2021 450 shootout fixed

[777654321]

2 hours ago, mog said:

Don't think you can 

 

The crf is not setup like you say 

 

Bad mapping and soft suspension means it will be all over the place in corners 

 

Honda seem to sometimes have a decent base and mess up the package anyway 

 

I liked the cr from 2005 

08 is suppose to be best ever

[mxaniac]

The reviews are all stock, so if a great bike has the wrong tires it will do poorly.  Is that reality?  No not really.  The fact that a Gas Gas, Husqvarna, and KTM do so differently in a shootout when they all have the same potential tells you stock trim weighs heavily in the shootout.  At a minimum I think the bikes should have the proper tires for the track, the ECU mapped, the test riders preferred handlebars, and the correct springs for the riders weight.  If you're buying a new bike and plan on competitively racing, I can't see you NOT having those things.  In the case of the Honda it is really getting dinged for the mapping which I agree should be better from the factory, but is something you can fix with a $45 CD and a $15 USB OBD2 reader and some paper clips.  Obviously the valving issue is bigger, and Honda has historically screwed the pooch on that one.  That's what Yamaha does so well at getting right, suspension valving.  I would bet money that a Honda I remapped and re-valved myself would be my bike of choice from the shootout though.

[mxaniac]

41 minutes ago, 777654321 said:

08 is suppose to be best ever

I like the 2013 handling the best once you fix the atrocious suspension and horrific engine.  People contend it's more of a rear wheel steerer than the others which makes sense on why I like it, I'm 2-stroke born and raised!

[ah665]

11 minutes ago, mxaniac said:

The reviews are all stock, so if a great bike has the wrong tires it will do poorly.  Is that reality?  No not really.  The fact that a Gas Gas, Husqvarna, and KTM do so differently in a shootout when they all have the same potential tells you stock trim weighs heavily in the shootout.  At a minimum I think the bikes should have the proper tires for the track, the ECU mapped, the test riders preferred handlebars, and the correct springs for the riders weight.  If you're buying a new bike and plan on competitively racing, I can't see you NOT having those things.  In the case of the Honda it is really getting dinged for the mapping which I agree should be better from the factory, but is something you can fix with a $45 CD and a $15 USB OBD2 reader and some paper clips.  Obviously the valving issue is bigger, and Honda has historically screwed the pooch on that one.  That's what Yamaha does so well at getting right, suspension valving.  I would bet money that a Honda I remapped and re-valved myself would be my bike of choice from the shootout though.

Dirt Bike did put the same tires on all bikes to make it a little more even. 

And i get what you are saying there. But that also is adding potentially another grand or 2 into the purchase price. Plus once modding starts, things can really stray in a hurry (different people require different changes etc.) I think it's cool to do the shootouts stock then do articles later that focus on best mods. Keefer has done that a lot, as has MXA. I think for people who are detail oriented you can read these shootouts and take the info of which makes works best as a starting point for you, then see the end result. What you said about the Honda shows that we are on the same page. It might be last place but you get a remap and dial suspension and it's going to be a great bike.

[lowmass]

I had 2 2007 and 1 2008

they were pretty good but not That good, And they got old fast if u were on it

08 motor was a bit better ( mapping) than 07 BUT the 08 triple clamps were a move in the wrong direction

the 08 with 07 triples was a good setup BUT the suspension needed work especially the forks

I rode those bikes for a decade while I watched all the development changes going on with the "new" bikes

By 2016 I was convinced a switch to KTM was the right move BUT wanted a better deal than 9 grand

finally in 2019 there were left over 2018 SXF450s for 6900$ and it was time

I swear I was faster and more relaxed on the KTM within 1 ride

waaayyy better bike

and for 10 grand and at this time in history there simply is no excuse for a bike that needs work

no excuse at all

 

Edited December 29, 2020 by lowmass

[777654321]

50 minutes ago, lowmass said:

I had 2 2007 and 1 2008

they were pretty good but not That good, And they got old fast if u were on it

08 motor was a bit better ( mapping) than 07 BUT the 08 triple clamps were a move in the wrong direction

the 08 with 07 triples was a good setup BUT the suspension needed work especially the forks

I rode those bikes for a decade while I watched all the development changes going on with the "new" bikes

By 2016 I was convinced a switch to KTM was the right move BUT wanted a better deal than 9 grand

finally in 2019 there were left over 2018 SXF450s for 6900$ and it was time

I swear I was faster and more relaxed on the KTM within 1 ride

waaayyy better bike

and for 10 grand and at this time in history there simply is no excuse for a bike that needs work

no excuse at all

 

You'd be surprised how much better you'd perform with a new wife if you git rid of the one you'd been riding fir over 10 years 🤣

[ah665]

1 hour ago, lowmass said:

I had 2 2007 and 1 2008

they were pretty good but not That good, And they got old fast if u were on it

08 motor was a bit better ( mapping) than 07 BUT the 08 triple clamps were a move in the wrong direction

the 08 with 07 triples was a good setup BUT the suspension needed work especially the forks

I rode those bikes for a decade while I watched all the development changes going on with the "new" bikes

By 2016 I was convinced a switch to KTM was the right move BUT wanted a better deal than 9 grand

finally in 2019 there were left over 2018 SXF450s for 6900$ and it was time

I swear I was faster and more relaxed on the KTM within 1 ride

waaayyy better bike

and for 10 grand and at this time in history there simply is no excuse for a bike that needs work

no excuse at all

 

You are certainly right with that last part...and I've said this before and still is kinda hard for me to believe but I can buy a YZ250F and race it stock right now and be happy. I spent way more money trying to get my 350 where I wanted, than if I would've just got another YZ250F instead. Granted, my 350 as it sits is now a great bike. But that is certainly weighing into what I purchase next.

[MANIAC998]

7 hours ago, 777654321 said:

You'd be surprised how much better you'd perform with a new wife if you git rid of the one you'd been riding fir over 10 years 🤣

Waaaaaaay more expensive than $6900 though.

[lowmass]

10 hours ago, ah665 said:

You are certainly right with that last part...and I've said this before and still is kinda hard for me to believe but I can buy a YZ250F and race it stock right now and be happy. I spent way more money trying to get my 350 where I wanted, than if I would've just got another YZ250F instead. Granted, my 350 as it sits is now a great bike. But that is certainly weighing into what I purchase next.

yep

I wanted the 450 Yamaha. In fact it is most of the reason I waited 10 years!  BUT they just didn't get the 450 worked out imo. not yet anyway. Not saying its a bad bike but it is simply not as refined as the SXF

the 250 is obviously a different story for sure BUT I suspect its simply because its far lighter, has much less rotating mass, and has less torque the the 450

The  sxf 450  has a few issues yet, BUT they are all small AND fixable by the average joe. Just set the sag right ( still a trouble spot for many riders!) and the rest is easy

I have rode the crap out of mine for 2 seasons now and have done nothing to it except tighten spokes and replace the stuff that will always wear out. tires,brakes,chain sprokes. Rims are soft, shame on them.

near Yamaha reliability so far

my 07 and  08 Hondas were a very different story

balancer shafts, clutch baskets, ALL levers including  kick starter, 3rd gear, Intake valves!, cracking sub frames, head pipes that dent just looking at them ,radiators positioned such that nearly any tip over caves them in, weak brakes, etc  I could not get more than 1/2 season on these parts

All my pre 2005 Hondas were much more reliable. I think Honda made a decision somewhere after 2005 to make a lower quality product. Not sure how they are now 

 

 

 

Edited December 29, 2020 by lowmass

[lowmass]

3 hours ago, MANIAC998 said:

Waaaaaaay more expensive than $6900 though.

understatement of the year

 

[Chicken-N-Waffles]

3 hours ago, MANIAC998 said:

Waaaaaaay more expensive than $6900 though.

Not if you buy a Chinese model. 

[lowmass]

ha yea but they dont last long time

Edited December 29, 2020 by lowmass

[KABLEXXL Biden 2021]

DB Magazine shootout,, Honda dead last LMAO.   This is the best 450 shootout of all of them.

https://dirtbikemagazine.com/2021-450-motocross-shootout/

 

[ah665]

You are a bit late to the party but yes, it is very funny. I think the shootout is well-done though. 

Edited December 29, 2020 by ah665