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pennsylvania “Instruction & supervision” PA Motorcycle Learner’s permiit

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I’ve been riding with my son for about 5 years now at AOAA and FRO.  He started off on a CRf70 and he is currently riding a TTR125.  He has outgrown the TTR, but as he turns 16 next year he is talking about saving up for a dual sport bike that so he can keep riding at FRO but also something he could use on nice days to get back and forth from school/work. 

I understand he can get his learners permit at age 16, but must ride “only while under the instruction and supervision of a licensed motorcycle operator”.  After six months and 65 hours of supervised instruction, and completing a safety course, he can test for his full license.

My question is, what is “supervised instruction”?  Does the licensed motorcycle operator have to be physically present, riding alongside or beside him?

 

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I have no answer for you. I bet that is just the car licensing text applied to motorcycles.

Sounds like he needs to ride FRO with you and a bunch of us, say 10 days at 6 hours a day.... can be done by mid-July

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1 hour ago, pat22043 said:

I have no answer for you. I bet that is just the car licensing text applied to motorcycles.

Sounds like he needs to ride FRO with you and a bunch of us, say 10 days at 6 hours a day.... can be done by mid-July

That would be fun!  But it would have to be next year after he turns 16.  

Plus he has to save some $$$.  He just started his first part time job working at Dunkin Donuts.  He got his first paycheck, $155, and is already shopping KTM’s 😂

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3 minutes ago, RDTH said:

That would be fun!  But it would have to be next year after he turns 16.  

Plus he has to save some $$$.  He just started his first part time job working at Dunkin Donuts.  He got his first paycheck, $155, and is already shopping KTM’s 😂

The rules say "over 12" which means he can get a permit and ride. See
https://readingoutdoors.com/policy-use-lands-and-park  #8
Also #18 says that if the permit holder is under 18, a suitable adult has to sign and accept liability.

KTMs are great, I've bought two and will get another as soon as KTM ships them to the US. I can't even think of how many paychecks it will take to get a KTM

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18 minutes ago, pat22043 said:

The rules say "over 12" which means he can get a permit and ride. See
https://readingoutdoors.com/policy-use-lands-and-park  #8
Also #18 says that if the permit holder is under 18, a suitable adult has to sign and accept liability.

KTMs are great, I've bought two and will get another as soon as KTM ships them to the US. I can't even think of how many paychecks it will take to get a KTM

Yes he’s been a RAC/FRO permit holder since age 12 and is a “charter member”.

But here I meant the actual motorcycle road license, he needs to first turn age 16, write the knowledge test and get his learners permit, and then start logging those instructional hours for his permanent license.  AND save his pennies for the bike he wants 😊

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2 minutes ago, RDTH said:

But here I meant the actual motorcycle road license, he needs to first turn age 16, write the knowledge test and get his learners permit, and then start logging those instructional hours for his permanent license. 

I haven't looked at the regs, once he has his motorcycle learners permit, do the hours have to be on the road? Or will FRO count?

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Are you sure he doesn't just have to complete the beginner's motorcycle safety course. Im from Pa and I thought under 18 you had to complete one of the courses over 18 you can complete a course or get your permit and go take the test at the dmv. If you gotto the dmv's website they have a list of courses when and where they are. 

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1 minute ago, Zak Johnson said:

Are you sure he doesn't just have to complete the beginner's motorcycle safety course

I thought that was enough as well, but I don't have a teenager anymore, she is 35. She took the Virginia equivalent to the MSF course. I think the supervised hours is a fairly new requirement in PA

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9 minutes ago, pat22043 said:

I thought that was enough as well, but I don't have a teenager anymore, she is 35. She took the Virginia equivalent to the MSF course. I think the supervised hours is a fairly new requirement in PA

Yeah I don't know. Ive been riding since i was young and been riding road legal bikes since i was 16 and never got my class m license. A couple years ago i was taking my cruiser on a trip and thought boy i really should get it went and got my permit and then never got my license. Last year i thought this is the year im gonna follow through and get it. Still don't have it. Lol. I guess since I've never had a problem while i was riding i just never went. I don't know. I even looked into the safety courses this year and then covid hit and i didn't follow through. But honestly last year was the first year I even got one of my bikes inspected.  Knock on wood I've never gotten a ticket but no cop had ever given me a hard time. Im almost 40 do all my own work on my bike, wish I could put the inspection on myself but I can't and always have it registered with insurance. Lol that all being said I guess I would have no idea what you do to get it. I thought I remembered seeing something about it but that may have changed. 

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Honestly, I don’t know.  The regs don’t have much detail.  And this is my first teenager so I’m learning as I go!

There are definitely special rules for youth under 18 vs anyone over 18.  As far as I can tell:

- at age 16, he can apply for and receive his motorcycle learners permit

- after six months and 65 hours of supervised riding, and the completion of a motorcycle safety course, he can take his road test and be granted a Junior License

- after one year of acceptable experience with the Junior license holder, he can at age 17.5 be given a regular motorcycle drivers license

https://www.dot.state.pa.us/Public/DVSPubsForms/BDL/BDL Publications/Pub 178.pdf

 

 

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12 minutes ago, Zak Johnson said:

I would prob call one of the motorcycle safety courses and talk to one of the instructors they would def know.

Good idea, I’ll call next week.    I’d like to get my M license myself.   I’ll post back what they say.

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5 minutes ago, RDTH said:

Good idea, I’ll call next week.    I’d like to get my M license myself.   I’ll post back what they say.

I just looked on their site because I thought I should do the same and it says that they canceled all classes for the time being because of covid blah blah... even though it was just a single company they ended their contract with and I know there are lots of places across the state that offered them, but I couldn't find a list of available classes. Just would take me back to the message about ending the contract and not offering classes. 

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2 minutes ago, Zak Johnson said:

I just looked on their site because I thought I should do the same and it says that they canceled all classes for the time being because of covid blah blah... even though it was just a single company they ended their contract with and I know there are lots of places across the state that offered them, but I couldn't find a list of available classes. Just would take me back to the message about ending the contract and not offering classes. 

I just saw that too, damn COVID screwing something else up!  They mention a “virtual” safety course but I definitely would want my son to receive In-person training when that time comes.

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