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ICS STEERING DAMPERS STABILIZERS RIPPED MY DAMPER OFF.

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This is a BIG heads-up to anyone considering buying an ICS damper from SUDCO or ICS or testing for them: My personal experience with them is that when compared to the service I get from Scott's & GPR dampers/stabilizers ICS products & services SUCK & the staff of ICS cannot be trusted to honor their word. What was a supposedly new damper that looked new has now according to them evolved into a used "prototype" that failed because it had been used in races. It leaked & didn't work right. I finally found their website, a barely functioning few pages, & sent emails to them that they ignored. After 2-3 weeks I phoned & left messages that were also ignored for weeks until I got "lucky" & somebody actually picked up the phone, apparently to dial out. I spoke to Malcolm who said it was some form of prototype [even though he hadn't seen it at that point] & he said he would exchange it for a new model that week. I returned it to them ASAP. That was 3+ months ago & just about every other week I have called to ask where it is & got one BS story after another about where it was & what the delay was & each time they promised that I would see the replacement within a week & never have. Lately Malcolm claims he didn't promise to replace it with the latest model at all but with an earlier discontinued model instead, but of course he hasn't managed to get one of those to me either. They also now say they have been too busy to service my original damper or build a replacement even though according to my sources they have been actively managing to service, build, & ship dampers to many other people. They now refuse to send me a damper & are back to ignoring my phone & email messages. That means they are forcing me to file reports/charges with various authorities to try & recover my loss. All I can say is that if you are thinking about buying any ICS product from SUDCO or ICS take into consideration what I have said above & combine that with the fact that at least some of their products have problems with racing loads, & if you ship anything to ICS for service you might be put through what I am right now.

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Thanks for the heads up , hope you get your money back! I have never heard about these stabilizers, where did you hear about them?

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I just had a long conversation with Malcolm of ICS & he told me that they were preparing a response to refute the facts I am posting here as we spoke on the phone, so grab your Popcorn & get comfy kids if you think you will actually see it any time soon. I don't suggest holding your breath.

I first heard of ICS dampers through a Sudco thing sent to my company a while back. ICS seemed to be a lower cost GRP like alternative & they seemed open to new dealers so I contacted them about the same time I picked up this damper in a project deal. This is my first hands-on experience with ICS. The unit was installed/tested on a bike we bought/built. When ICS failed to get a damper back to us as promised [numerous times] I was forced to "borrow" a GPR from one of our personal bikes to get that project wrapped up. My kid is pissed because ICS forced him to be without a damper for so long & I'm pissed because I had to buy a $$$ new damper to get him riding again & happy. Anyone with kids knows exactly how that went down.

Malcolm of ICS got tipped off to this posting & just phoned me & about all I got for my time is the knowledge that their phones do indeed dial out. He said their email is still inoperative & has been for over 3 months, so we'll continue to get generic form email responses to email to ICS customer service & sales that says, "...due to the tremendous volume [yeah, sure, ED.] of e-mails we receive we have placed your message into our automated e-mail dispatcher; it may be some time before you receive a reply to your message."... For the record I never got any reply from them other than those bogus emails & I've emailed all their listed addresses for 3+ months. I have also never gotten a phone reply to any message I left. Malcolm was once again irritating, unapologetic, & offensive. He now refuses to honor his promises & our debate boiled down to a complete refusal to honor his repeated promises to ship me a new damper. He didn't give me a believable or justifiable reason for his refusal. He doesn't deny making those promises & offered no apology or compensation for stalling me, failing to honor his promises, or for obviously stringing us along with a series of lame & untrue excuses. The most stunning part is ICS now says our "new" damper has been sitting there all this time but they "just didn't ship it", I have to assume only to get me angry. If so it worked. I promised to delete this post & not pursue legal recourse only if they ship me a good damper like they promised, but they refused & were insulting. He twisted facts & tried to make it my fault that they have flawed products, bad service, & welch on deals. Malcolm capped the conversation by saying the only way I will get my damper from them is by Police/Court order. Oh yeah, another BIG HEADS UP to my magazine & product tester friends: Malcolm claimed that he "gave" [his words] this damper to a racer for testing & although I was told it was new, it looked brand new, & Malcolm previously indicated it was at least nearly new he now claims it failed because that racer used it. He also implied that the leaking oil, bubbles that squirted at random through the stroke, & non-functioning adjustment knob were "normal". The Malcolmism that most peaked my interest was that he was proud of the fact that he supposedly filed charges against that racer he originally "gave" the damper when he failed to return it to ICS & threatened legal actions for honestly posting my experience with ICS here... I don't know about you but getting a guy tossed in jail that just risked his life helping you sort the bugs out of a flawed & defective product you were currently selling to the public seems crappy to me & threatening legal action on anyone that dares to honestly post their experiences with ICS seems like rotten business to me.

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I'd contact the Attorney General in the state they are headquartered in and let them deal with it....thanks for the heads-up, I'll take ICS off my list of potetial suppliers!

Good luck, let us know what ends up happening. :cry:

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So you got a bike with a new looking ICS damper on it, the damper needed work, SUDCO promised to fixed it (I assume for a reasonable fee) and now they are keeping the damper (your property) and leaving you with nothing but lies and grief.

I would also take them to court. They stole your property. And I'd tell the story to a couple of SportsBike mags as well.

Who the hell is Malcolm? Sounds like he is a contemptable prig.

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how did you get the damper and how much did you pay for it? Sounds like some cheap import crap...just buy a scotts

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Looks like ICS is about as fast at posting as they are at getting back to their customers. In 3 months this post will probably rise from the grave with a page-long excuse, then dissapear back into obscurity for another 3. :cry:

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I use/buy/sell Scotts & GRP mostly due to their quality & outstanding service but I personally prefer & use the Scotts damper on my off road bikes. In this case the ICS was part of a quick build/fix/sell project so I thought I would give their products/services a try since we were considering picking up the line & I didn't really care what damper ended up on the project since we originally didn't plan on keeping the project around much longer than a week.

I think I explained in enough detail above how I found & ended up with an ICS damper in my last post. Everyone I've spoken to at ICS sounds Cockney to me I can only assume ICS makes them here only because Malcolms excuse most of that 3 months was that they were waiting on getting the parts anodized. That excuse didn't fly with me since day one because I'm fairly close to them, get parts anodized regularly, & have rarely had more than a week turnaround even with high volume or large pieces.

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So you got a bike with a new looking ICS damper on it, the damper needed work, SUDCO promised to fixed it (I assume for a reasonable fee) and now they are keeping the damper (your property) and leaving you with nothing but lies and grief.

I bought a lot for a project including 1.5 bikes & a bunch of parts that we built/rebuilt into a good bike for a client/friend. At the time the ICS damper was in the original box & I was told it was new. It fit the bike a mount we had with slight mods. When it was clear that it was not working right & leaking I contacted SUDCO [the ICS distributer] who referred me to the ICS "webpages" & once I finally reached them I discussed being an ICS dealer since they seemed to basically be a less expensive GPR. Due to their loophole filled Warranty I expected to pay for the damper service but to my surprise Malcolm said if I shipped him the damper I had he'd replace it with a new one for free that week. I thought he did that due to my dealer inquiry.

Malcolm's claim is that it was a "prototype" unit & he's now accusing me of recieving stolen property. I asked him to give me proof of his claims & he has refused. According to CA law I have the absolute right to see his evidience long before any court date & since he has stated in the presence of witnesses that he has this evidence he can't withold it later on. If he fails or refuses to the court will slap him with sanctions & $1000 seems to be a popular amount for those lately. I'm fairly sure he's BSing his way through this & my feeling is that the documents he has are most likely not applicable to this instant case or not legally correct or binding, & I know judges hammer anyone that wastes their time with a smoke & mirrors case. If Malcolm continues to refuse to honor his promise I will consider the $20 it will cost me to file a theft report & suit to recover losses/damages $20 well spent since it will cost him a $300+ an hour for his attorney to respond repeatedly to this matter & Malcolm is risking jail time.

"They stole your property. And I'd tell the story to a couple of SportsBike mags as well."

I have bike tester frineds as well as editor & writher friends & they are well aware of ICS & this fiasco, as are most of my business contacts & ICSs competition. Feel free to post a link to this on any Sport bike forums you know of.

"Who the hell is Malcolm? Sounds like he is a contemptable prig."

Frankly I don't care who Malcolm is & I'd guess you know him or are a countrymen of his since by using that expression. His behavior toward me is offensive, unacceptable, unprofessional & dishonorable. My guess is that he must own a chunk of ICS because no owner in their right mind would tolerate any employee that is costing them 100+ potential product sales every day & that is exactly what Malcolm's treatment of me is costing them right now if you check the thread hit count.

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Good point on that container timing. If anyone out there has a physical address for ICS drop me a PM, all I've got is a P.O. Box on them & I'm thinking that my friend of a friend that is an MX rag writer might like to swing by & check out ICS since he lives in the city ICS is in.

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Thanks, that is one of the things on the agenda but I think that either Malcolm or the owners of ICS will pull their heads out & realize that ripping me off is costing their company 100+ potential buyers a day just on this forum, & we are prolific forum users & typists.

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I'd contact the Attorney General in the state they are headquartered in and let them deal with it....thanks for the heads-up, I'll take ICS off my list of potetial suppliers!

Good luck, let us know what ends up happening. :lol:

Let these guys know. It is kinda their job if you used email or internet. They can get things done. :cry: :cry:

www.FBI.gov

Follow the links to online fraud divisions, or go direct to here:

http://www.ic3.gov/

There was a peckerhead on eBay selling bogus DRZ400 parts and I reported him.

I started off being Mr. Nice And Paient, but he just told me to bite it and "let the buyer beware"; 2 weeks later there was NO TRACE of the guy's business. Like he never existed. :cry::lol:

:cry: :cry:

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"Who the hell is Malcolm? Sounds like he is a contemptable prig."

Frankly I don't care who Malcolm is & I'd guess you know him or are a countrymen of his since by using that expression.

Actually I'm just a southern boy from VA (moved to AZ) that tossed out a little used word which seemed to be appropriate in this case. Must be coming from the wee bit of Irish in me. :cry:

I hope you get to squeeze Malcolm's nuts like he's a King's boy. :cry: How's that for an expression, had to do a little digging to find that one. :cry:

:cry:

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First off I am absolutely not refuting anything you have to say about your experiences with ICS. I have also had some dealing with them and want to let you know about my perspective.

I contacted ICS as I was interested in sourcing a damper for an Enduro setup we (Rooster Performance) are working on (Flexxbars/hand guards/damper) I have tried Scotts, RTT, GPR and WER. For me the Scotts is the best functioning with the RTT a close second. I tried to work with GPR and Scotts but they were not flexible to deal with and basically did not care. I’m sure this is because they already have a great dealer network and are big enough they don’t need to deal with me. Fine. I called ICS and Malcolm answered the phone. I spoke with him to great length about their product and possible dealings with them. I had a great conversation with him and found him easy to talk with and start some dialog about possible future dealings. He agreed to send me a damper to evaluate to make sure it was something I even wanted to go forward with. I received the loner damper free of charge with no shipping costs as discussed. I have tested it on my 04 TE450 test bike and found it to be unobtrusive and work great. I do not notice it on the trail like I do a GPR (feels like it is stuck in molasses) where I feel I am fighting it in the tight stuff. I need to further evaluate it but the unit I got seems to work every bit as good as my favorite, the Scotts. I had several others in my ride group test it and all were positive reviews from riders who have used dampers in the past and understand the function of a damper. I will cautiously go forward with testing and possible partnership. I appreciate the information and heads up. I have let him know about your issues and hopefully they can be resolved peacefully.

Thanks,

Kelly

Rooster Performance

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I think yer a Helluva guy, Kelly. :cry: :cry:

Not sure how to take that. Are you being cynical or ??? (never sure how to read you) All I’m doing is letting people know my dealings with them. I’ll let you know if I find anything else out.

:cry:

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Hmmm, that reply by Malcolm is now way late & I notice their customer service email is now officially inoperative.

Kelly, it's strange but I've have an almost identical experience & opinion, with the exception of ICS & Scott's. Ohlins/Scott's is my personal choice of dampers & have always been very fast & no-hassle with any damper that required service. GPR & Scott's do have well established & fairly closed dealer networks mainly because they've been at it forever & that is why I tried to give ICS a shot at the market too.

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One month update. Still nothing from that wanker at ICS I see. I've got to visit with my attorney tomorrow. Might as well make it a package deal I guess.

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