflashed the ECU in November. Brought it home and RPMs still wonky. That was after they charged my battery up thus "fixing" all my problems. 

 

Do you let the bike warm up for an entire 10 min or until the fan kicks on around 210 degrees without touching the throttle? 

Sounds like you might want to have the dealer take a look and determine if you have a stepper motor issue. 

Good luck

 

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12 hours ago, surfer-dude said:

 


Yeah ive fixed the issue before.

Ive made diode packs to take the place of the battery.

Ive kicked with no battery.

Ive disconnected the battery with the engine running

Ive tried bump starting with my diode packs and without the battery

Ive also kicked the bike about a thousand times with all those different tests ive tried.

Ive also done about every fix and mod to my bikes harness and starting / charging system plus ive also added manual fan switch and a blackout switch. And i replaced the old corroded diode packs. I think its probably those again but i’ve got a full plate and some unruly clients im trying my best to not drop-kick so i’ll work on this charging issue when I can find the time.

My bike was as dialed as it gets and now here we go again.

Probably bens right about the new diode packless 2019 harness. Then ill probably have to fix the neck wires AGAIN!!!

 

I totally get you SD.  

We are some of the very few that are actually DS'ing the RR-S'.  

We happen to have the same 2017 500 RR-S.  

 

That you never see real cold, it is nuts that you have gone through 5 batteries.  

 

I gave much thought to just simply trading for a CRF450L and not looking back as I sure won't tolerate constant nagging issues that is a system that can't even do what has been done, or every other motorcycle with a charging system since May 17, 1983.  

 

I also thought of an Alta Redshift EX (got so lucky I did not buy last October) or a Zero DS.  

 

It blows big-chow that the bike is just not reliable.  

 

 

I will say, though, that with the 2019+ front and rear harness, and with a new AGM, I've been doing well these past few weeks this winter.  

 

I can't blame you one bit for considering getting out of a bike that is just not reliable.  If this bike gave me any of the grief you have had so far I'd have gotten out some time ago as I can't deal with constant stuff or, the same thing 5-times.  

 

Really though, replace the harness with the upgraded one and I'll bet your charging issues will go away as I see 13.8-14.2V with nothing on, you are at where I was before the swap and only seeing a BEST of 13.4-13.6V, that is not enough once the fan kicks, and the fan always kicks when it is warm out and it is ALWAYS warm where you are at.  

Edited by Ben500RR-S
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12 hours ago, surfer-dude said:

 


Yeah ive fixed the issue before.

Ive made diode packs to take the place of the battery.

Ive kicked with no battery.

Ive disconnected the battery with the engine running

Ive tried bump starting with my diode packs and without the battery

Ive also kicked the bike about a thousand times with all those different tests ive tried.

Ive also done about every fix and mod to my bikes harness and starting / charging system plus ive also added manual fan switch and a blackout switch. And i replaced the old corroded diode packs. I think its probably those again but i’ve got a full plate and some unruly clients im trying my best to not drop-kick so i’ll work on this charging issue when I can find the time.

My bike was as dialed as it gets and now here we go again.

Probably bens right about the new diode packless 2019 harness. Then ill probably have to fix the neck wires AGAIN!!!

 

I think that very simply, you need to just install the front and rear updated 2019+ harness' and your chronic undercharging issue will be fixed.  

Now that I have a new AGM, even in the extreme cold, the battery is (now)-keeping up. 

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3 minutes ago, Ben500RR-S said:

I think that very simply, you need to just install the front and rear updated 2019+ harness' and your chronic undercharging issue will be fixed.  

Now that I have a new AGM, even in the extreme cold, the battery is (now)-keeping up. 

 

How do you know that without putting a multimeter on the battery after it has sat for a few hours to determine it's state of charge?

Doc

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35 minutes ago, Doc_d said:

 

How do you know that without putting a multimeter on the battery after it has sat for a few hours to determine it's state of charge?

Doc

It has been below freezing all day up here for days now. 

I have a 4.5 mile ride into work and a 6.5 mile ride home, Baja Designs Squadron Pro leading the way with 12V Hotwired gloves to keep my hands nice and warm.  

The bike will sit outside for 9.5 hours, from about 7:30am to 5pm, every day and when I get out, the bike fires to life, no problem.  

Same thing with the bike sitting in the garage overnight from about 5:30pm to 7am, but in a 50 degree garage, and the motor still fires up, no problem after an overnight rest.  

 

Ever since I had replaced the harness' this past spring./summer, I had been monitoring the SOC and I just trust that when I'm getting off the bike, the new AGM is resting and staying at from 12.8 to 12.9V as the starter is turning the motor over in the cold as good as it does when it is a nice, 75F day.  

 

I might ride the bike home tonight, let it sit till the am, and check the SOC in the morning, just for giggles and shyts.  I will bet money that the battery is resting at from 12.8 to 12.9V as just a guess as I've been happily dealing with all these charging issues for so long now, I will have had the bike 3 years this upconing 02/22/2017, so if the bike starts, it starts and all is good.  It has become that simple for me nowadays.  

 

At first hint of battery weakness, I'll replace it as $60 a year or year and a half is like nothing.  

 

 

 

Edited by Ben500RR-S

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1 hour ago, Ben500RR-S said:

We are some of the very few that are actually DS'ing the RR-S'.  

There are actually a ton of guys here in the PNW that have Beta RRs and dualsport them year round doing long ADV trips and rides. They just aren't on here. 

Haven't heard any battery or electrical problems from them. 

 

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14 minutes ago, firffighter said:

There are actually a ton of guys here in the PNW that have Beta RRs and dualsport them year round doing long ADV trips and rides. They just aren't on here. 

Haven't heard any battery or electrical problems from them. 

 

We are definitely the squeaky-wheels on here.  

I hate being it but, if it helps others . . . and myself, I keep on typing.  

 

I wish I did not have the issues but at the same time, the bike is so awesome, I'll keep at it.  

 

Every morning, and every night, just like when I was young and was able to disobey the law, and I could ride my friends IT 175, KE100 or CR80 on the roads to get to the trails, to be able to do so legally is worth whatever issues I'll have to deal with, for now.  

Edited by Ben500RR-S
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1 minute ago, Ben500RR-S said:

We are definitely the squeaky-wheels on here.  

I hate being it but, if it helps others . . . and myself, I keep on typing.  

 

I wish I did not have the issues but at the same time, the bike is so awesome, I'll keep at it.  

 

Every morning, and every night, just like when I was young and was able to disobey the law, and I could ride my friends IT 175, KE100 or CR80 on the roads to get to the trails, to be able to do so legally is worth whatever issues I'll have to deal with, for now.  

It definitely is frustrating having continues issues, but it's the reality of owning any bike. You are actually one of the only guys that has the high mileage on the RRS that I know. There's a local Oregon guy I know that rides his year round and uses it as a commuter and there's some CDSR guys with high mileage RRS. 

It's great to have the high mileage experience shared on here. 

We sometimes can come away thinking that what's posted here is representative of the entire owner experience, but it's actually a very small fraction represented here. 

I try to remember that it's not just Beta that guys have issues along the way. 

Go over to the KTM site and you'll find page after page of frustrated new KTM owners with a variety of issues. Just part of owning a dirt bike. 

One thing I tried to remember with my 390 RRS, was that it was simply a high performance off road dirt bike that happened to be street legal. It was not going to be the same as a DRZ, XRL, KLX, etc. 

As an engineer for our marine fire boat program, battery maintenance is a big part of the equation for our boats. I adopted that same mindset for the dirt bike. 

Thanks for sharing. 

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40 minutes ago, firffighter said:

It definitely is frustrating having continues issues, but it's the reality of owning any bike. You are actually one of the only guys that has the high mileage on the RRS that I know. There's a local Oregon guy I know that rides his year round and uses it as a commuter and there's some CDSR guys with high mileage RRS. 

It's great to have the high mileage experience shared on here. 

We sometimes can come away thinking that what's posted here is representative of the entire owner experience, but it's actually a very small fraction represented here. 

I try to remember that it's not just Beta that guys have issues along the way. 

Go over to the KTM site and you'll find page after page of frustrated new KTM owners with a variety of issues. Just part of owning a dirt bike. 

One thing I tried to remember with my 390 RRS, was that it was simply a high performance off road dirt bike that happened to be street legal. It was not going to be the same as a DRZ, XRL, KLX, etc. 

As an engineer for our marine fire boat program, battery maintenance is a big part of the equation for our boats. I adopted that same mindset for the dirt bike. 

Thanks for sharing. 

No doubt, everything made by man, can and will have issues. 

I almost wish I never started this thread as all I needed was a new battery.  At least now I know that when the battery starts to act up, to just save the time, energy and money and get a new battery, that is/was the solution. 

 

At least in my eyes/from where I sit, the upgraded Beta harness from 2019-on, is the solution for MOST of the charging problem.  

Adding a headlight kill switch-in my case, it was automatic as if I flick to High Beam, it shuts the Baja Designs Squadron Pro headlight off and saves right around 1V of charge to the battery.  

 

I am taxing the charging system by having both the headlight on and the 12V heated gloves and riding around in the freezing cold, every day.  

 

As I currently have NO issues with this 2017 500 RR-S, being able to ride back and forth to work this winter, all bundled up like I'm going snowmobiling with the family after work tomorrow.  

2019 sleds.jpg

 

The silver machine is my 2019 Grand Touring Limited 600R.  

The black sled is the wife's 2020 Grand Touring Limited 900 ACE.

 

The blue snowmobile is the kids 192cc Snoscoot-trail legal even.  

 

 

Winter is fun.  

Edited by Ben500RR-S
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Totally un-scientific update, to the many updates, on the new-ish battery. 

 

Bike got to sit outside from 7:30 to 5pm in below freezing temps and had fired right up at 505pm.  

No charge overnight, same thing after another night-ride with headlight and gloves blazing, and the motor started up easily this morning.

 

If I don't have to use my jump pack for the remainder of the winter and into the spring and summer, the harness swap will have been a success and so far the performances are trending in that direction.  

 

 

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Cue up AC/DC's Back in Black as the 500 RR-S is BACK!!!

 

Every day and every night, I go back and forth to work.  Headlight and heated gloves on.  No matter what, the bike both starts and even after a weekend of not being used, the new AGM stays at a 13.0V-not bad at all and pretty excellent actually.  

Between the new upgraded harness and now a new AGM battery, things are once again perfect in Beta RR-S-World. 

 

It was in the single digits on the way into work this morning and will be again for the ride home tonight as it is really cold here in MA right now.   Gonna snow tomorrow night=psyched. 

 

 

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On 1/17/2020 at 2:31 PM, Ben500RR-S said:

Cue up AC/DC's Back in Black as the 500 RR-S is BACK!!!

 

Every day and every night, I go back and forth to work.  Headlight and heated gloves on.  No matter what, the bike both starts and even after a weekend of not being used, the new AGM stays at a 13.0V-not bad at all and pretty excellent actually.  

Between the new upgraded harness and now a new AGM battery, things are once again perfect in Beta RR-S-World. 

 

It was in the single digits on the way into work this morning and will be again for the ride home tonight as it is really cold here in MA right now.   Gonna snow tomorrow night=psyched. 

 

 

great to hear bud.  As you said earlier - the internet is great for many things but one thing thats tough is most people post negative experiences not the positive ones so forsure you are not the majority but rather the minority when it comes to Beta battery/charging issues.

That being said it is great to hear about the triage events going on as it may help others down the road.

 

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13 hours ago, bradje said:

great to hear bud.  As you said earlier - the internet is great for many things but one thing thats tough is most people post negative experiences not the positive ones so forsure you are not the majority but rather the minority when it comes to Beta battery/charging issues.

That being said it is great to hear about the triage events going on as it may help others down the road.

 

I sort of wish I did not even start the thread as all I had was a battery that had been used for 1 year and 4 months.  Through one snowbike season and through a chronic undercharging issue from the original rear wiring harness that got replaced last 06/2019.  

Now with a new battery, even though the temps had never gone above the teens-F on Friday, after 9.5 hours of sitting outside, the battery was re-charged enough to easily start the bike that night.  While it is super cold out, the engine runs really strong in the dense, cold air.  

I have not had to either charge the battery in over 2 weeks now or use the jump pack.  

304 hours and 5,350 miles.  

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