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Restoring a rusted Suzuki TS250 engine - Bearing question


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Hey, Im rebuilding a really neglected old 72 TS250 engine and have it completely apart. I have all new bearings to install except the gear shift select drum bearing which is a 12x18x15 needle bearing I dont have. The old one is completely rusted out. I do have a tin-bronze sintered bushing that is the correct size. Would this work in place of the needle bearing that the shift drum rides in? I doubt it would wear being a hard bronze bushing submerged in oil, no?

Ignore the dirty engine internals in the pic - All has been disassembled and cleaned now, and any rusted parts are being replaced if they are unusable.

roller bearing.png

bearing.png

bushing.png

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A bushing can handle the load but not the RPM. If all you have is a bushing, it should be a bronze, not sintered, with an oil groove within. The advice above to contact a bearing house is sound. Be surprised how an interchange book can be used. As long as the OD and ID is correct, if the bearing is a bit shorter or longer it won't matter depending on application. Too, the bearing should be the same internal configuration and not full complement (needles touching one another).

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Posted (edited)

The thing is this part does not really have an "rpm", this is just the shift drum that turns a tiny bit whenever the rider shifts gears. In this case is the bushing fine? The other end of the shift drum literally is riding right against the aluminum engine case just lubed by oil by factory design and has no issues.

 

Part 22 on this diagram:

Screenshot_20210615-171136_Firefox.jpg

Edited by user9273
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Then why the needle bearing if loading is a non-issue? I'm inclined to follow OEM parts and specs if possible. If on this side of the drum there is more weight than on the other side against the aluminum housing, I think the factory knows something. If you're prepared to inspect the wear of the sintered bushing or can otherwise detect wear, that'll be your answer. No wear'll mean the bushing is fine. I'd still try to find a proper needle bearing. A lot will depend on the bearing/shaft remaining in alignment with minimum wear. 

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Bushing has a lot more load carrying capacity than a needle bearing and actually there is very little load on a shift drum. Needle bearing enables slightly smoother shifting action and may not be even noticeable. Would have no issue whatsoever replacing bearing with bushing in that application if suitable bearing unavailable.  

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17 hours ago, user9273 said:

Hey, Im rebuilding a really neglected old 72 TS250 engine and have it completely apart. I have all new bearings to install except the gear shift select drum bearing which is a 12x18x15 needle bearing I dont have. The old one is completely rusted out. I do have a tin-bronze sintered bushing that is the correct size. Would this work in place of the needle bearing that the shift drum rides in? I doubt it would wear being a hard bronze bushing submerged in oil, no?

Ignore the dirty engine internals in the pic - All has been disassembled and cleaned now, and any rusted parts are being replaced if they are unusable.

roller bearing.png

bearing.png

bushing.png

The Bush will be fine in there. 

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Posted (edited)

Alright I'll put the bushing - thx for saving me a month in shipping time

Edit: Some pics of cleaned case with some new bearings

Damaged aluminum will be professionally repaired - Engine was given to me in extremely poor condition, fully seized and rusted for over a decade. Transmission was left full of water. Looks like it will actually run again.

 

engine1.png

engine2.png

engne3.png

Edited by user9273
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It would probably work. Some engines don't even have bearing on one side of drum. Just aluminum and they work. Looks like same bearing I found on eBay for old ks125 engine I did. Punch in bearing number see what comes up

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Yeah my engine doesn't have a bearing on the other side. I checked and the engine does allow for a longer bearing so a 12*18*16 needle bearing will fit fine, but would delay the rebuild if I ordered it.

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The bushing will be fine. Years ago when I resided in commifornia I bought a 72' T500 Titan from an old fella that was in great shape. He tore the motor all apart to rebuild it and there it all sat scattered around his barn floor. We found all the parts and the roller still in original paint and unmolested seat and tins. I took it home and dumped all the engine parts in my parts washer. It took me a week to clean everything. Then I had to order 2 different seal and gasket kits to get the motor together. Even used the same piston and rings after making sure they were still within spec. The motor went together just like the banshee motors. It did fire up and run good and was a blast to ride. Then some old man saw me riding it and made an offer I couldn't refuse. 

Ya might even be able to soak that bearing in some PB blaster or Kroil for a few days. 

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Posted (edited)

I tried to see if the bearings were salvageable but only one bearing was good, the bearing with the Suzuki CCI shield thing, seems like water couldn't reach it and it's perfect condition. All the other bearings were badly pitted and disintegrating into soil when touched (the old screws that held the bearing retainers also disintegrated into dust. Surprisingly the transmission and crank is fine, but I needed to replace the shift drum stopper with a NOS part due to rust.

For seals this time I ordered them all online from a seals store instead of getting a kit, cost me 20 cents per seal for good double lipped seals that fit perfect.

20210617_112402.jpg

Edited by user9273
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