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Hot Cam Stage 1 vs 04 Stock

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What are the specs on lift and duration of int and exh on both cams?

Is the stage 1 milder then stock?

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stage one hot cam is milder........don't have stock specs, but i compared them once, and it is def. milder than stock. sorry i couldn't locate the paper i had the stats written down on. i'll keep looking, but in the meantime, i'm sure someone else will get them for you

stage 1 hot cam

intake:

lift 9.6mm

lobe center 106.5

duration at 1mm 237.5

exhaust

lift 8.7mm

lobe center 103.5

duration 268.5

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I almost bought a Stage 1 for my 04 450 thinking that opposite. Now im happy that i didnt.

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The Stage 1 Hot Cam will increase torque/power in the lower rpm range, and slightly reduce it in the upper range. A different cam can increase and/or relocate power at different parts of the powerband, much like an aftermarket pipe will. The Stage 1 increases low end power and the Stage 2 increases at higher revs. There is sometimes a trade off in performance at the opposite end of the rpm range. It depends on your needs and riding style as to what kind of cam to use. The terms "hot" or "mild" with relation to cams are purely subjective references.

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im looking for something not so radical to increase the life of my top end.

I also dont use the upper rpms as I lug the bike so more lower end would be perfect..

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that kinda seems odd to me. i mean the mags. i have read all LOVED the stage 1 and rated it a 10 or 9.5. you all seemed not that crazy about it. ??

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Proper maintenance will extend the life of your top end. Frequent oil changes and valve adjustments are mandatory. Timley replacement of valves and springs is just part of owning a 4 stroke. A different cam won't effect how long these parts will last.

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A different cam won't effect how long these parts will last.

Ummm...

Yes it will.

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Proper maintenance will extend the life of your top end. Frequent oil changes and valve adjustments are mandatory. Timley replacement of valves and springs is just part of owning a 4 stroke. A different cam won't effect how long these parts will last.

are you serious? A cams profile is DIRECTLY related to valve train components!

Also seeing that i use my bike as a race bike it is maintained phenominally! I dont need the boohoo oil change air filter change jibberish...IT GETS DONE!

If youve ever built an engine you KNOW that with big cams come big springs!

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A different cam won't effect how long these parts will last.

are you serious? A cams profile is DIRECTLY related to valve train components!

If youve ever built an engine you KNOW that with big cams come big springs!

OH YEAH...I know that first hand. It's part of the price of admission to have a real hot rod 4-stroke dirt bike. I will be checking my souped up springs and cam every 6-8 hours, and replace them as needed BEFORE I see any breakage.

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i'd like to increase the life of anything on my bike that i can. top end work isn't something that i really like doing, so if i could make it easier on myself it would be nice. so do you guys think that if i bought a stage one cam it would really increase top end life that much? and for the record i like low end power more than over rev, so i think i'd like it for that reason.

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Obviously I know the cam is directly related to the valve train components. The question asked was related to reliability and the "Hot Cam" stage one. The difference in the timing of a cam or its duration does not necessarily accelerate the wear of the drive train. My point was that the difference in specs of the stock cam and these "Hot Cams" are not drastic enough to adversely effect the reliability of this motor if set up and maintained properly. Hot Cams specs the stock springs for their cams, which proves my point. These top ends require religious maintanence regardless of what cam is in them. Surely if you've ever built a engine you would know that.

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stop trying to CYA 😢...if its a midler cam, the springs wont fatigue as fast and the valves wont hit the seats as hard and that will increase the life of my cylinder head and valve springs...

Rapture is a prime example of what a change in cam will do to springs...even the slightest change can bring HUGE life changes to the spring/valve/head...

To take a cam that makes the springs live 30 hours and swap it out to a cam(changes in the cam SOUND small to the lamen) that will make the same springs live only 3 hours...now tell me cams dont effect valve train life!

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Most of what this specific cam does is change cam timing and duration, that alone will not wear the valves or spring more than the stock cam. Even a cam with higher lift will often lessen the steepness of the closing ramp to keep the valves from slamming shut harder than usual. I've been running this cam for over 40 hours with the stock springs and the valvetrain is still within spec. It's a miracle!

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The Stage 1 cam is easier on the valve wear issue that is so prevalent on the CRF450s. And it for sure is not milder than the 04 camshaft! It produces nearly the identical peak power as the 04 does but, it has MUCH better throttle response & bottom end power and better midrange.

The camshaft isn't really the culprit behind the wear issue though. It's using ti valves against steel seats. When the valve is set back on the seat in a gentle manner, wear becomes less of an issue than a cam that shoves the valve open and then lets the valve slam shut. That'll wear the CRF valves, fast.

Valve bounce is also an issue with the CRF's previous camshaft profiles. The 04 model CRF changed the opening and closing ramps of the cam enough for it have better valve life but, they're still using steel seats. Stiffer springs would under normal circumstances provide the answer. This isn't the normal circustance though because of the seat and valve material used.

Tony

edit: Here is the dyno chart Stage 1 vs. 04 OE camshaft in an 04 CRF450R.

1016-1.jpg

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Ummm...

Did you supply the wrong graph? That appears to be for the TRX not the CRF450r. I believe they have completely different camshafts. I'm very interested in seeing the stage 1 graph on a 2004 CRF450r. Please post it if you have one.

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My impression of the stage 1 Hot Cam: Very good throttle response, lots more bottom, with a strong mid range pull. It will "rev" just as far as stock, but the "pull" you feel down low noticably disappears as the revs reach their peak. This is a great cam for anything but a wide-open National-style track. That's why flat-trackers and super-a-go-go-a-moto-poto people like the stage 2 better. I am currently running a stage 1 cam with an Athena 488 big bore kit, and Jemco exhaust. My bike hauls butt. The pipe allows the engine to really open up, complimenting my stronger bottom and mid-range. It can wear you out if you're not a smoothe rider though. I've learned to really move with the bike, rather than fight it, and I can say it's not all that bad.

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Nope. That's the correct graph, no question about that. The TRX won't make more than 40HP without more mods than just a cam. The power curves are similar in appearance, just not at the same level. I will get the TRX reference removed from that graph! I didn't know it was on there. Sorry for the confusion.

Tony

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Nope. That's the correct graph, no question about that. The TRX won't make more than 40HP without more mods than just a cam. The power curves are similar in appearance, just not at the same level. I will get the TRX reference removed from that graph! I didn't know it was on there. Sorry for the confusion.

Tony

Can you post the graph for the stage 2 as well? I have one in my bike and really like it.

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The Stage 2 is an AWESOME camshaft in the correctly built engine! It is THE choice of ALL the top CRF engine builders in the AMA Supermoto Series with HRC, TLD, CHM, East Hills, Joker Machine, and the majority of the top privateers. I just got a fax the other day from Terry Varner with a dyno comparison between the Web Cam Misto cam and the Stage 2, HUGE difference at the bottom and midrange advantage for the Stage 2 and about a 1 HP difference at the top with the Misto having more. I wish I had that so I could post that.

Stage 2 vs. OE '04

I couldn't post the pic, javascript: void (0) it said, sorry.

Tony

I forgot to mention that Steve Drew used the Stage 1 at the Del Mar round and loved it. His words were "This thing is an ANIMAL!"

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