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brysonrs

Pol Tarrés to Yamaha for 2021

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Posted (edited)

Looks like he will be riding Yamaha for 2021. Be interesting to see him on one for the extreme events. I'm assuming a YZ250X will be the bike for extreme. He says his 2-stroke has electric start. Will he be running a Panthera kit or did Yamaha develop their own?

160057394_Screenshot_20210107-1818342.thumb.png.a57c6979a036438abe992078d6dc754c.png 

1023543991_Screenshot_20210107-1155262.png.328e4a963c7ef197e478ee49e4a84294.png

If you aren't familiar with him, check this video out. Dude can ride.

https://youtu.be/WwgNqftj3Cc

Edited by brysonrs
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2 hours ago, Charles De Mar said:

 

Pretty amazing how nimble he makes a 450 lb bike look.

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Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, indy rider said:

Yea, that thread is in the wrong section.

Being the only Japanese brand with a full size 2 stroke its about time they put it in some hard enduros. Be interesting to see how the lack of estart effects the racing. They do a lot of killing the bike and restarting in hard enduro.

Edited by Zinergy

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9 minutes ago, Zinergy said:

Yea, that thread is in the wrong section.

Being the only Japanese brand with a full size 2 stroke its about time they put it in some hard enduros. Be interesting to see how the lack of estart effects the racing. They do a lot of killing the bike and restarting in hard enduro.

He has e-start (see first post).

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Pol has pretty much carte blanche to do whatever he wants.  He has Yamaha support, but it is his "own" team and he gets to throw aftermarket parts at the YZ that a regular Yamaha team would NEVER get approval for. 

Pol got this gig due to his T7 riding videos (which are, frankly, amazing) not due to his racing credentials (which are also, frankly, amazing).

People are going to read into all this that Pol is developing an e-start YZ250 for the factory, and probably a 300 down the road (he says if needs to punch it out he will) but that isn't the case.  Yamaha is paying him to be an ambassador for the T7, not develop a new YZ300Xe.  The racing events are just a "side gig" to the main purpose of promoting the T7.

But, cue the blue love coming in for an e-start YZ (which is never getting made in Japan).  There will be fully electric YZE motocrossers for sale in Yamaha dealerships before there will be a factory built electric start 2 stroke motocross/cross country bike in those same locations.

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1 hour ago, v1kku said:

He has e-start (see first post).

Yamaha should take notice and at the very least put estart on the x bikes already.

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Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, Zinergy said:

Yamaha should take notice and at the very least put estart on the x bikes already.

Yamaha will never spend the money to develop new cases, crankshafts, and integrate the starters the way a proper OEM setup would be.  IF Yamaha were willing to spend that kind of money, the YZs wouldn't currently be using a 15 year old frame and an even older engine.

They sell every single 125 and 250 smoker they make as it is, so why should Yamaha do anything different?  Yamaha 2 strokes print money with everyone who buys their old bikes as brand new.  I am NOT saying that they are bad bikes.  Quite the contrary.  They have held up for so long because they are that good.  But from a business standpoint, it makes NO SENSE for Yamaha to put a button on their smokers.

Now, if everyone out there quits buying YZ smokers so they start to gather dust on showroom floors, then maybe, just maybe it would happen.  But more than likely they would just get disco'd like the other Japanese manufacturers have already done.

All of us XRs guys went down this road over a decade ago.  Put e-start and EFI on the XR650R, and put the 20 year old 650L out to pasture.  Honda already had both on the TRX700XX which used a modified 650R engine, so they had all the hard work already done.  They just needed to make a third set of cases to rid the TRX700XX sub-transmission setup to get it to bolt into the XR frame.  ALL the other parts were already in production.  But nope, we are now looking at a 30 year old 650L being sold on showroom floors.  Yamaha isn't even that far along, so at this point everyone can keep shaking their fists at the clouds.  Yamaha is just laughing at us all.  To Yamaha bean counters, the YZ125/250 is no different than a PW50, TTR230, XT250, TW200, V-Star 250, or VK540.  It is a legacy model with paid for tooling that they can sell as many as they make in a year.  It is simply a high profit/low risk business case.

Edited by eastreich
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21 minutes ago, eastreich said:

Yamaha will never spend the money to develop new cases, crankshafts, and integrate the starters the way a proper OEM setup would be.  IF Yamaha were willing to spend that kind of money, the YZs wouldn't currently be using a 15 year old frame and an even older engine.

They sell every single 125 and 250 smoker they make as it is, so why should Yamaha do anything different?  Yamaha 2 strokes print money with everyone who buys their old bikes as brand new.  I am NOT saying that they are bad bikes.  Quite the contrary.  They have held up for so long because they are that good.  But from a business standpoint, it makes NO SENSE for Yamaha to put a button on their smokers.

Now, if everyone out there quits buying YZ smokers so they start to gather dust on showroom floors, then maybe, just maybe it would happen.  But more than likely they would just get disco'd like the other Japanese manufacturers have already done.

All of us XRs guys went down this road over a decade ago.  Put e-start and EFI on the XR650R, and put the 20 year old 650L out to pasture.  Honda already had both on the TRX700XX which used a modified 650R engine, so they had all the hard work already done.  They just needed to make a third set of cases to rid the TRX700XX sub-transmission setup to get it to bolt into the XR frame.  ALL the other parts were already in production.  But nope, we are now looking at a 30 year old 650L being sold on showroom floors.  Yamaha isn't even that far along, so at this point everyone can keep shaking their fists at the clouds.  Yamaha is just laughing at us all.  To Yamaha bean counters, the YZ125/250 is no different than a PW50, TTR230, XT250, TW200, V-Star 250, or VK540.  It is a legacy model with paid for tooling that they can sell as many as they make in a year.  It is simply a high profit/low risk business case.

They would have sold at least one more 250X.... to me if they had e-start. If I had a nickel for everyone who has said that I could have bought a yz250x by now.

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32 minutes ago, eastreich said:

Yamaha will never spend the money to develop new cases, crankshafts, and integrate the starters the way a proper OEM setup would be.  IF Yamaha were willing to spend that kind of money, the YZs wouldn't currently be using a 15 year old frame and an even older engine.

They sell every single 125 and 250 smoker they make as it is, so why should Yamaha do anything different?  Yamaha 2 strokes print money with everyone who buys their old bikes as brand new.  I am NOT saying that they are bad bikes.  Quite the contrary.  They have held up for so long because they are that good.  But from a business standpoint, it makes NO SENSE for Yamaha to put a button on their smokers.

Now, if everyone out there quits buying YZ smokers so they start to gather dust on showroom floors, then maybe, just maybe it would happen.  But more than likely they would just get disco'd like the other Japanese manufacturers have already done.

All of us XRs guys went down this road over a decade ago.  Put e-start and EFI on the XR650R, and put the 20 year old 650L out to pasture.  Honda already had both on the TRX700XX which used a modified 650R engine, so they had all the hard work already done.  They just needed to make a third set of cases to rid the TRX700XX sub-transmission setup to get it to bolt into the XR frame.  ALL the other parts were already in production.  But nope, we are now looking at a 30 year old 650L being sold on showroom floors.  Yamaha isn't even that far along, so at this point everyone can keep shaking their fists at the clouds.  Yamaha is just laughing at us all.  To Yamaha bean counters, the YZ125/250 is no different than a PW50, TTR230, XT250, TW200, V-Star 250, or VK540.  It is a legacy model with paid for tooling that they can sell as many as they make in a year.  It is simply a high profit/low risk business case.

BUT.. if the demand is there we might be surprised.  Did you see the CRF450L coming from Honda?   Hopefully Yamaha shows a bit more love for extreme offroad in the future... perhaps only in the form of a 350 offroad model though , I agree they will squeeze every last cent from the old YZ

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3 minutes ago, Zinergy said:

They would have sold at least one more 250X.... to me if they had e-start. If I had a nickel for everyone who has said that I could have bought a yz250x by now.

Yamaha would have to increase production of two stroke bikes, and they aren't going to.

If Yamaha were to make an electric start YZ, they feel (right or wrong) that they are going to lose sales of YZ250/450FXs, WRs, etc...  Will a few people that bought Austrian or Italian bikes drop them and go blue?  Absolutely!  But Yamaha just doesn't see it that way.  It is the same logic they use in regards to NOT making a YZ350FX, which is insane to me.  A YZ350F/FX would be the #1 selling dirtbike world wide if Yamaha would just build the darn thing and take thousands of sales out of Austrian dealerships.

Vastly simplifying things, a crank, slightly taller cylinder, longer cam chain, and longer cylinder studs is all that is needed to make a 350 four stroke.

OR leapfrog everyone and sell a Tenere 450 (street legal WR450 Rally). 

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I actually wonder if the are still on the original tooling, it doesn't last forever.  Volume is relatively low though so it may last 50 years, I don't know.  Word has it Honda had to replace the tooling on some of the high volume 4t putt putt engines, that's how we first got the low quality cheap knockoffs from China.  They didn't decommission the worn out tooling, they just stole them along with the design.

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1 hour ago, eastreich said:

Yamaha will never spend the money to develop new cases, crankshafts, and integrate the starters the way a proper OEM setup would be.  IF Yamaha were willing to spend that kind of money, the YZs wouldn't currently be using a 15 year old frame and an even older engine.

They sell every single 125 and 250 smoker they make as it is, so why should Yamaha do anything different?  Yamaha 2 strokes print money with everyone who buys their old bikes as brand new.  I am NOT saying that they are bad bikes.  Quite the contrary.  They have held up for so long because they are that good.  But from a business standpoint, it makes NO SENSE for Yamaha to put a button on their smokers.

Now, if everyone out there quits buying YZ smokers so they start to gather dust on showroom floors, then maybe, just maybe it would happen.  But more than likely they would just get disco'd like the other Japanese manufacturers have already done.

All of us XRs guys went down this road over a decade ago.  Put e-start and EFI on the XR650R, and put the 20 year old 650L out to pasture.  Honda already had both on the TRX700XX which used a modified 650R engine, so they had all the hard work already done.  They just needed to make a third set of cases to rid the TRX700XX sub-transmission setup to get it to bolt into the XR frame.  ALL the other parts were already in production.  But nope, we are now looking at a 30 year old 650L being sold on showroom floors.  Yamaha isn't even that far along, so at this point everyone can keep shaking their fists at the clouds.  Yamaha is just laughing at us all.  To Yamaha bean counters, the YZ125/250 is no different than a PW50, TTR230, XT250, TW200, V-Star 250, or VK540.  It is a legacy model with paid for tooling that they can sell as many as they make in a year.  It is simply a high profit/low risk business case.

I find the “they sell every bike they make” comment hilarious when people use that line.  They aren’t making or selling very many.  Royal Enfield sells every bike they make that’s a copy of an ancient bike too.  
 

It’s not like they’re making as many as they can and selling them all.  It’s more like they fire up the production line a few minutes a year and say, that’s plenty. But hey don’t stamp those VIN numbers yet, we might need to stamp a few with next years date. 

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4 minutes ago, KTMRider4Life said:

I find the “they sell every bike they make” comment hilarious when people use that line.  They aren’t making or selling very many.  Royal Enfield sells every bike they make that’s a copy of an ancient bike too.  
 

It’s not like they’re making as many as they can and selling them all.  It’s more like they fire up the production line a few minutes a year and say, that’s plenty. But hey don’t stamp those VIN numbers yet, we might need to stamp a few with next years date. 

If the production line was stopped and everyone sent home for a few weeks/months, then yeah, I would agree with this.  But that isn't the case.  They make the YZs they want to, then swap stuff around and make a bunch of YZ250Fs, R1s, Zuma scooters, or whatever else also uses that same production line.  So currently, if they were to make more YZ smokers, they are making LESS of something else they would rather sell.

The Royal Enfield is a "copy" in the same sense that a (God, I hate to say this) a 2020 H-D Low Rider is a "copy" of a 1990 H-D Low Rider.  The look almost identical, but everything is updated, modernized, etc... underneath that old, geriatric looking facade.  That is NOT the case with a YZ125/250.

You made me somewhat compliment Hardley-Ableson.  You are the :devil:.

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41 minutes ago, Woodschamp said:

BUT.. if the demand is there we might be surprised.  Did you see the CRF450L coming from Honda?   Hopefully Yamaha shows a bit more love for extreme offroad in the future... perhaps only in the form of a 350 offroad model though , I agree they will squeeze every last cent from the old YZ

I didn't think that Honda would go all in with what they did with the 450L/X in regards to the almost ground up differences from the R/RX.  I honestly thought, as did my friends still working at the Honda dealership, the new X would just be a similar spin as the older one on a current R.  However, with those massive changes to the platform it only makes sense to also sell the L.  Lots of shared parts to spread the R&D Yen out over more models.

Now what I AM surprised with is that Honda has not dropped a wrap around fuel tank/headlight modeled after the CRF250/300L Rally onto the 450L. They could charge an extra $1500 for those simple mods and there will still be lines out the door at Honda dealerships for guys putting deposits down.

Over ten years ago Honda was sending out questionnaires to dealers asking if they could sell a bike like "this."  The "this" bikes were KTM 250/450XCFs.  And thus the RX models were born.  But it took a long, long, long time for Honda to get there.

If just one of the Japanese manufacturers would build a 350 four stroke cross country model it would be a monumental moment.  As to why Honda felt the need to compete with the KTM EXC line is a little baffling to me, when it seems that they need to compete in the 350cc four stroke category.  But I am just an internet idiot/troll, so what do I know!

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