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Pol Tarrés to Yamaha for 2021

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How many 250 two-strokes does Yamaha sell each year in the US? world wide? I don't know, just curious what peoples best estimates are.

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44 minutes ago, eastreich said:

If the production line was stopped and everyone sent home for a few weeks/months, then yeah, I would agree with this.  But that isn't the case.  They make the YZs they want to, then swap stuff around and make a bunch of YZ250Fs, R1s, Zuma scooters, or whatever else also uses that same production line.  So currently, if they were to make more YZ smokers, they are making LESS of something else they would rather sell.

The Royal Enfield is a "copy" in the same sense that a (God, I hate to say this) a 2020 H-D Low Rider is a "copy" of a 1990 H-D Low Rider.  The look almost identical, but everything is updated, modernized, etc... underneath that old, geriatric looking facade.  That is NOT the case with a YZ125/250.

You made me somewhat compliment Hardley-Ableson.  You are the :devil:.

I had a buddy buy a Royal Enfield and while some stuff is updated like say the electronic ignition it’s still an ancient bike and rides like one. It’s very low on power, it struggled with cooling in the Central Valley of Ca when he would have to to grades even at highway speed, or trying to maintain highway speed I should say. The suspension was very poor, etc. 

 

just like a YZ rides like an old bike.  The point is because of their design they can’t sell many, and so they don’t make many. As you pointed out their margin is likely very high so why wouldn’t they make a shit ton of them?  The answer is they wouldn’t sell, that’s why. 

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40 minutes ago, eastreich said:

If the production line was stopped and everyone sent home for a few weeks/months, then yeah, I would agree with this.  But that isn't the case.  They make the YZs they want to, then swap stuff around and make a bunch of YZ250Fs, R1s, Zuma scooters, or whatever else also uses that same production line.  So currently, if they were to make more YZ smokers, they are making LESS of something else they would rather sell.

The Royal Enfield is a "copy" in the same sense that a (God, I hate to say this) a 2020 H-D Low Rider is a "copy" of a 1990 H-D Low Rider.  The look almost identical, but everything is updated, modernized, etc... underneath that old, geriatric looking facade.  That is NOT the case with a YZ125/250.

You made me somewhat compliment Hardley-Ableson.  You are the :devil:.

Agreed. They could probably cut out dirtbikes entirely and not miss it all that much.

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1 minute ago, KTMRider4Life said:

I had a buddy buy a Royal Enfield and while some stuff is updated like say the electronic ignition it’s still an ancient bike and rides like one. It’s very low on power, it struggled with cooling in the Central Valley of Ca when he would have to to grades even at highway speed, or trying to maintain highway speed I should say. The suspension was very poor, etc. 

 

just like a YZ rides like an old bike.  The point is because of their design they can’t sell many, and so they don’t make many. As you pointed out their margin is likely very high so why wouldn’t they make a shit ton of them?  The answer is they wouldn’t sell, that’s why. 

Yes you are right. They wouldn't sell and the market projections for a new design likely aren't large enough either to sustain the effort for them.

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Maybe he should just break the mold and start riding a the 4t line in the WR or FX optimized for hard enduro.....just sayin' 🙂

Would love to see a 4t that is more focused for that type of riding, if Honda can make a 4t trials bike that is ridden by the best rider in the world, there is no reason we can't have a 4t bike ridden at the top level in hard enduro by a guy like Pol.

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13 hours ago, eastreich said:

Pol has pretty much carte blanche to do whatever he wants.  He has Yamaha support, but it is his "own" team and he gets to throw aftermarket parts at the YZ that a regular Yamaha team would NEVER get approval for. 

Pol got this gig due to his T7 riding videos (which are, frankly, amazing) not due to his racing credentials (which are also, frankly, amazing).

People are going to read into all this that Pol is developing an e-start YZ250 for the factory, and probably a 300 down the road (he says if needs to punch it out he will) but that isn't the case.  Yamaha is paying him to be an ambassador for the T7, not develop a new YZ300Xe.  The racing events are just a "side gig" to the main purpose of promoting the T7.

But, cue the blue love coming in for an e-start YZ (which is never getting made in Japan).  There will be fully electric YZE motocrossers for sale in Yamaha dealerships before there will be a factory built electric start 2 stroke motocross/cross country bike in those same locations.

If they only wanted him as a T7 ambassador they'd hire him just for that. He was never a factory rider for Husqvarna so he was free to ride any bike he wanted. So to say that's all they're interested in him for doesn't make a lot of sense. Why waste the money if they don't care about selling more YZs? Why did he say Yamaha is interested in the discipline? It's not going to sell more T7s. Are they just throwing away money for no reason?

Even if the YZs were selling as well as you claimed, doesn't mean they can't sell more or they won't try to. If they're interested in the discipline and they're not dumb enough to think the yz will be competitive (in sales) as is then they'll spend the money to update it.

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I'm about as Blue as anyone can get, and even I don't think Yamaha will update the two stroke lineup. I most certainly can be wrong, as I didn't see the 125x or the 250x models being produced either, but that was incredibly easy for Yamaha to follow what plenty of owners were already doing to their bikes.

Now E-Bikes? I can see Yamaha going all in on that.

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I always wondered why Yamaha just didn't use the F chassis for the two strokes? This way it would be less tooling, parts would cross models, suspension, plastics etc. Just have to make minor adjustments to the chassis for the engine. This way the 2 strokes would keep up with technology with minimal cost and it would help Yamaha reduce production cost as well..

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2 minutes ago, Tepco said:

I always wondered why Yamaha just didn't use the F chassis for the two strokes? This way it would be less tooling, parts would cross models, suspension, plastics etc. Just have to make minor adjustments to the chassis for the engine. This way the 2 strokes would keep up with technology with minimal cost and it would help Yamaha reduce production cost as well..

The answer is well known to anyone that has done a chassis swap between 2s & 4t.

It doesn’t work.

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58 minutes ago, MANIAC998 said:

The answer is well known to anyone that has done a chassis swap between 2s & 4t.

It doesn’t work.

I've never done one but you would imagine the factory could make the minor changes needed to make it work. 

I thought service Honda was doing a good job but I've never ridden one.

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13 hours ago, MANIAC998 said:

I'm about as Blue as anyone can get, and even I don't think Yamaha will update the two stroke lineup. I most certainly can be wrong, as I didn't see the 125x or the 250x models being produced either, but that was incredibly easy for Yamaha to follow what plenty of owners were already doing to their bikes.

Now E-Bikes? I can see Yamaha going all in on that.

I think had they planned to update the bike they'd have done it before releasing those models.

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On 1/8/2021 at 1:39 PM, Kinger317 said:

How many 250 two-strokes does Yamaha sell each year in the US? world wide? I don't know, just curious what peoples best estimates are.

 

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So in his Instagram post down in the comments Pol says his two stroke has E start. I’m assuming he will be using a panthera kit but anybody know actual details? 

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On 1/10/2021 at 2:47 AM, Tepco said:

I always wondered why Yamaha just didn't use the F chassis for the two strokes? This way it would be less tooling, parts would cross models, suspension, plastics etc. Just have to make minor adjustments to the chassis for the engine. This way the 2 strokes would keep up with technology with minimal cost and it would help Yamaha reduce production cost as well..

Naive in the extreme.

Far from 'minor adjustments' required.

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5 hours ago, Momus said:

Naive in the extreme.

Really? If you can buy a kit to put a 2t in a 4t at your house. I would imagine some frame mount changes and air box boot change. And to make it perfect, fork and shock re valve,  I would certainly hope that would be "minor adjustments" for a factory..

Remember this is already done by private companies pretty regularly with good success.

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9 hours ago, pre-mixed said:

So in his Instagram post down in the comments Pol says his two stroke has E start. I’m assuming he will be using a panthera kit but anybody know actual details? 

You must have missed the first page of this thread.

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