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motocross KTM to build Green bikes next?

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So, evidently big Green is in the red, and KHI is dumping them to the wolves.  How long do you think it will be before KTM starts building green bikes?  Hey at least they'll have a good clutch.

"Kawasaki President Hashimoto Yasuhiko said at a news conference that he hopes the motorcycle business will continue to build the strong Kawasaki brand and revitalize the market through collaboration with other companies."

Kawasaki will spin off it's motorcycle division

Think that Bell Helmet photo op, was an op for ET3 to ask CW how he likes riding an Indian? 

Apologies if this has already been covered.

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Kawasaki builds ocean liners, trains, helicopters, bridges and just happen to sell some motorcycles on the side. Separating the m/c division makes sense from a business perspective. Kawasaki is not in trouble nor are they done as a bike manufacturer. 
The only green bikes that will come from Austria will be when KTM gets the rights to Ossa and rebadge their SX/SX-F line in green like they did making red “Gas Gas” bikes.

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14 hours ago, sheath said:

So, evidently big Green is in the red, and KHI is dumping them to the wolves.  How long do you think it will be before KTM starts building green bikes?  Hey at least they'll have a good clutch.

"Kawasaki President Hashimoto Yasuhiko said at a news conference that he hopes the motorcycle business will continue to build the strong Kawasaki brand and revitalize the market through collaboration with other companies."

Kawasaki will spin off it's motorcycle division

Think that Bell Helmet photo op, was an op for ET3 to ask CW how he likes riding an Indian? 

Apologies if this has already been covered.

They aren't dumping SxS I bet.

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I wonder how this will affect the race teams? 

Without Mother Kawasaki supplying all the money they can suck down, their financials will be tightened.  So it will take someone charismatic with a lot of pull, and a lot of desire to support racing like they currently do. 

I've been through a spin-off before, and it was rough, for years.  Never returned to Pre spin-off benefits.  Many of us left early, because the handwriting was on the walls.

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1 hour ago, sheath said:

I wonder how this will affect the race teams? 

Without Mother Kawasaki supplying all the money they can suck down, their financials will be tightened.  So it will take someone charismatic with a lot of pull, and a lot of desire to support racing like they currently do. 

I've been through a spin-off before, and it was rough, for years.  Never returned to Pre spin-off benefits.  Many of us left early, because the handwriting was on the walls.

I've also seen it go the other way, a local company was able to reduce overhead immensely when they were spun off.  In this case though, I think all the manufacturers have a choice in going to something green (low carbon emissions) or becoming like camera film and vacuum tubes, a niche market.  Suzuki and Kawasaki don't from outside appearances be poised for the transition.

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1 hour ago, sheath said:

I wonder how this will affect the race teams? 

Without Monsther Kawasaki supplying all the money they can suck down, their financials will be tightened fineSo It will takes someone charismatic with a lot of pull, and a lot of desire to support racing like they currently do directly compete with RedBull.

FIFY

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i wd wager it will be one of those giant India or Chinese brands...in his autobiography, Rick Seiman insists that the japs only made dirtbikes out of "asian corporate pride", in the sense that if no other jap co made a db, then none of them wd bother---tho he did point out the tremendous profit margin on db's vs the small one on streetbikes.  Streetbikes get some profit back b/c most street owners utilize the shop for repairs...  Wd b interesting to know how many dirtbikers now utilize a shop now too, with the modern 4T on the scene.

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21 minutes ago, txkawboy said:

i wd wager it will be one of those giant India or Chinese brands...in his autobiography, Rick Seiman insists that the japs only made dirtbikes out of "asian corporate pride", in the sense that if no other jap co made a db, then none of them wd bother---tho he did point out the tremendous profit margin on db's vs the small one on streetbikes.  Streetbikes get some profit back b/c most street owners utilize the shop for repairs...  Wd b interesting to know how many dirtbikers now utilize a shop now too, with the modern 4T on the scene.

Dirtbikes were a route into the American market for Japanese industrial companies in the 1960s and early 1970s because they could skirt the protectionism they would have faced in other industries like cars. And it was a way to showcase Japanese ingenuity, engineering capability, and quality which prior to that was often seen like Chinese goods are today (this is typically more a function of label importer than quality capability i.e. Apple phones are considered high quality but have been made in China for years). 

In time as Japanese products became more accepted in other arenas with much larger markets I think it is true that Japanese DBs and DB racing became mostly a matter of corporate pride(and advertising) --the market is small after all.

The Chinese and Indians might become huge and take the market but their main goals will be to serve their own giant growing populations. Japan came into a unique spot in history where they were able to provide a huge wealthy market like the US with goods and services compared to their own small market and shirking population. The other Asian tigers like Korea and Taiwan have done some of this in the US but the big prize for them really is Asia and the developing world now.

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1 hour ago, Chaconne said:

Dirtbikes were a route into the American market for Japanese industrial companies in the 1960s and early 1970s because they could skirt the protectionism they would have faced in other industries like cars. And it was a way to showcase Japanese ingenuity, engineering capability, and quality which prior to that was often seen like Chinese goods are today (this is typically more a function of label importer than quality capability i.e. Apple phones are considered high quality but have been made in China for years). 

In time as Japanese products became more accepted in other arenas with much larger markets I think it is true that Japanese DBs and DB racing became mostly a matter of corporate pride(and advertising) --the market is small after all.

The Chinese and Indians might become huge and take the market but their main goals will be to serve their own giant growing populations. Japan came into a unique spot in history where they were able to provide a huge wealthy market like the US with goods and services compared to their own small market and shirking population. The other Asian tigers like Korea and Taiwan have done some of this in the US but the big prize for them really is Asia and the developing world now.

I don't disagree with you, but I do think it's relevant that they managed to out develop what was mostly small European manufacturers by releasing significantly updated models annually.  They were able to outspend the competition until they didn't have any.  On top of that, European labor laws were preventing them from displacing workers with automation.

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30 minutes ago, mxaniac said:

I don't disagree with you, but I do think it's relevant that they managed to out develop what was mostly small European manufacturers by releasing significantly updated models annually.  They were able to outspend the competition until they didn't have any.  On top of that, European labor laws were preventing them from displacing workers with automation.

Agreed. 

Also a lot of factors later changed and seemed to catch the Japanese off guard in the late 80s and onward. Been kind of sad to see. The rapid rise of China, the renewed power the Europeans got from the EU (despite all the bitchin and whinin), and the power of countries like the US, China, India, and the EU have with large mixed "internal" and "external" markets have increasingly nudged Japan aside. 

Edited by Chaconne

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4 minutes ago, Chaconne said:

Agreed. 

Also a lot of factors later changed and seemed to catch the Japanese off guard in the late 80s and onward. Been kind of sad to see. The rapid rise of China, the renewed power the Europeans got from the EU (despite all the bitchin and whinin), and the power of countries like the US, China, India, and the EU have with large mixed "internal" and "external" markets have increasingly nudged Japan aside. 

I guess they just didn't have enough diversity in the workplace 😈

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Just now, mxaniac said:

I guess they just didn't have enough diversity in the workplace 😈

Ha ya they aren't exactly known for welcoming talent from elsewhere. 

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18 hours ago, sheath said:

Without Mother Kawasaki supplying all the money they can suck down, their financials will be tightened. 

You have underestimated how much Monster $$$ is involved.

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44 minutes ago, MANIAC998 said:

Would Monster pull the plug like Geico did, once they feel that they have achieved market saturation??:thinking:

Or once they get a new VP of marketing:

 

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History repeats:

It the late 60's the Euro bikes started loosing market to the Japs (who could only make cheap copies)

Today the Euro bike (KTM) is going to start loosing market to the Chinks (who can only make cheap copies)

KTM need to let the green bike go...  If they were smart they would buy into Baja or SSR or .......

the real funny thing is that I see KTM could get hurt by SWM (old husky that they sold off) and that new brand (old gas gas that they sold off)      Ironic...

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9 minutes ago, daled said:

History repeats:

It the late 60's the Euro bikes started loosing market to the Japs (who could only make cheap copies)

Today the Euro bike (KTM) is going to start loosing market to the Chinks (who can only make cheap copies)

KTM need to let the green bike go...  If they were smart they would buy into Baja or SSR or .......

the real funny thing is that I see KTM could get hurt by SWM (old husky that they sold off) and that new brand (old gas gas that they sold off)      Ironic...

Also, in the '80s the Euros lost market share because they couldn't keep up with the rapid advancement of the Japanese bike technology...the long travel, water cooling, linkage rears, disc brakes, light weight MX bikes that evolved in just a few years after the air-cooled, twin-shock '70s.

Edited by SlowDinoDog
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From my perspective...KTM brought the Euros back from failure after the Japanese dominated and cut back in the mid-2000s. The Japanese developed the high revving 4Ts of the late 90's and 2000s and the venerable YZ250 MX bikes...

...and the 4T, estart CRFX and WRF off-road bikes.

Isn't KTM's 'return to dominance' ...(cough cough)...simply because the Japanese never developed an estart 2T performance trail bike with a 300cc overbore?

How big of difference do the new 4T MX bikes really have?

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4 minutes ago, SlowDinoDog said:

Isn't KTM's 'return to dominance' ...(cough cough)...simply because the Japanese never developed an estart 2T performance trail bike with a 300cc overbore

Yes this.  It is all about the 300 2T, as I know @Drop-Bear would agree.

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