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offroad Off-road Mt. Rushmore

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1 hour ago, HeavyRotationClassic said:

Europeans eat a lot more fiber than Americans so he'd just digest the bark. Do you even Mueslix bro? 

They're pussies, they need to eat something like 'Muricans eat:
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Focusing on just Americans, because Mt. Rushmore is American.

1st is Malcom Smith.  If you don't think so, sell your bike.

2nd is King Richard.  Burleson was the man after Malcom, and it isn't even close.

3rd starts to get a little more challenging, but here is where I would put Larry Roeseler.  He was the jack of all trades in the 80's/90's (as Malcom was before him) and would win on either coast, in any discipline.  He didn't do as much with bikes after he "retired" from racing 2 wheels, as he is still racing now on four wheels.  He just won the Baja 1000 overall this last weekend with Luke McMillin: his 14th total overall win combining 2 and 4 wheels!

4th is where it gets murky, just like it does for moto, but I would put either the Javelin, Zip Ty, or Caselli in this spot.  For Randy Hawkins and Ty Davis, it is that not only were they that good, it is how many other racers they have groomed since they hung up their boots through their respective race teams/programs.  This puts them above many other multi-time champs from both coasts IMO.  Ty Davis was more well rounded (he was LR's protege) and could win anywhere, anytime but Randy was simply so so good for so long and again, he has kept it going with the AmPro team for decades as well.  For Kurt, it is not only what he did on the bike, but if not for him no one from the US wins the ISDE.  He put that team/event on his shoulders and without Kurt we are still mid-packers at best on the world stage.  The legacy he has left behind and the foundation working in his name is also something great for off road racing.

As for the current "greats" and some of the past ones, they are just too specialized or haven't had enough history yet.  Danny Hamel (still my personal hero) won everything out West, but he didn't do that well at Enduro type stuff and ran out of time on this Earth to excel at the few things he wasn't the best at.  Taylor Robert is absolutely dominant on anything he races out West as Kailub Russell is at anything back East, however going out of their comfort zones to race elsewhere isn't done (I don't blame them, this is probably more on KTM).  Riders now are just so much more specialists in their respective disciplines that I am not sure if you could put any of them on an "off-road" Mt. Rushmore.  Times change.  To be on the off-road Mt. Rushmore you have to excel at almost everything, and have a legacy that has lasted (or started many others on their own legacies).

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37 minutes ago, eastreich said:

Focusing on just Americans, because Mt. Rushmore is American.

1st is Malcom Smith.  If you don't think so, sell your bike.

2nd is King Richard.  Burleson was the man after Malcom, and it isn't even close.

3rd starts to get a little more challenging, but here is where I would put Larry Roeseler.  He was the jack of all trades in the 80's/90's (as Malcom was before him) and would win on either coast, in any discipline.  He didn't do as much with bikes after he "retired" from racing 2 wheels, as he is still racing now on four wheels.  He just won the Baja 1000 overall this last weekend with Luke McMillin: his 14th total overall win combining 2 and 4 wheels!

4th is where it gets murky, just like it does for moto, but I would put either the Javelin, Zip Ty, or Caselli in this spot.  For Randy Hawkins and Ty Davis, it is that not only were they that good, it is how many other racers they have groomed since they hung up their boots through their respective race teams/programs.  This puts them above many other multi-time champs from both coasts IMO.  Ty Davis was more well rounded (he was LR's protege) and could win anywhere, anytime but Randy was simply so so good for so long and again, he has kept it going with the AmPro team for decades as well.  For Kurt, it is not only what he did on the bike, but if not for him no one from the US wins the ISDE.  He put that team/event on his shoulders and without Kurt we are still mid-packers at best on the world stage.  The legacy he has left behind and the foundation working in his name is also something great for off road racing.

As for the current "greats" and some of the past ones, they are just too specialized or haven't had enough history yet.  Danny Hamel (still my personal hero) won everything out West, but he didn't do that well at Enduro type stuff and ran out of time on this Earth to excel at the few things he wasn't the best at.  Taylor Robert is absolutely dominant on anything he races out West as Kailub Russell is at anything back East, however going out of their comfort zones to race elsewhere isn't done (I don't blame them, this is probably more on KTM).  Riders now are just so much more specialists in their respective disciplines that I am not sure if you could put any of them on an "off-road" Mt. Rushmore.  Times change.  To be on the off-road Mt. Rushmore you have to excel at almost everything, and have a legacy that has lasted (or started many others on their own legacies).

I agree off-road has just gotten so specialized. Seems like no one rides "everything" anymore. I guess Supes does but that seems different. On another note I am surprised no one has mentioned Ty winning a 125SX title? Can't think of another successful off-road guy who can make that claim?

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Just now, dirtbikesonny said:

I agree off-road has just gotten so specialized. Seems like no one rides "everything" anymore. I guess Supes does but that seems different. On another note I am surprised no one has mentioned Ty winning a 125SX title? Can't think of another successful off-road guy who can make that claim?

Ty was the last person to beat McGrath for a Supercross title until Jeremy raced a Suzuki.

There are more than a few with MX titles (and lots of close to titles), but none with an SX title (regional or big bike).  Zach Osborne may eventually get to off road in time to win a few titles.  Aaron Plessinger is a better bet as he is younger and may get to off road sooner.

Off the top of my head, for really good (to great) MX riders you have Mike Kiedrowski, Rodney Smith (and still hauling while being the Beta team manager), Danny LaPorte, and Mike Brown.

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1 hour ago, eastreich said:

Ty was the last person to beat McGrath for a Supercross title until Jeremy raced a Suzuki.

There are more than a few with MX titles (and lots of close to titles), but none with an SX title (regional or big bike).  Zach Osborne may eventually get to off road in time to win a few titles.  Aaron Plessinger is a better bet as he is younger and may get to off road sooner.

Off the top of my head, for really good (to great) MX riders you have Mike Kiedrowski, Rodney Smith (and still hauling while being the Beta team manager), Danny LaPorte, and Mike Brown.

The Hill brothers are teaming up with Hodges and that's for sure gonna bring a title or 2. 

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42 minutes ago, 777654321 said:

The Hill brothers are teaming up with Hodges and that's for sure gonna bring a title or 2. 

Wrong thread?

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5 minutes ago, HeavyRotationClassic said:

I completely forgot he won this year, this will always be his crowning achievement. 

 

When he kicked his bike off the stand at Daytona I was hooked. Got the rim from that bike....Signed.  🤣

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3 hours ago, eastreich said:

Focusing on just Americans, because Mt. Rushmore is American.

1st is Malcom Smith.  If you don't think so, sell your bike.

2nd is King Richard.  Burleson was the man after Malcom, and it isn't even close.

3rd starts to get a little more challenging, but here is where I would put Larry Roeseler.  He was the jack of all trades in the 80's/90's (as Malcom was before him) and would win on either coast, in any discipline.  He didn't do as much with bikes after he "retired" from racing 2 wheels, as he is still racing now on four wheels.  He just won the Baja 1000 overall this last weekend with Luke McMillin: his 14th total overall win combining 2 and 4 wheels!

4th is where it gets murky, just like it does for moto, but I would put either the Javelin, Zip Ty, or Caselli in this spot.  For Randy Hawkins and Ty Davis, it is that not only were they that good, it is how many other racers they have groomed since they hung up their boots through their respective race teams/programs.  This puts them above many other multi-time champs from both coasts IMO.  Ty Davis was more well rounded (he was LR's protege) and could win anywhere, anytime but Randy was simply so so good for so long and again, he has kept it going with the AmPro team for decades as well.  For Kurt, it is not only what he did on the bike, but if not for him no one from the US wins the ISDE.  He put that team/event on his shoulders and without Kurt we are still mid-packers at best on the world stage.  The legacy he has left behind and the foundation working in his name is also something great for off road racing.

As for the current "greats" and some of the past ones, they are just too specialized or haven't had enough history yet.  Danny Hamel (still my personal hero) won everything out West, but he didn't do that well at Enduro type stuff and ran out of time on this Earth to excel at the few things he wasn't the best at.  Taylor Robert is absolutely dominant on anything he races out West as Kailub Russell is at anything back East, however going out of their comfort zones to race elsewhere isn't done (I don't blame them, this is probably more on KTM).  Riders now are just so much more specialists in their respective disciplines that I am not sure if you could put any of them on an "off-road" Mt. Rushmore.  Times change.  To be on the off-road Mt. Rushmore you have to excel at almost everything, and have a legacy that has lasted (or started many others on their own legacies).

Why??

 

 

 

 

Why must you continuously bring such utter nonsense into TT Pro? This is the home of half truths and outright embellishments, clouded with Orange tinted spectacles, and yet you continuously jeopardize TT Pro with well thought out, articulate, and accurate knowledge of our off-road heroes. Shame on you.

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25 minutes ago, MANIAC998 said:

Why??

 

 

 

 

Why must you continuously bring such utter nonsense into TT Pro? This is the home of half truths and outright embellishments, clouded with Orange tinted spectacles, and yet you continuously jeopardize TT Pro with well thought out, articulate, and accurate knowledge of our off-road heroes. Shame on you.

Seriously, Randy's and Ty's Yamaha associations should make them inelligible.

At least Ty saw the light and got on board with Husky. That they weren't KTM owned back then is no matter, he knew it was coming.

 

 

 

 

 

That better?

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5 hours ago, eastreich said:

Focusing on just Americans, because Mt. Rushmore is American.

1st is Malcom Smith.  If you don't think so, sell your bike.

2nd is King Richard.  Burleson was the man after Malcom, and it isn't even close.

3rd starts to get a little more challenging, but here is where I would put Larry Roeseler.  He was the jack of all trades in the 80's/90's (as Malcom was before him) and would win on either coast, in any discipline.  He didn't do as much with bikes after he "retired" from racing 2 wheels, as he is still racing now on four wheels.  He just won the Baja 1000 overall this last weekend with Luke McMillin: his 14th total overall win combining 2 and 4 wheels!

4th is where it gets murky, just like it does for moto, but I would put either the Javelin, Zip Ty, or Caselli in this spot.  For Randy Hawkins and Ty Davis, it is that not only were they that good, it is how many other racers they have groomed since they hung up their boots through their respective race teams/programs.  This puts them above many other multi-time champs from both coasts IMO.  Ty Davis was more well rounded (he was LR's protege) and could win anywhere, anytime but Randy was simply so so good for so long and again, he has kept it going with the AmPro team for decades as well.  For Kurt, it is not only what he did on the bike, but if not for him no one from the US wins the ISDE.  He put that team/event on his shoulders and without Kurt we are still mid-packers at best on the world stage.  The legacy he has left behind and the foundation working in his name is also something great for off road racing.

As for the current "greats" and some of the past ones, they are just too specialized or haven't had enough history yet.  Danny Hamel (still my personal hero) won everything out West, but he didn't do that well at Enduro type stuff and ran out of time on this Earth to excel at the few things he wasn't the best at.  Taylor Robert is absolutely dominant on anything he races out West as Kailub Russell is at anything back East, however going out of their comfort zones to race elsewhere isn't done (I don't blame them, this is probably more on KTM).  Riders now are just so much more specialists in their respective disciplines that I am not sure if you could put any of them on an "off-road" Mt. Rushmore.  Times change.  To be on the off-road Mt. Rushmore you have to excel at almost everything, and have a legacy that has lasted (or started many others on their own legacies).

The only disagreement I have is Taylor Robert. While he doesn’t do GNCC, he has won the overall at the ISDE, won at Endurocross and is a top contender in extreme Enduro if/when KTM allows him to race, plus he is darn good on a trials bike. I’d say he’s very versatile.  

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6 minutes ago, MANIAC998 said:

Ryan Sipes has won at numerous off-road disciples and should be in the discussion as well. Riding Orange should not exclude him, but if that’s the case, I can live with that decision.

Sipes is out because he doesn't have any major titles to back all the individual wins, other than the ISDE.

And maybe this makes me the a-hole, but I don't value the ISDE in regards to someone having to be a great off road racer to win it. Everts showed up one year, whooped everyone, and went back to the track. You just have to be a really good racer, with a great TEAM behind you. If I learned one thing from the Hamilton's it is how much goes on behind the scenes to keep the fast guys fast.

If anything, at least to me, the ISDE is the least individual win of any off road event, even Dakar. If the team sucks, you can be the best rider in the world and you aren't going to win. The amount of people necessary to keep that machine rolling is amazing, and I applaud the efforts every single year. Case in point, Everts. If was on, say, the Brazilian team instead of France, does he win? Nope!

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18 minutes ago, MANIAC998 said:

Ryan Sipes has won at numerous off-road disciples and should be in the discussion as well. Riding Orange should not exclude him, but if that’s the case, I can live with that decision.

Not possible to win at so many disciplines on any other color. 

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Just now, eastreich said:

Sipes is out because he doesn't have any major titles to back all the individual wins, other than the ISDE.

And maybe this makes me the a-hole, but I don't value the ISDE in regards to someone having to be a great off road racer to win it. Everts showed up one year, whooped everyone, and went back to the track. You just have to be a really good racer, with a great TEAM behind you. If I learned one thing from the Hamilton's it is how much goes on behind the scenes to keep the fast guys fast.

If anything, at least to me, the ISDE is the least individual win of any off road event, even Dakar. If the team sucks, you can be the best rider in the world and you aren't going to win. The amount of people necessary to keep that machine rolling is amazing, and I applaud the efforts every single year. Case in point, Everts. If was on, say, the Brazilian team instead of France, does he win? Nope!

image.gif.a5a41f93c230cd98af02a35b2e36c41d.gif

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6 minutes ago, KTMRider4Life said:

Not possible to win at so many disciplines on any other color. 

 

1 minute ago, MANIAC998 said:

Ty Davis?

Larry Roeseler?

Dick Burelson?

 I know you mean in current times though.

I think someone could do it on a Beta (and maybe a Sherco in another few years) but they don't have the cash/sponsor (aka RedBull) to get the rider on the bike that could do it.

Would be an outside chance for someone to do it on a Yamaha too, but again, that would be if the team/mfr was willing and I don't see it happening.

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