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DBC 300 RACE weigh in

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6 minutes ago, Burger72 said:

The blokes a complete numpty !

I would like to see what it weighed with out fuel compared to the 200 and see if it’s close to the manufacturing state 

200rr = 97kg

300re = 103.5

I would agree.  Just for curiosity sake I would like to know....   But I also don't know if when the manufacture says "dry" does that really mean no fluids at all?  Like no coolant and brake fluid?

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3 hours ago, shortman said:

I would agree.  Just for curiosity sake I would like to know....   But I also don't know if when the manufacture says "dry" does that really mean no fluids at all?  Like no coolant and brake fluid?

I asked Tim Pilg once and he said Beta does all fluids except fuel. Not all mfgs. do the same.

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3 hours ago, SigPig said:

Apples to Oranges(PDS) to Blueberries as per DBC.

2110144112_2020Beta300RRREWeight.jpg.9c4463d6ce2a6f530d0b983ee8dacdfe.jpg

2019+KTM+300+XC-W+TPI+Weight.jpg

2019+Husky+TE300i+Weight.jpg 

Thanks for the post, very helpful.

So the Husky gains 11 lbs over the KTM? Linkage and...?

Since the KTM has no linkage or horn it has a minor weight advantage.

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18 hours ago, Johnny Depp said:

Did I miss it, or did he not compare it directly with something that is it's direct competition?

KTM TPI, Sherco, TM, YZ250X etc. 

I know it's easier to fill it up, but that is a flawed method since bikes come with different size tanks. Going from an empty tank to 2 gal. for each bike makes more sense. Good thing he's not measuring Dakar bikes...

Yeah I’ve never understood the fill the gas tank thing up as bikes have different size tanks.  A 2013 Beta 300 had a smaller thank than 2014 and beyond.  Using that method the 2014 would be significantly heavier.  Also a TM Enduro model can come with a 3.3 gallon tank, so it holds an extra gallon over a 2013 Beta. 
 

As someone who builds race bikes we try to keep the bikes light as possible by getting everything off that isn’t needed and only add those things that truly are needed. Unsprung weight is even more critical so we watch that closely.  While we might add a disc guard it’s not the heaviest out there. Adding a bunch of weight to the bottom of your fork or rear axle can be felt. 
 

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2 hours ago, Cullins said:

Yeah I’ve never understood the fill the gas tank thing up as bikes have different size tanks.  A 2013 Beta 300 had a smaller thank than 2014 and beyond.  Using that method the 2014 would be significantly heavier.  Also a TM Enduro model can come with a 3.3 gallon tank, so it holds an extra gallon over a 2013 Beta. 
 

As someone who builds race bikes we try to keep the bikes light as possible by getting everything off that isn’t needed and only add those things that truly are needed. Unsprung weight is even more critical so we watch that closely.  While we might add a disc guard it’s not the heaviest out there. Adding a bunch of weight to the bottom of your fork or rear axle can be felt. 
 

Makes sense of course to keep the bikes as light as possible.. but do you hit the starting line with 1/4 tank? Half? Or full? He clearly states it is "ready to ride weight", not "dry weight". How about the manf. that has a larger coolant system? They're penalized too, same as a bike with a slightly larger tank...

If it was me, I'd weight them with all fluids, but empty fuel tanks. Gives a fair idea of what they would weigh against one another, but honestly, 244 lbs, or 247 lbs, it's still more than I can bench press off myself laying in the dirt, so really, who cares.. 

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9 minutes ago, GRamg said:

Makes sense of course to keep the bikes as light as possible.. but do you hit the starting line with 1/4 tank? Half? Or full? He clearly states it is "ready to ride weight", not "dry weight". How about the manf. that has a larger coolant system? They're penalized too, same as a bike with a slightly larger tank...

If it was me, I'd weight them with all fluids, but empty fuel tanks. Gives a fair idea of what they would weigh against one another, but honestly, 244 lbs, or 247 lbs, it's still more than I can bench press off myself laying in the dirt, so really, who cares.. 

Depends on the race. Endurocross is 1/4 tank, MX 1/2 tank,  a 45 minute GP is 3/4 full on a 3.3 gallon tank. Longer race that requires a fuel stop will get topped off. 
 

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9 minutes ago, GRamg said:

Makes sense of course to keep the bikes as light as possible.. but do you hit the starting line with 1/4 tank? Half? Or full? He clearly states it is "ready to ride weight", not "dry weight". How about the manf. that has a larger coolant system? They're penalized too, same as a bike with a slightly larger tank...

If it was me, I'd weight them with all fluids, but empty fuel tanks. Gives a fair idea of what they would weigh against one another, but honestly, 244 lbs, or 247 lbs, it's still more than I can bench press off myself laying in the dirt, so really, who cares.. 

Depends on the race. Endurocross is 1/4 tank, MX 1/2 tank,  a 45 minute GP is 3/4 full on a 3.3 gallon tank. Longer race that requires a fuel stop will get topped off. 
 

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Its clear that his method will never make everyone happy. At the end of the day I appreciate that he is consistent in him method and posts all his findings for all to see. If someone is really going to use weight as part of their buying decision they can do the 3rd grade math required to come to an educated decision. 

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23 hours ago, Old Plonker said:

Overlapping concerns: protecting a lighter bike still yields a lighter bike, just not the lightest. 

Edit: Also, the weight is not just about "how it actually feels out on the trail while ridden," as much as it is how it actually feels out on the trail while trying to lift it off of myself. I'm an old man and don't have all the muscle mass of you young whippersnappers. 😝

:applause: Too many young punks here!

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I found it interesting that it only weighed 3lbs more than the 200
Beta dry weights have them about 15lbs different
300RE: 228lbs
200RR: 213.8
 
Guarded up and with equal fuel my 2013 250 is 30 lbs heavier than my 19 200.
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Anyone who moans about the weight of current bikes should ride an XR400 Honda for a year. Then come back to a 2015-2020 bike and thank your lucky stars.

KTM have gone too far in the pursuit of weight reduction. The wiring harnesses are made of cotton and the engine cases are rice paper. All my KTM riding buddies now carry duct tape and plastic metal which probably weigh more than the weight saved in the engine cases.

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1 hour ago, BassMan said:
On 1/14/2020 at 5:44 PM, Wilderness said:
I found it interesting that it only weighed 3lbs more than the 200
Beta dry weights have them about 15lbs different
300RE: 228lbs
200RR: 213.8
 

Guarded up and with equal fuel my 2013 250 is 30 lbs heavier than my 19 200.

That is much more believable. 

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So if we weigh all bikes without fuel, that still penalizes the OEM that provides a larger tank because more plastic means more weight. Therefore :prof: , the only way to weigh them comparatively is to remove the fuel tank and shrouds at each weigh in!

:smirk:

Get real please. Every 250/300 smoker gonna weigh ~250 ready to ride. Don't like that? Go back to road cycling then. :bonk:

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On 1/15/2020 at 5:26 AM, shortman said:

I would agree.  Just for curiosity sake I would like to know....   But I also don't know if when the manufacture says "dry" does that really mean no fluids at all?  Like no coolant and brake fluid?

I've always been under the impression they weigh bikes with all required fluids except fuel. 

Then you add 6 pounds for every gallon and voila!

Plus sharkfin, handlebars, bashplate, handguards, pipe guard, linkage guard…………….kinda pointless to get too hung up on weight. However, if you start with a 223-pound KTM and a 244-pound Suzuki or Yamaha, you'll still be 15 or 20 pounds lighter after you've dropped 3k on parts....so it does matter....sort of.  

 

I just lifted my (for sale) 2003 KTM 525 SX onto a stand. Mother of god, what does that thing weigh?? Feels like a 1977 XT 500 😲

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7 hours ago, shrubitup said:

So if we weigh all bikes without fuel, that still penalizes the OEM that provides a larger tank because more plastic means more weight. Therefore :prof: , the only way to weigh them comparatively is to remove the fuel tank and shrouds at each weigh in!

:smirk:

Get real please. Every 250/300 smoker gonna weigh ~250 ready to ride. Don't like that? Go back to road cycling then. :bonk:

Obviously that’s torque in cheek about the tank, but seriously the weight of the tank never varies. Just like coolant capacity or oil capacity. That weight is always the same when you ride. 
 

May 2019 issue of Dirt Bike had 300cc off-road bikes.  They weighed them wet weight with no fuel. 
Of the full Enduro bikes with lights, speedo etc. this is what they came up with. 
 

TM 300 EN-225

Beta XTrainer-226

Beta 300 RR-229

KTM 300XC-W-233

Gas Gas 300-234

Husky TE 300i-237

Obviously FI on the Austrian bikes add weight.

One thing that I appreciate about the guy weighing the bikes before the test is it shows how weight on a scale doesn’t always translate into handling, while other light bikes you can feel. 

 

Edited by Cullins
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I understand Dirty Big Chickens theory in weighing them full as he likes to know what they are at the start of the day but like most others I see it as pointless as by the time you loosen up and have done a couple mile to warm up that changes anyway, dry weight has always been with most manufacturers, all fluids but no fuel. 
 

I would like to see someone chuck the 200rr and 300rr 2020 on the scale with out fuel to see the true difference, with fuel Dirty Big Chicken has them just a couple of pounds apart which is confusing....

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I understand Dirty Big Chickens theory in weighing them full as he likes to know what they are at the start of the day but like most others I see it as pointless as by the time you loosen up and have done a couple mile to warm up that changes anyway, dry weight has always been with most manufacturers, all fluids but no fuel. 
 

I would like to see someone chuck the 200rr and 300rr 2020 on the scale with out fuel to see the true difference, with fuel Dirty Big Chicken has them just a couple of pounds apart which is confusing....

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