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What's with all the spooge


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How hard do you ride it? If you trail ride instead of track riding, the oil will buildup in the expansion chamber and sometimes in the bottom of the motor. Then when you rev it up from time to time it will come flooding out. 

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29 minutes ago, Randy300XC said:

How hard do you ride it? If you trail ride instead of track riding, the oil will buildup in the expansion chamber and sometimes in the bottom of the motor. Then when you rev it up from time to time it will come flooding out. 

Just trail riding. That makes sense tho.

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1 hour ago, Bud Hoal said:

Just trail riding. That makes sense tho.

This makes no sense. Lots of European two strokes ridden on trails and no track along with the YZ250X etc. Oil builds up due to jetting that is too rich, a carburetor float that is not adjusted correctly, or poor mechanical condition of the bike.

If you think that you may have a crank seal leak, measure the oil in and measure the oil out after a long ride or two. Burnt transmission oil in a two stroke results in smoke that will burn your eyes horribly unlike plain old two smoke oil.

My last two stroke (Beta 300) ran a mix anywhere from 32:1 - 60:1. I used a JD jet kit and adjusted my float. Spooge did not exist on that bike or the old 05 300EXC KTM that preceded it. No tracks ridden. No competitions entered. Recreational trails only.

Here's the KTM using Maxima 927 at 50:1. Little dust ring only.

3D4E93FE-4EDF-4A7B-B842-2016D76E5EF4.thumb.jpeg.84bf7867135bcad74a29c2b5d9a1c638.jpeg

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45 minutes ago, Gay-Bear-OZ said:

This makes no sense. Lots of European two strokes ridden on trails and no track along with the YZ250X etc. Oil builds up due to jetting that is too rich, a carburetor float that is not adjusted correctly, or poor mechanical condition of the bike.

If you think that you may have a crank seal leak, measure the oil in and measure the oil out after a long ride or two. Burnt transmission oil in a two stroke results in smoke that will burn your eyes horribly unlike plain old two smoke oil.

My last two stroke (Beta 300) ran a mix anywhere from 32:1 - 60:1. I used a JD jet kit and adjusted my float. Spooge did not exist on that bike or the old 05 300EXC KTM that preceded it. No tracks ridden. No competitions entered. Recreational trails only.

Here's the KTM using Maxima 927 at 50:1. Little dust ring only.

3D4E93FE-4EDF-4A7B-B842-2016D76E5EF4.thumb.jpeg.84bf7867135bcad74a29c2b5d9a1c638.jpeg

I agree. Most of my posts are written to get the person time to think these things through rather than spell out the whole solution. 

And correct, the European bikes that are designed for trail usually suggest a fuel/oil ratio with less oil than a track bike. What they don’t suggest is how to adjust for different riding style. That’s where things go wrong. 

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1 hour ago, Gay-Bear-OZ said:

This makes no sense. Lots of European two strokes ridden on trails and no track along with the YZ250X etc. Oil builds up due to jetting that is too rich, a carburetor float that is not adjusted correctly, or poor mechanical condition of the bike.

If you think that you may have a crank seal leak, measure the oil in and measure the oil out after a long ride or two. Burnt transmission oil in a two stroke results in smoke that will burn your eyes horribly unlike plain old two smoke oil.

My last two stroke (Beta 300) ran a mix anywhere from 32:1 - 60:1. I used a JD jet kit and adjusted my float. Spooge did not exist on that bike or the old 05 300EXC KTM that preceded it. No tracks ridden. No competitions entered. Recreational trails only.

Here's the KTM using Maxima 927 at 50:1. Little dust ring only.

3D4E93FE-4EDF-4A7B-B842-2016D76E5EF4.thumb.jpeg.84bf7867135bcad74a29c2b5d9a1c638.jpeg

That makes sense too. (I just agree with everbody. It's easier) LOL. But i've ridden with a lot of bikes that don't have spooge dripping out of em. I know exactly how much oil I put into the trans but it's only been one  ride. Maybe a little change of jetting and one more ride then I'll see how it looks and/or drain the oil and measure how much comes out. Maybe go to 40:1? 

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8 minutes ago, Bud Hoal said:

That makes sense too. (I just agree with everbody. It's easier) LOL. But i've ridden with a lot of bikes that don't have spooge dripping out of em. I know exactly how much oil I put into the trans but it's only been one  ride. Maybe a little change of jetting and one more ride then I'll see how it looks and/or drain the oil and measure how much comes out. Maybe go to 40:1? 

Ratio doesn’t affect spooge much. 50:1 is 2% oil. 40:1 is 2.5% oil. 32:1 is 3% oil. 24:1 is 4% oil so the difference in overall oil volume between the “extremes” is only 2%. The rest is gasoline. 

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  • 2 weeks later...
On 8/27/2021 at 12:23 PM, Gay-Bear-OZ said:

 

If you think that you may have a crank seal leak, measure the oil in and measure the oil out after a long ride or two. Burnt transmission oil in a two stroke results in smoke that will burn your eyes horribly unlike plain old two smoke oil.

 

So, since my last post, I changed the MJ to a 340 and did 70 miles on 2 different rides. I just warmed her up and drained the trans. 750ml went in (I have one of those funnels that measures the amount) and I got 750ml out. So, that's good. I did change the jets to a 330m and a 40 pj. I'm gonna do some riding next weekend so I'll see how it looks then. If it doesn't go away or at least get better, I will look into that carb fix. 

This pic was after the last ride that I did. Also, at the end of that ride, I did a WOT chop. The plug was a little dark, so maybe the 330 will be perfect. 

Edited by Bud Hoal
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Just now, Bud Hoal said:

So, since my last post, I changed the MJ to a 340 and did 70 miles on 2 different rides. I just warmed her up and drained the trans. 750ml went in (I have one of those funnels that measures the amount) and I got 750ml out. So, that's good. I did change the jets to a 300m and a 40 pj. I'm gonna do some riding next weekend so I'll see how it looks then. If it doesn't go away or at least get better, I will look into that carb fix. 

This pic was after the last ride that I did. Also, at the end of that ride, I did a WOT chop. The plug was a little dark, so maybe the 330 will be perfect. 

20210907_084248.thumb.jpg.cef66ddc83b619c6b759a0e5f6c02d59.jpg

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5 minutes ago, Bud Hoal said:

This pic was after the last ride that I did.

You'd need to repack the muffler between each jetting change and also do an expansion chamber gasoline rinse out to eliminate former spooge build up counting against your new settings.

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8 minutes ago, Gay-Bear-OZ said:

You'd need to repack the muffler between each jetting change and also do an expansion chamber gasoline rinse out to eliminate former spooge build up counting against your new settings.

Ehh. I aint doin that. That's a brand new muff with maybe 5-6 hours on it. I'm going on a 3 day trail work/ riding trip next weekend so I'll assess it after that. But, I'm really not wanting to tear apart a new muffler. :thinking:

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7 minutes ago, Bud Hoal said:

Ehh. I aint doin that. That's a brand new muff with maybe 5-6 hours on it. I'm going on a 3 day trail work/ riding trip next weekend so I'll assess it after that. But, I'm really not wanting to tear apart a new muffler. :thinking:

hard to make spooge comparisons then

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Outside of a mechanical problem, spooge is 100% jetting related nothing to do with minor premix ratio changes.

The majority of people who think they can jet a 2 stroke can't. 2 strokes want to run leaner than most realize and no they don't spontaneously explode if you go just a little too lean. There are plenty of warning signs when you are too lean and no damage is occuring, just have to be paying attention. Also most try to jet their bike before it is fully up to temp which makes it run too rich once fully warm. The warmer the engine the leaner the needed jetting settings. Until it is fully up to temp it will feel a little lean when you turn off the choke when jetted right.

 

Btw, ridden only yz250's since 2007, always trail ride and run 32:1 with a variety of premixes over the years. Never had a lean seizure, and my spark arrestor is always dry on the outside......unless I have been lazy on adjusting my jetting for temp and elevation changes.

Edited by ballbags
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On 8/27/2021 at 12:46 PM, Gay-Bear-OZ said:

Ratio doesn’t affect spooge much. 50:1 is 2% oil. 40:1 is 2.5% oil. 32:1 is 3% oil. 24:1 is 4% oil so the difference in overall oil volume between the “extremes” is only 2%. The rest is gasoline. 

Not to be pedantic and annoying but the difference is not 2% in oil volume. It is correct that it is only an increase of 2% of the TOTAL liquid volume of the fuel oil mix. 

50:1 is 2% oil volume

40:1 is 2.5% oil volume, an INCREASE in OIL ONLY of 25% over 50:1. 

32:1 is 3% oil volume, and INCREASE in OIL ONLY of 50% over 50:1

24:1 is roughly 4% oil volume  an INCREASE in OIL ONLY of 100% over 50:1

 

Again not trying to be annoying, but there are massive differences in the oil volumes at the mix ratios mentioned above

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1 hour ago, Dirtymutt9 said:

It is correct that it is only an increase of 2% of the TOTAL liquid volume of the fuel oil mix. 

Correct, should have said total liquid volume.

1 hour ago, Dirtymutt9 said:

Again not trying to be annoying, but there are massive differences in the oil volumes at the mix ratios mentioned above

 I don't see 2.5 ounces (of oil in a gallon of gasoline) as being "massive" between 50:1 and 24:1 ratios. If you compared 24:1 and 6:1 ratios, those differences seem massive to me.

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On 8/27/2021 at 1:23 PM, Gay-Bear-OZ said:

This makes no sense. Lots of European two strokes ridden on trails and no track along with the YZ250X etc. Oil builds up due to jetting that is too rich, a carburetor float that is not adjusted correctly, or poor mechanical condition of the bike.

If you think that you may have a crank seal leak, measure the oil in and measure the oil out after a long ride or two. Burnt transmission oil in a two stroke results in smoke that will burn your eyes horribly unlike plain old two smoke oil.

My last two stroke (Beta 300) ran a mix anywhere from 32:1 - 60:1. I used a JD jet kit and adjusted my float. Spooge did not exist on that bike or the old 05 300EXC KTM that preceded it. No tracks ridden. No competitions entered. Recreational trails only.

Here's the KTM using Maxima 927 at 50:1. Little dust ring only.

3D4E93FE-4EDF-4A7B-B842-2016D76E5EF4.thumb.jpeg.84bf7867135bcad74a29c2b5d9a1c638.jpeg

Is there enough room on that little Gilligans island to ride on? Arent you skeered that you might ride off a cliff and into the drink? Do you have floaties just in case?

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I’ve seen it mentioned by someone before, either this thread or a different one on the subject of spooge, but I believe it’s all down to carburation. I have a 2021 YZ250X since new (80h TT now) that the majority of the time is used for trails and slow enduro, general mucking about, eg trying to learn how to ride obstacles, or sometimes just taking my kids for a ride around the area where I live. It does get a good blast on proper desert rides in the dunes sometimes, but like I mentioned, more than half of my riding is trail and/or slow. No spooge.

I have gone leaner on my jetting because it’s hot and very often humid here (low relative air density, typically 90-95% RAD. 90 in the summer and 93-95% RAD in winter, except cold mornings where it’s more inline with standard sea level).

My current setting is: Main: #178, Power: #40 (Did the popular mod I learned about here), Needle (standard N3EW) middle clip/groove 3, Pilot: #45.

Works a treat (for where I am).

I will probably raise the needle one position (richer) when the weather cools for our “winter” and no doubt will need to richen the pilot a size as well. For the main, I tried going down to #175 last winter, and the plug seemed fine after desert rides, but I went back to #178 because I was a chicken and I wanted to play it safe, especially as there can be a big temperature variation from morning to midday, eg 10C ambient when we set off and 20-25C by the time we return.

Klotz Super Techniplate 32:1 btw. I ran BeNol when I first got the bike. Very minor spooge but the main issue was carbon build up. It stuck my rings at 35h and the carbon build up on the piston crown was ridiculous.

77CF9C59-9B04-48AC-B840-74B8D09768BD.jpeg

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On 8/26/2021 at 3:10 PM, Bud Hoal said:

This just seems excessive. Like I said I have a 94 wr250 that I recently acquired. It runs freaking awesome. It starts in 2 kicks dead cold. It has a good bit more power than the 90. I don't even know what jets are in it. I haven't had the carb off. But, also the 90 seems to have a top speed of about 50-55mph with 14/50 sprockets. The 90 is hard to start when it hasn't been started in days or weeks. Once it's warm it starts in one kick everytime. 

It's a 2-stroke.   They burn oil, and they pass unburned oil (and fuel) through the engine.  Don't expect it to be dry like a 4-stroke.  That oil isn't hurting a thing.  If it runs right, starts easy, doesn't foul plugs, then it's doing exactly what it's supposed to do. An oily exhaust is not an indication of a problem.

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