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Supermoto again....street use

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I've been looking through old threads about converting to S/M. Guess I'm just looking for some more input. I'm on a budget, aren't we all?? My S/M will be for street use, perhaps the odd track day, but no serious racing. I also want to be able to switch back to dirt setup when needed.

I've priced Excel rims with Talon hubs from Eastcoast. Also got a price for lacing stock hubs to Excel rims. Comes out about $150.00 cheaper. So first question is, is it worth going the extra for the Talon hubs? (I want to be able to use stock speedo if possible when new S/M gear is available, so other hubs are off my list)

I think I would go for a larger front disc and relocation bracket and stock rear disc. Is there anything available better value than the 320 EBC from Eastcoast ($175.00), and stock rear from Ron Ayers $127.00?

Will the stock 400S gearing work with the 17" wheels? I have 14/47 sprockets for dirt (although running 14/44 right now) and hoping to use the 15/44 stock without having to change the chain. Will this work?

So, am I missing anything other than screws/bolts to mount the discs and sprocket? Do the Excel/Talon use the stock axles, or do need new?

All comments welcome. Thanks in advance.

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I don't know any answers to your questions, but thanks for posting them! I have had the same questions and haven't had the time to chase down the answers myself - hopefully some of these S/M freaks can shed some light! :cry:

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Good list of questions.........let me tell you what I know, and others will pick up the rest.

I believe that the stock chain will work for your gearing combo listed, not positive.

I run stock hubs. Aside from the "bling" factor, Talons are not necessary for street use.

Stock axles will work for both.

Assuming that the chain fits, your rear setup is bolt on. Your front, given the larger front rotor, obviously is not. You will have to remove the relocation bracket each time. There is a 280mm rotor and bracket (I think it's EBC) that is also an intermediate option.

I run stock front rotors on both sets of rims. I would suggest going to at least a stainless steel front line. It's ok, I probably will do the 280's on both sets to maintain the easy swap factor.

You may want to consider stainless lines front and rear and the CRF rear master cylinder upgrade.

Good luck and may the force be with you. :cry::cry::cry:

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So first question is, is it worth going the extra for the Talon hubs? (I want to be able to use stock speedo if possible when new S/M gear is available, so other hubs are off my list)
At only $150 more just get the set of Talons IMO. They are awesome hubs and if its only $150 more I would go for it just for the bling factor if nothing else. :cry:

Do yourself a favor and just get the package deal built and ready to run from ECW. Awesome price.... I bought all the pieces for my SM wheels seperate and it ended up costing just as much if not a tad more and I had got some killer deals on the hubs and a rear rim..... (my wheels will be Talon Hubs with black BEHR Rims 3.5 front 4.5 rear). They are at ECW.... just waiting for the front rim to come in (special order) and I will be good to go. :cry:

The DRZ model Talon front hub has tabs for the stock spedo drive so you are good in that department too. :cry:

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I've been looking through old threads about converting to S/M. Guess I'm just looking for some more input. I'm on a budget, aren't we all?? My S/M will be for street use, perhaps the odd track day, but no serious racing. I also want to be able to switch back to dirt setup when needed.

I've priced Excel rims with Talon hubs from Eastcoast. Also got a price for lacing stock hubs to Excel rims. Comes out about $150.00 cheaper. So first question is, is it worth going the extra for the Talon hubs? (I want to be able to use stock speedo if possible when new S/M gear is available, so other hubs are off my list)

I think I would go for a larger front disc and relocation bracket and stock rear disc. Is there anything available better value than the 320 EBC from Eastcoast ($175.00), and stock rear from Ron Ayers $127.00?

Will the stock 400S gearing work with the 17" wheels? I have 14/47 sprockets for dirt (although running 14/44 right now) and hoping to use the 15/44 stock without having to change the chain. Will this work?

So, am I missing anything other than screws/bolts to mount the discs and sprocket? Do the Excel/Talon use the stock axles, or do need new?

All comments welcome. Thanks in advance.

I got a 240mm Motomaster rear disc for about $90 from TT, which turns out to be a bit cheaper than the stock 220mm disc you quoted. If you can score an RM caliper carrier, you could swap the carrier with the wheels and have the larger disc for the SM setup. I found the stock rear brake to be inadequate for SM at a very small track. It might take a few extra minutes to swap the carriers, but I think it is worth it as I don't swap very often.

For the front brake, definitely go with the 320mm. The relocation bracket is only 4 bolts to take out and two to put the caliper back on. 3 minutes, tops. I found the front master cylinder and caliper to be too flimsy for any aggressive SM riding. If you have the cash, I recommend getting the Motomaster setup (or any brand of your choice), scoring a cheap sportbike master cylinder from ebay or a friend (I use a GSX-R1000 cylinder, Burned used a VTR1000F), and adding a stainess steel line to it. This way, you can swap the entire brake system without taking it apart. Just unbolt the perch, the line guides, and the caliper and the whole system will lift right off. Bolt the stock brake system up and it's ready for dirt action. It adds some time, but it's worth it to me.

As for the rotor and sprocket mounting bolts, since they are countersunk, they are hard to find. I got some higher quality sprocket bolts on ebay for about $5, which is cheaper than the OEM ones. The rotor bolts I have been unable to find and I had to get them from the dealer. They're $1 each over here and, to me, the bolts are very soft. I stripped one out and the ordered replacements all around. I was very careful with my wrenching this time around and made sure not to over torque them. I went to change my rear rotor and I could feel them wanting to strip out. Sure enough, when I checked the insides, there were little indentions from the hex wrench. I bought some Stainless bolts of the same size (not countersunk, though) and just as a test I wrenched on one as hard as I could without breaking my wrench and there was barely even a mark on it. Funny thing is that they were cheaper than the OEM bolts. OK, I'm done ranting about OEM rotor and sprocket mounting bolts.

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Spend the money for whatever SM gear you decide you want....and don't look back. My set-up was $1600 and some change from ECW, Money WELL spent. You WILL be better off by ordering the stuff assembled and ready to go.... :cry:

You already want to.....JUST DO IT!!!!! :cry:

My Garage has a lot of pics, and a long list of mods...check it out for some ideas....

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I've got burneds 440 for SM so I'm set for my street bike. My dirt machine has a plate too it's an 01 E. I'm going to have a MCCT by machinist put on it and a Yosh full ti with a medium insert and spark arrestor. This should work out good with the offroad set and be quiet enough I don't cause a lot of hard feelings. I might even get a medium for the street. I had a cop looking at me like he wanted to flip on the lights, the only thing that saved me was that long grey beard of mine. It pays to look like a mountain man sometimes. prairiedawg :cry:

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Great advice in this thread guys.... lets keep it goin..

I was seriously thinking about selling my '04 DRZ and getting a DRZ400SM.... this would be cool because it would be all done and would eliminate all the customizing.... then agian, it would suck because it would all be done and would eliminate all the customizing. :cry:

Anyways, I wam thinking about doing a setup where I can swap this stuff all out.... I need to figure out which would be the most cost effective though.... obviously the DRZ400SM is very tempting because it is already set up, swingarm, forks and all.

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Just got off the phone with the dealership... 400 bucks to reserve one of 3 DRZ400SM's they will be getting at the end of March or mid April.... two people already have black ones reserved.

Let see.. I paid about $5200 cash for my bike last june, I still owe about 4200 bucks on it. If I sell it for $4200 dollars I will need to come up with almost $2,000 dollars to get the DRZ400SM.

So in my twisted incorrect math I would be out about $3,000 dollars over the price of my blue DRZ... I dont know .. I bet I could buy one heck of a setup for 3 grand and still be dirt ready in half an hour.

Besides, I would love having an orginial bike.... a blue and white DRZ Moto would be killer.

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The only question unanswered I believe is gearing.My supermoto is DRZ440E

model,after boring.I use 14/41 gearing on street now,but am changing to 15/41 soon.I had to remove 2 links from chain.Lot of fun on street,but be

ready to be center of everyones attention,especially w/full yosh TI w/o insert :cry:

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I'm going through the same things now; I bought a plated 2001 DRZ400E so I could turn it into a Supermoto. I took Darrick's advice from the supermoto forum to get street tires & see how I like it. MY wife saw how much trouble I have changing tires and took pity on me: "Just buy the wheels already!" So I might.

Not surprisingly, the gearing is way off for the street. I need a suitable combo that will fit my endless chain. I have a lot of room to move back on the axle, but I don't know how much is reasonable.

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I figure that my deathwings are good enough street tires for now.... In the mud they make me wanna cry though,...

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The only question unanswered I believe is gearing.

If you use 14/47 as stock gearing I expect you have the same length of chain as I do, whatever the standard length was and it will be somewhere around 3 on the snail cams. If this is correct you will be able to use 14/44 if you want but this will be geared quite low with the 17" rear. You could also go to 15/44 quite happily if you don't mind changing the front sprocket as well. With a 15 front you could definitely manage a 43 rear sprocket, possibly a 42.

I used to run 14/47 dirt and 14/44 SM but my SM gearing is not the same as yours will be as I have an 18" rear wheel. I have just swapped to 15/47 and 15/44 as it looks like I will be using the bike for commuting and don't fancy reving the nuts off the engine all the time. All of these are without changing the chain length.

As for brakes, decide what is important to you. I use the bike for getting to work and dirt kicks at the weekend so ultimate road braking is not my priority. I want quick change over time so I stick with the same front sprocket and use standard discs. But even with standard discs and a braided front hose I can pull stoppies. If I was into SM racing obviously I would have gone a different route but I think that with a bigger disc you will probably reach the limits of the long front forks and end up wanting stiffer springs etc. Ask others about the effects of heavy braking with a big disc on the handling but I find the way the headlight ends up pointing at the ground 10 feet in front of the bike a little unerving, especially when riding at night. Then you might end up wanting 2 bikes - fine if you have the cash and the space.

There's lots of options out there, depending on what you want to achieve. Listen to everyones opinions but at the end ot the day it's your cash and your bike.

Good luck

Iain

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If you fit a 15 sprocket to an e you also have to remove the standard case protector to fit the sprocket. You can refit it once the sprocket is on but I had to file mine down a little to avoid the chain rollers rubbing against it. With an s there is no problem as they come with a 15 front as standard.

I'm assumimg of course that you have already junked the crud catcher (plastic front sprocket guard) but are still using the metal case saver. If you are using an alternative sprocket guard / case saver please ignore my ramblings.

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Thanks for the input guys. I guess I'll have to decide on how much work I want when swapping from dirt to S/M. If it's too much work, it won't happen much. As someone mentioned, it would be nice just to have another bike. Already have the V-Strom and the DRZ, so a third is out of the question.

I think is my biggest question now is what to do with the gearing. I really don't want to have to change chain, as well as sprockets. If only they would put another gear in there, but that's another thread.

Does anyone know what sprockets are being used on the factory S/M?

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JTM,

I use one chain for all the gearing I need. It is 2 links shorter than stock and it accomodates the following: 15/41, 15/44, 14/44, and 13/44. That is all the gearing I use. I think you could get away with 15/42 on the stock chain.

And regarding the EBC 280 mm disc vs. the 320 mm, It is actually easier to change over from the 320 mm disc. And the 320 works much better than the 280. I have both, save yourself the money on the 280.

Once you have complete set ups for both wheels, the swap is easy. The only extra step I take is swapping the front sprocket for dirt riding, either 14/44 or 13/44. It is a good reason to check the countershaft sprocket to make sure it is torqued. I use blue loctite on it, which works for me.

:cry:

Mike

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I wouldn't call my solution a SM maybe just a bit motarded.

I was not interested in making a SM or incurring big expense, but I wanted to improve the street handeling of my S, while retaining easy conversion to dual sport use.

My solution was to leave the stock gearing and stock rear wheel/tire....for me they seem to be 'ok' for street and passable for dirt roads but the front wheel/tire needed attention for both street and dual sport riding.

I had ECW lace a new stock front hub to an 2.15x18" excel rim. I probably should have gone to 19" but got some poor advice from the dealer regarding tire sizes, anyway, I have an Avon super venom tire and swap the stock brake rotor. The smaller wheel and much better tire is a vast improvement for street. The stock front brake is noticably better because of the greater swept area caused by the smaller wheel.

This Spring I'll get better front rubber mounter to my 21" wheel for dual use. Swapping the front wheels and remounting the rotor takes about 30 minutes.

It's not a SM conversion but is a big improvement for freeway and city riding.

I guess my advice if your are on a budget is to figure out what you are after and limit the modes to improve those areas. The DRZ is a neat bike in part because it is so flexible.

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